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SDBBQ's Double Indirect Setup - First Time

phswrestler125phswrestler125 Posts: 17
edited June 20 in EggHead Forum
I watch alot of "smoking dad BBQ" videos and have been very intrigued with his "double indirect" method. Like many have observed, it is hard to get that clean smoke with a kamado style grill due to the efficiency of the grill itself. In order for a kamado grill to stay low in temperature, then it requires restricted airflow, which results in a small burning fire which will smolder the wood chunks instead of cleanly burn it like what you have in an offset smoker. Smoking Dad BBQ has preached about the double indirect method, which allows him to burn a hotter fire in his kamado Joe, but still protect his meat from overcooking on the bottom.

I always wondered how would i replicate his double indirect method in my large BGE. The good thing is I already owned a CGS Spider, CGS Woo, 2x CGS half moon stones and CGS 2x1.5" ceramic spacers that i usually use to airgap my drain catch pan, so I decided to buy a 14" BGE Pizza stone to act as my 2nd deflector.

I started to draft up some diagrams on how to accomplish this. I came up with two configurations that I could do with the above setup:

1) Place 14" Pizza stone on the spider low inside the firering and the WOO w/ 2x half stones in its normal position

  • Creates a 1.75" air gap between the lower and upper ceramic stone deflectors







2) Place 14" Pizza stone on the spider low inside the firering, WOO w/ 2x half stones on top of 1.5" ceramic spacers (2" spacers flipped on their side)

  • Creates a 3.25" air gap between the lower and upper ceramic stone deflectors









-----------------------------------------------------


I wasn't sure which would be a better situation - either a 1.75" airgap with configuration (1) or a 3.25" airgap with configuration (2). I ultimately decided to do the 3.25" airgap with configuration (2) with some baby back (bbq foil wrap) and spare ribs (texas style). Following SDBBQ's method, i cooked the ribs using the "hot and fast method" to get better/cleaner smoke. Dome temperature ran between 290-305. I decided to wrap the loin-back ribs in foil with butter and honey, and decided to foil-boat the st louis ribs to get a nice bark and spritz the st louis ribs with honey/water (simple syrup) mixture.

Unfortunately, i was a little disappointed in the outcome of the cook - but this is mostly likely due to my errors, since this clearly works for SDBBQ. I also used a little too much wood i believe (SDBBQ uses a 95/5 charcoal to wood ratio). I used 2x hickory chucks on the bottom of my kick ash basket, 1x cherry in the middle of the lump, and 1x cherry in the bottom draft door for when the ashes fall through the bottom.  I believe the total cook time ended up being around 3 hrs (204 and floppy). The baby back ribs came out a little dry and crisp on the ends (could have been the meat itself - 4lbs slab from publix), and i burned the crap out of the bottom of the st louis ribs. I am not sure what happened, but i was hoping that running at 290-305 wouldn't burn the bottom of my ribs since i was using the double indirect method. I personally like the smoke flavor, but i think i could've dialed it back some - I'll think i'll just use a total of 2x wood chunks next time. But i am uncertain why i burned the bottom of my ribs - maybe i'll dial is back to 275-280 next time, but i am afraid I won't get the good cleaning burning fire that SDBBQ gets. I also wonder if the smaller airgap in configuration (1) would be a better setup for the double indirect method on the large BGE.

Anyone have any thoughts on the above ?


Here are some final pics of the ribs:






Marcus - Franklin, TN
Large BGE - CGS Woo & Spider

Comments

  • @unoriginalusername

    Any thoughts on which configuration (1 or 2) would be better? Also - any insight into why i would've bottom of my ribs were burnt ?

    Thank you for all of your youtube content! I'm going to keep trying to replicate your methods to find out which will work best with my large BGE setup.
    Marcus - Franklin, TN
    Large BGE - CGS Woo & Spider
  • littlerascal56littlerascal56 Posts: 1,634
    edited June 20
    You killed it man!  Those are some awesome looking ribs.
    I run mine at 265-270 at the grate temp, so you might try that next cook. 
  • I’ve seen the double indirect sdbbq does, but it starts with the slow roller on the bottom.  The convection properties of the slow roller is going to be a bit different than putting a pizza stone low in the firebox.

