Do you buy the same make car/truck and new or used? Diversion topic-

frazzdaddy

Botch said:

fishlessman said:
its when after the salesman hands you a 3rd offer you get turned over to the next guy up. ive had the next guy up give me a higher offer after spending a good hour with the first guy

Heh, sounds like trying to renew SiriusXM (which I've only done once, prepped by my co-workers).  The only bright point about my CC number being compromised last spring (by a shoe sale in Rio de Janeiro) is that Sirius didn't have my new CC number, so I was able to write them a letter, not call their "Cancel" number, and tell them "If you can offer me another year for $99, then give me that offer; otherwise, Cancel".  I'm still awaiting their answer.  
 
@frazzdaddy stated "There are some good things to be had when the price is the price. "  I learned two years ago that "the price is the price" is also squishy.  Late summer 2018 I visited the Farmington MB dealership, and they had a '17 E-Series on the floor that hadn't been sold, it was beautiful, and the salesman firmly stated "We don't bicker on price, it is what it is, to make negotiations less stressful."  I test-drove it, great acceleration but a very boaty road-feel.  
Next day I test-drove my Audi, smaller engine but it felt SOO much better on the road, and I learned it had on-the-fly suspension settings, I really enjoyed "Sport".  I called the salesman at MB, learned yes, the E-Series had variable suspension, but no, he didn't remember what I had been driving it in.  Got a second test-drive of the MB, in "Sport" mode, but it still drove like my Dad's Pontiac Catalina 400; I mentioned the Audi to the MB salesman.  
 
I bought that Audi three days later; during that time, the MB salesman left me three messages, pleading for me to come back down to his dealership, he could cut me some price advantages...  Granted, it was a late-model they wanted to clear, but the "price is the price" was out the window at that time.  FWIW.  

Clearly the "price wasn't the price" at that time and a very poor sales rep. The fact that he let you walk without knowing what you wanted out of a car tells me all I need to know about your experience. If you don't know what your client needs/wants any sale you make is an accident. Even I know that and I'm a mechanic

ColbyLang

I buy new. Wife’s and mine. Every 6-7 years. Try to keep them under 70,000 miles for a “decent” trade value. 

We know the family that owns the dealership very well. I grew up with the kids. My truck (2017 GMC Sierra Denali 4x4) was purchased 18% off of sticker. They deal in 9 different brands. Easy to find something you want when they basically sell it all. 

That being said, my next truck will be another F-150. The GMC is nice, but not as nice as the Ford IMO

QDude

Mickey said:

YukonRon said:

I am in the market for two vehicles. No idea as yet what or where from. Need safety, off road clearance, durability, and long haul towing and comfort. Doing research now for our future. Suggestions appreciated, insight is needed.

My suggestion is to look at Toyota and Subaru. 

I agree.  The Tundra has been consistently rated the highest by Consumer Reports for years.  If you need more than a 1/2 ton, I'm not sure what to recommend.  The annual Consumer Report magazine on vehicle ratings should be available now.

JohnEggGio

Just thought I'd share a photo of my current ride.  I have some work to do later.

Foghorn

I haven't bought a car for me since 1988 when I got a 1983 Honda Accord hatchback.  Since then I've just taken hand-me-downs from SWMBO. 

1990 Corolla.  
1996 Volvo 850 wagon.
2002 Toyota Sienna van
1993 Honda Del Sol

I was shopping for something relative new about 2 years ago.  Went to the dealer to buy a gently used Toyota Highlander but as I test-drove it the transmission acted up in a way that I had read about on the internet so I decided to re-direct and was thinking about a 4Runner.

Then a good friend offered me a 2010 Ford Taurus with only 38,000 miles and hail damage - for $6000 (he had already taken the insurance check for the hail damage).

He let me just drive it for a while.  It's not what I would have bought in the open market, but it's a good car and I couldn't turn it down at that price.  It saved me about $25k compared to a gently used 4Runner and serves my purposes well.

When I recently informed his that after owning it for 22 months I had rolled the odometer over 50k he yelled at me "I wouldn't have sold it to you if I had known you were going to abuse it like that."  

stlcharcoal

Had a 2005, 2006, and 2010 Ford Explorer until they changed the body style and made it too small to hold what I needed.  Replaced with a 2013 Expedition EL, another 2013, and 2016......until they changed the body style to look like the Explorer.  Unless the Excursion comes back, I'm bailing on Ford and getting one of the new Yukon XL's with the diesel......20% more room inside for the same size truck.