    You may have actually increased convection currents quite a bit with your setup. Kamados usually hold moisture well, but perhaps adding more air flow removes moisture at a higher rate.

    I do the air gapped drip pan foghorn described.   For briskets, I foil boat plus butcher paper.  The bottom isn’t burned, and my results are acceptable. 


  • lousubcaplousubcap Posts: 26,256
    I appreciate the detailed writeup and pursuit of the challenge @phswrestler125.  Also the other comments are insightful as well. 
    Regarding @Foghorn's approach, whatever works configuration-wise is the way to go.  I just go with a standard air-gapped 14" diameter drip pan on the platesetter and the brisket at the felt line.  Little to no air-flow restriction with that set-up.  I run cap down however, whenever I need to use a fire brick (about 2"x2" square) to initially get the brisket to fit, the cook does seem to run a bit quicker to support Foghorn's elevated radiant heat theory when high in the dome and reduced spacing around the heat deflector.  FWIW-
    Louisville; "indeterminate Jim" here.  Rolling smoke in the neighbourhood. # 38 for the win.  Life is too short for light/lite beer!
  • fishlessmanfishlessman Posts: 29,504
    i prefer a direct cook, raised rack as high as possible, and half a firebox of lump. 220 direct. maybe maximum distance to the low fire is key.
    fukahwee maine

    you can lead a fish to water but you can not make him drink it
  • I watch alot of "smoking dad BBQ" videos and have been very intrigued with his "double indirect" method. Like many have observed, it is hard to get that clean smoke with a kamado style grill due to the efficiency of the grill itself. In order for a kamado grill to stay low in temperature, then it requires restricted airflow, which results in a small burning fire which will smolder the wood chunks instead of cleanly burn it like what you have in an offset smoker. Smoking Dad BBQ has preached about the double indirect method, which allows him to burn a hotter fire in his kamado Joe, but still protect his meat from overcooking on the bottom.

    I always wondered how would i replicate his double indirect method in my large BGE. The good thing is I already owned a CGS Spider, CGS Woo, 2x CGS half moon stones and CGS 2x1.5" ceramic spacers that i usually use to airgap my drain catch pan, so I decided to buy a 14" BGE Pizza stone to act as my 2nd deflector.

    I started to draft up some diagrams on how to accomplish this. I came up with two configurations that I could do with the above setup:

    1) Place 14" Pizza stone on the spider low inside the firering and the WOO w/ 2x half stones in its normal position

    • Creates a 1.75" air gap between the lower and upper ceramic stone deflectors







    2) Place 14" Pizza stone on the spider low inside the firering, WOO w/ 2x half stones on top of 1.5" ceramic spacers (2" spacers flipped on their side)

    • Creates a 3.25" air gap between the lower and upper ceramic stone deflectors









    -----------------------------------------------------


    I wasn't sure which would be a better situation - either a 1.75" airgap with configuration (1) or a 3.25" airgap with configuration (2). I ultimately decided to do the 3.25" airgap with configuration (2) with some baby back (bbq foil wrap) and spare ribs (texas style). Following SDBBQ's method, i cooked the ribs using the "hot and fast method" to get better/cleaner smoke. Dome temperature ran between 290-305. I decided to wrap the loin-back ribs in foil with butter and honey, and decided to foil-boat the st louis ribs to get a nice bark and spritz the st louis ribs with honey/water (simple syrup) mixture.

    Unfortunately, i was a little disappointed in the outcome of the cook - but this is mostly likely due to my errors, since this clearly works for SDBBQ. I also used a little too much wood i believe (SDBBQ uses a 95/5 charcoal to wood ratio). I used 2x hickory chucks on the bottom of my kick ash basket, 1x cherry in the middle of the lump, and 1x cherry in the bottom draft door for when the ashes fall through the bottom.  I believe the total cook time ended up being around 3 hrs (204 and floppy). The baby back ribs came out a little dry and crisp on the ends (could have been the meat itself - 4lbs slab from publix), and i burned the crap out of the bottom of the st louis ribs. I am not sure what happened, but i was hoping that running at 290-305 wouldn't burn the bottom of my ribs since i was using the double indirect method. I personally like the smoke flavor, but i think i could've dialed it back some - I'll think i'll just use a total of 2x wood chunks next time. But i am uncertain why i burned the bottom of my ribs - maybe i'll dial is back to 275-280 next time, but i am afraid I won't get the good cleaning burning fire that SDBBQ gets. I also wonder if the smaller airgap in configuration (1) would be a better setup for the double indirect method on the large BGE.

    Anyone have any thoughts on the above ?


    Here are some final pics of the ribs:







    Some great details here, thanks for doing that.  I would lean to setup #2 since you've got more clearance from the stones for things like a drip pan and you're leveraging more radiant heat from the dome.  Being above the felt line helps on things like brisket where you want to render the fat cap (up) vs. being tucked down low in the dome but they both look good so its whatever is easier for you to setup and after playing with a few what you like the results of best.

    The ribs look amazing 

    Two Kamado Joe Classic III & a Kamado Joe Jr.  Large BGE, Mini BGE 
    YouTube: @smokingdadbbq 
    Instagram: @smokingdadbbq  

  • Good suggestion on the dome heat.  My grid thermometer sometimes reads 20°F different than the dome.  I wonder what a grid thermometer would show for this science experiment.
  • nolaeggheadnolaegghead Posts: 40,424
    You killed it man!  Those are some awesome looking ribs.
    I run mine at 265-270 at the grate temp, so you might try that next cook. 
    Way to go, Bob - completely avoid reading the words then drawing a warped conclusion based on pictures and ultimately adding nothing of value to the OP.  

    Par for the course.
    ______________________________________________
    I WORKED WITH ADULT (ENGINEERS) AT CORPORATE!!!!!
    WEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE!  GREATNESS!!!!!!!!!
  • The Cen-Tex SmokerThe Cen-Tex Smoker Posts: 22,227
    I will say that the best way I have found to get the cleanest smoke on a Kamado is Harry Solo’s method. Load about 1/4-1/3 of the firebox up with lump, add 2-3 wood chunks and cover with more unlit lump leaving some room for:

    Light a chimney of lump and pour over the top of the lump bed when ripping hot. Set temp and give it 30 min. 

    This will get the chunks smoking and the smoke will have to rise through the red hot lump at the top of the firebox. The red hot lump at the top will clean up the smoke as it rises through. 

    Enjoy. 
    Harry Soo. Damn autocorrect. 
    Keepin' It Weird in The ATX FBTX
  • littlerascal56littlerascal56 Posts: 1,634
    You killed it man!  Those are some awesome looking ribs.
    I run mine at 265-270 at the grate temp, so you might try that next cook. 
    Way to go, Bob - completely avoid reading the words then drawing a warped conclusion based on pictures and ultimately adding nothing of value to the OP.  

    Par for the course.
    Carey-for someone that has an email address [email protected]….. you might want to seek professional help.  Perhaps that was part of the issue why Bridget left?  Just sayin’
  • BotchBotch Posts: 12,932
    I will say that the best way I have found to get the cleanest smoke on a Kamado is Harry Solo’s method. Load about 1/4-1/3 of the firebox up with lump, add 2-3 wood chunks and cover with more unlit lump leaving some room for:

    Light a chimney of lump and pour over the top of the lump bed when ripping hot. Set temp and give it 30 min. 

    This will get the chunks smoking and the smoke will have to rise through the red hot lump at the top of the firebox. The red hot lump at the top will clean up the smoke as it rises through. 
    I remember when you originally posted that.  My problem was the hardwood would always catch fire and be burned out before I got to temp, I think hardwood ignition temp must be much lower than that of lump.  
    Now I light just lump, let it get to temp, throw on the protein/veg, and then slide small pieces of hardwood in through the bottom vent, to the center of the Egg (think I made a post with pics).  The hardwood smoke starts pouring out just as the protein starts cooking.  
    ____________________________________________

    Don't be afraid; the clown is afraid too.  

    Ogden, Utard.  
  • nolaeggheadnolaegghead Posts: 40,424
    You killed it man!  Those are some awesome looking ribs.
    I run mine at 265-270 at the grate temp, so you might try that next cook. 
    Way to go, Bob - completely avoid reading the words then drawing a warped conclusion based on pictures and ultimately adding nothing of value to the OP.  