1voyager

Two new Mercedes every 8 - 10 years plus a "toy". This time the toy is a 2013 Mini Cooper S hatchback.

Buying the Mini was the worst negation ever. It took over two hours back-and-forth. The primary focus from the sales person's perspective was whether we would finance or lease. I told him that I hadn't decided yet. 

When we finally reached an acceptable price, I gave him a check for the entire amount. The salesperson was shocked and told me that he couldn't sell it to me for cash at that price. The car had to be financed or leased. He summoned the sales manager to close the deal with "special " financing. "We negotiated in good faith", he said. Blah, blah, blah. "We just can't do it."

My response? I stood up and headed for the door, turned and yelled "do you want to sell the f---ing car or not?" They agreed to the deal.

alaskanassasin

@Foghorn I like your style

frazzdaddy

1voyager said:

Two new Mercedes every 8 - 10 years plus a "toy". This time the toy is a 2013 Mini Cooper S hatchback.

Buying the Mini was the worst negation ever. It took over two hours back-and-forth. The primary focus from the sales person's perspective was whether we would finance or lease. I told him that I hadn't decided yet. 

When we finally reached an acceptable price, I gave him a check for the entire amount. The salesperson was shocked and told me that he couldn't sell it to me for cash at that price. The car had to be financed or leased. He summoned the sales manager to close the deal with "special " financing. "We negotiated in good faith", he said. Blah, blah, blah. "We just can't do it."

My response? I stood up and headed for the door, turned and yelled "do you want to sell the f---ing car or not?" They agreed to the deal.

Well done sir. 

Legume

@YukonRon I have read that for towing at highway speed, the naturally aspirated v8s are more efficient than the turbos, like the Ford ecoboost.  I only have experience with the Ford 3.5 eco in a full size truck and the value there is in torque for hills and acceleration and the sweet spot for efficiency seems to be 50-60, maybe 65 mph.  70+ and mpg drops off considerably.  But it will climb a wall.

alaskanassasin

@Foghorn you probably have a paid for house and a retirement that would impress Daddy Warbucks.

northGAcock

JohnEggGio said:

Just thought I'd share a photo of my current ride.  I have some work to do later.

Love the two tone look. You purchase it that way or do it yourself?

Foghorn

alaskanassasin said:

@Foghorn you probably have a paid for house and a retirement that would impress Daddy Warbucks.

@alaskanassasin, we paid off two houses (first home that we kept as a rental and "forever home") simultaneously a few years ago.  Then we sold the rental home and used that for a down payment for 1 of 2 beach condos that we purchased.  So now we have two mortgages again - but it's all being done in a way that increases net worth.

I've taken my family on some great vacations with the highlights being 2 world cups - South Africa in 2010 and Brazil in 2014.  On both trips I made it clear to my kids that the only reason we could afford to do it was BECAUSE I drove hand-me-down cars.  

I come by it honestly.  My dad sold used cars before he spent the last 25 years of his working life at the post office.  He never graduated from high school but he had some pretty good insight into financial things.

One observation he made was that the worst thing that ever happened to piano sales was the invention of the automobile.  

Once you could park your status symbol in your garage or driveway, you no longer had to put a piano in your front window to try to convince the neighbors that you had money.  Seems crazy but I think it is largely true.

TideEggHead

Legume said:

@YukonRon I have read that for towing at highway speed, the naturally aspirated v8s are more efficient than the turbos, like the Ford ecoboost.  I only have experience with the Ford 3.5 eco in a full size truck and the value there is in torque for hills and acceleration and the sweet spot for efficiency seems to be 50-60, maybe 65 mph.  70+ and mpg drops off considerably.  But it will climb a wall.

I get between 15.5 and 16 towing our camper that is about 3k with gear. Tundra 5.7liter running 65-70 mph. Not sure if that helps or not.

GrateEggspectations

Foghorn said:

alaskanassasin said:

@Foghorn you probably have a paid for house and a retirement that would impress Daddy Warbucks.