    Par for the course.
    Carey-for someone that has an email address [email protected]….. you might want to seek professional help.  Perhaps that was part of the issue why Bridget left?  Just sayin’
    Spitballing looks pretty bad when everyone else is more informed than you are.  I knew there was a reason I hated one legged half deaf thrice bankrupted white nationalists.  Literally, just sayin’
    ______________________________________________
    I WORKED WITH ADULT (ENGINEERS) AT CORPORATE!!!!!
    WEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE!  GREATNESS!!!!!!!!!
  • The Cen-Tex SmokerThe Cen-Tex Smoker Posts: 22,227
    Botch said:
    I will say that the best way I have found to get the cleanest smoke on a Kamado is Harry Solo’s method. Load about 1/4-1/3 of the firebox up with lump, add 2-3 wood chunks and cover with more unlit lump leaving some room for:

    Light a chimney of lump and pour over the top of the lump bed when ripping hot. Set temp and give it 30 min. 

    This will get the chunks smoking and the smoke will have to rise through the red hot lump at the top of the firebox. The red hot lump at the top will clean up the smoke as it rises through. 
    I remember when you originally posted that.  My problem was the hardwood would always catch fire and be burned out before I got to temp, I think hardwood ignition temp must be much lower than that of lump.  
    Now I light just lump, let it get to temp, throw on the protein/veg, and then slide small pieces of hardwood in through the bottom vent, to the center of the Egg (think I made a post with pics).  The hardwood smoke starts pouring out just as the protein starts cooking.  
    Put the chunks lower. You can even put them on the fire grate and pour lump on top of that. 
    Keepin' It Weird in The ATX FBTX
  • fishlessmanfishlessman Posts: 29,504
    Botch said:
    I will say that the best way I have found to get the cleanest smoke on a Kamado is Harry Solo’s method. Load about 1/4-1/3 of the firebox up with lump, add 2-3 wood chunks and cover with more unlit lump leaving some room for:

    Light a chimney of lump and pour over the top of the lump bed when ripping hot. Set temp and give it 30 min. 

    This will get the chunks smoking and the smoke will have to rise through the red hot lump at the top of the firebox. The red hot lump at the top will clean up the smoke as it rises through. 
    I remember when you originally posted that.  My problem was the hardwood would always catch fire and be burned out before I got to temp, I think hardwood ignition temp must be much lower than that of lump.  
    Now I light just lump, let it get to temp, throw on the protein/veg, and then slide small pieces of hardwood in through the bottom vent, to the center of the Egg (think I made a post with pics).  The hardwood smoke starts pouring out just as the protein starts cooking.  
    Put the chunks lower. You can even put them on the fire grate and pour lump on top of that. 

    botch is putting the smoking wood under the fire grate,  works especially well in a mini where there is only so much lump space
    fukahwee maine

    you can lead a fish to water but you can not make him drink it
  • botch is putting the smoking wood under the fire grate,  works especially well in a mini where there is only so much lump space

    As in putting the wood through the bottom air draft door, correct ? So when burning coal fall through, it ignites the wood
    Marcus - Franklin, TN
    Large BGE - CGS Woo & Spider
  • lkapigianlkapigian Posts: 8,961
    botch is putting the smoking wood under the fire grate,  works especially well in a mini where there is only so much lump space

    As in putting the wood through the bottom air draft door, correct ? So when burning coal fall through, it ignites the wood
    yes ,just like a gravity feed
    Visalia, Ca

    LGBE- Pit's by Klose Trailer -Stumps XL Stretch - Custom Santa Maria- FatStack Smoker FS120 coming soon FatStack 500- Blackstone 36 Blackstone 22 - Custom Cold Smoke House and a lonely Brinkman Vertical Smoker

  • The Cen-Tex SmokerThe Cen-Tex Smoker Posts: 22,227
    I do not put wood in the draft door. It’s just low in the firebox under a bunch of lump. It never ignites, just smokes. It actually turns into lump
    Keepin' It Weird in The ATX FBTX
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