@alaskanassasin, we paid off two houses (first home that we kept as a rental and "forever home") simultaneously a few years ago.  Then we sold the rental home and used that for a down payment for 1 of 2 beach condos that we purchased.  So now we have two mortgages again - but it's all being done in a way that increases net worth.

I've taken my family on some great vacations with the highlights being 2 world cups - South Africa in 2010 and Brazil in 2014.  On both trips I made it clear to my kids that the only reason we could afford to do it was BECAUSE I drove hand-me-down cars.  

I come by it honestly.  My dad sold used cars before he spent the last 25 years of his working life at the post office.  He never graduated from high school but he had some pretty good insight into financial things.

One observation he made was that the worst thing that ever happened to piano sales was the invention of the automobile.  

Once you could park your status symbol in your garage or driveway, you no longer had to put a piano in your front window to try to convince the neighbors that you had money.  Seems crazy but I think it is largely true.

Really interesting comment re: piano sales. Never knew. In truth, because my wife is a working pianist and we’ve always had a nice piano, I’ve never really thought about it as a status symbol - though I know it can have that connotation. That being said, it’s true that it seems there are far more grands in the windows of some big homes around us than there are number of serious players in the general pop. Gonna share that tidbit with my wife. Thanks. 

(Edit: Just remembering that a neighbour of mine in a very nice, new and substantial home was looking to buy a baby grand for his front window. No one in the family plays.)

YukonRon

Legume said:

@YukonRon I have read that for towing at highway speed, the naturally aspirated v8s are more efficient than the turbos, like the Ford ecoboost.  I only have experience with the Ford 3.5 eco in a full size truck and the value there is in torque for hills and acceleration and the sweet spot for efficiency seems to be 50-60, maybe 65 mph.  70+ and mpg drops off considerably.  But it will climb a wall.

Thank you for the insight, I do need a wall climber too. We are taking our time, and want to make a solid decision as I like keeping vehicles for a very long time. I have an old '97 Expedition I kept and still use, which I am selling/donating.

I try to make vehicle investments carefully as I hate investing money in depreciating assets, so if I get 20+ years out of it, I do not feel as bad.

YukonRon

TideEggHead said:

Legume said:

@YukonRon I have read that for towing at highway speed, the naturally aspirated v8s are more efficient than the turbos, like the Ford ecoboost.  I only have experience with the Ford 3.5 eco in a full size truck and the value there is in torque for hills and acceleration and the sweet spot for efficiency seems to be 50-60, maybe 65 mph.  70+ and mpg drops off considerably.  But it will climb a wall.

I get between 15.5 and 16 towing our camper that is about 3k with gear. Tundra 5.7liter running 65-70 mph. Not sure if that helps or not.

It certainly does.

The oral surgeon that lives across the street from me loves his Tacoma with the full size double cab and long bed. He pulls a 4-6 person, high profile ultralite, which is about where I want to be.

He is moving to Durango, and, like Suzy and I, have spent a lot of time in Colorado. I will say, I have seen Tacoma, Subaru and Jeep mostly out there, as they seem to be the vehicles of choice.

I appreciate the insight.

Legume

YukonRon said:

TideEggHead said:

Legume said:

@YukonRon I have read that for towing at highway speed, the naturally aspirated v8s are more efficient than the turbos, like the Ford ecoboost.  I only have experience with the Ford 3.5 eco in a full size truck and the value there is in torque for hills and acceleration and the sweet spot for efficiency seems to be 50-60, maybe 65 mph.  70+ and mpg drops off considerably.  But it will climb a wall.

I get between 15.5 and 16 towing our camper that is about 3k with gear. Tundra 5.7liter running 65-70 mph. Not sure if that helps or not.

It certainly does.

The oral surgeon that lives across the street from me loves his Tacoma with the full size double cab and long bed. He pulls a 4-6 person, high profile ultralite, which is about where I want to be.

He is moving to Durango, and, like Suzy and I, have spent a lot of time in Colorado. I will say, I have seen Tacoma, Subaru and Jeep mostly out there, as they seem to be the vehicles of choice.

I appreciate the insight.

Ask what his mileage is pulling that trailer with the Tacoma, probably similar to the Tundra v8, but better when not towing.

QDude

YukonRon said:

TideEggHead said:

Legume said:

@YukonRon I have read that for towing at highway speed, the naturally aspirated v8s are more efficient than the turbos, like the Ford ecoboost.  I only have experience with the Ford 3.5 eco in a full size truck and the value there is in torque for hills and acceleration and the sweet spot for efficiency seems to be 50-60, maybe 65 mph.  70+ and mpg drops off considerably.  But it will climb a wall.

I get between 15.5 and 16 towing our camper that is about 3k with gear. Tundra 5.7liter running 65-70 mph. Not sure if that helps or not.

It certainly does.

The oral surgeon that lives across the street from me loves his Tacoma with the full size double cab and long bed. He pulls a 4-6 person, high profile ultralite, which is about where I want to be.

He is moving to Durango, and, like Suzy and I, have spent a lot of time in Colorado. I will say, I have seen Tacoma, Subaru and Jeep mostly out there, as they seem to be the vehicles of choice.

I appreciate the insight.

Neither the Tundra nor the Tacoma get good gas mileage when towing.  I have a 4,500 pound travel trailer and it gets 9-10 mpg here in Colorado.  Just make sure you get a vehicle that won't struggle going up the passes.  Before my 18 Tundra with the 5.7L engine, I had an 07 Tundra with the 4.7L engine and it struggled mightily going up in the mountains.  The Tacoma may not be enough of a truck depending on the weight of your trailer.  It is always better to have more truck than what is needed.

nolaegghead

Ron, if you want a beast that will tow anything up a mountain and run forever, you should look at the 2500 Ram with the Cummings diesel.  If you want to buy used, some years are better than others.  I read the 2014 is good.

shtgunal3

nolaegghead said:

Ron, if you want a beast that will tow anything up a mountain and run forever, you should look at the 2500 Ram with the Cummings diesel.  If you want to buy used, some years are better than others.  I read the 2014 is good.

I have a 2014 2500 Ram with the Cummins. It’s a beast. Pulls my 6500 pound travel trailer with ease.

shtgunal3

alaskanassasin

Nice truck.

shtgunal3

Thank you sir

BigreenGreg

First car was a 72 Dodge Charger-440, next car was 69 Camaro-427. Realized I couldn’t afford lawyers and tickets moved to Toyota 4x4 trucks in 1986 until 2001. Bought a Tahoe 4x4, still have it. Recently picked up a GT Mustang now that Ive gotten a little more self control.

texaswig

I've only had one new car. Never again. We now have 4 cars. 1996 2 door 2 wheel drive tahoe. 1987 4runner.2003 Honda crv. And the murder van 2002 E350. The Honda gets driven the most. It only has 130k miles. When it wears out I'll find my wife something around 10 or 15 years old that's been babied for 4 or 5 grand. Thankfully she's not picky. 

1voyager

BigreenGreg said:

First car was a 72 Dodge Charger-440, next car was 69 Camaro-427. Realized I couldn’t afford lawyers and tickets moved to Toyota 4x4 trucks in 1986 until 2001. Bought a Tahoe 4x4, still have it. Recently picked up a GT Mustang now that Ive gotten a little more self control.

WOW! Muscle cars to the max!

Corv

The Tundra was new and the Prius was used. Both are well-depreciated and completely paid for. Both run just fine, although I did replace the traction battery in the Prius last year.

I'd sort of like to get an electric car but the numbers just aren't there. If I didn't have the Prius it would be a no-brainer.

And I'd like to get a more efficient truck, but it gets used so rarely that I have to remember to go drive it before the battery dies again. The numbers don't work for replacing it, either.

dbCooper

BigreenGreg said:

First car was a 72 Dodge Charger-440, next car was 69 Camaro-427. Realized I couldn’t afford lawyers and tickets moved to Toyota 4x4 trucks in 1986 until 2001. Bought a Tahoe 4x4, still have it. Recently picked up a GT Mustang now that Ive gotten a little more self control.

That Camaro, a true C.O.P.O. car or someone swapped in the 427?    A 69 that was born with a 427 is quite the rare beast, something like only 100 made.

nolaegghead

We all love and pine for the old '60s and '70s muscle cars.  But despite the massive displacement and big block hype, they don't hold a candle to more modern muscle cars, or sports/sporty cars.  Advertised HP was "gross HP", measured with an engine on a test stand with no air filter or accessories.  Today it is "net HP", measured on a dynamometer at the rear wheels. 

Good read on this here.

https://www.hagerty.com/media/archived/horsepower/