Jan 6 Hearings

WildmanWilson

JohnInCarolina said:

Sad to say that I really don’t expect anyone whose last name is “Trump” to pay any kind of a price for any of this.  They have him dead to rights six ways to Sunday, but my expectations of justice are very low.  It’s depressing.

You mean the way they had him in the Russiagate fiasco? The one that cost millions to run and was proven to be fake and made up. All I heard was you guys saying they had him and he was going to prison. LOL.  You want to know about justice? Then ask why Hillary and others are not in jail. You libs are blind with Trump hate and believe everything because you want it to be true so badly. Even with a totally one sided circus you still believe their made up garbage. You people will never learn. You don't want justice, you want to win...regardless if its true.

 

fishlessman

i always lean towards the moderate right but always test out to the left.

Economic Left/Right: -3.13
Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: -3.23

JohnInCarolina

WildmanWilson said:

JohnInCarolina said:

Sad to say that I really don’t expect anyone whose last name is “Trump” to pay any kind of a price for any of this.  They have him dead to rights six ways to Sunday, but my expectations of justice are very low.  It’s depressing.

You mean the way they had him in the Russiagate fiasco? The one that cost millions to run and was proven to be fake and made up. All I heard was you guys saying they had him and he was going to prison. LOL.  You want to know about justice? Then ask why Hillary and others are not in jail. You libs are blind with Trump hate and believe everything because you want it to be true so badly. Even with a totally one sided circus you still believe their made up garbage. You people will never learn. You don't want justice, you want to win...regardless if its true.

 

What are your thoughts on 9/11?  Do you think it was an inside job?  I’m just curious.

Buckwoody Egger

paqman said:

Is it just me or is this starting to sound like a movie plot?

Possibly a prequel to this….
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Designated_Survivor_(TV_series)

WildmanWilson

JohnInCarolina said:

WildmanWilson said:

JohnInCarolina said:

Sad to say that I really don’t expect anyone whose last name is “Trump” to pay any kind of a price for any of this.  They have him dead to rights six ways to Sunday, but my expectations of justice are very low.  It’s depressing.

You mean the way they had him in the Russiagate fiasco? The one that cost millions to run and was proven to be fake and made up. All I heard was you guys saying they had him and he was going to prison. LOL.  You want to know about justice? Then ask why Hillary and others are not in jail. You libs are blind with Trump hate and believe everything because you want it to be true so badly. Even with a totally one sided circus you still believe their made up garbage. You people will never learn. You don't want justice, you want to win...regardless if its true.

 

What are your thoughts on 9/11?  Do you think it was an inside job?  I’m just curious.

I think it was carried out by radial Terrorists that hate America. Not sure what that has to do with the hoax Russiagate. It is something that all of you now know was a proven lie. Or do you still think it happened? If that alone doesn't prove Trump has been under a witch hunt by the dems I don't see any hope for you.

HeavyG

Radial tire-ists hate America???

Does jet fuel melt steel beams?

JohnInCarolina

Those darn radial terrorists!  Not to be confused with the circumferential ones! 

fishlessman

i guess he was not joking

lousubcap

A few cocktails on a Friday night but given the times and the hearings I thought the following was accurate relative to 1/6:
"To make a Democrat angry tell them a lie. To make a Republican angry tell them the truth...
And the beat goes on!

HeavyG

https://twitter.com/JewishResister/status/1548816396640993280

lousubcap

Prime time Thursday.  Get your popcorn.  

littlerascal56

What a time for all the stores to run out of popcorn!  Another “shortage” to deal with😂🥹

Botch

Today a local was given a 20-year sentence for setting a dog on fire, which had to be put down.  This sounds fair to me.
Jury selection began today for Steve Bannon.  If he's found guilty on both accounts (if I heard correctly just now) he will serve a total of 60 days, unless his two sentences are served concurrently.  For knowing about, and fomenting, an attempted overthrow of our Government.  
I don't get it anymore.  

Legume

littlerascal56 said:

What a time for all the stores to run out of popcorn!  Another “shortage” to deal with😂🥹

It’s too bad, I’m sure you haven’t watched any of this live, have you?  Probably just whatever clips and out of context commentary from Tucker you get on Fox?  Tell me I’m wrong.

Here’s the um-memed version of the cartoon from 2019.  

You see, the Jan 6 cmte hearings don’t have a judge, a defense, etc., it’s not actually a trial.  You should do some research before you just post something.

The Cen-Tex Smoker

Legume said:

littlerascal56 said:

What a time for all the stores to run out of popcorn!  Another “shortage” to deal with😂🥹

It’s too bad, I’m sure you haven’t watched any of this live, have you?  Probably just whatever clips and out of context commentary from Tucker you get on Fox?  Tell me I’m wrong.

Here’s the um-memed version of the cartoon from 2019.  

You see, the Jan 6 cmte hearings don’t have a judge, a defense, etc., it’s not actually a trial.  You should do some research before you just post something.

I believe “post” should be in parentheses. 

JohnInCarolina

http://twitter.com/OliviaTroye/status/1549500234715234305?s=20&t=pHQwvqBlrLfyaJvn44KILw

It’s a fair question.  The person asking it is a former staffer for Mike Pence, that well known leftist.

fishlessman

it didnt matter to the left then, why should it matter now?

fishlessman

the secret service just wiped them clean

lousubcap

Bowers receives censure for Jan 6 hearing testimony.  
"You can't handle the truth, AZ GOP."
https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2022/jul/20/rusty-bowers-arizona-republican-censured-jan-6-testimony

lousubcap

The teaser for tonight's hearing:
"J6 IN PRIMETIME TONIGHT: ‘TRUMP REFUSED TO ACT’ — The eighth public hearing of the Jan. 6 committee, though likely not the last, begins tonight at 8 p.m. Eastern. It’s expected to go on for about two hours and will focus on what DONALD TRUMP did — or refused to do — for 187 minutes at the White House after his speech at the Ellipse and before he finally asked rioters to leave the Capitol.

“The story we’re going to tell,” a committee aide said, “is that in that time, President Trump refused to act to defend the Capitol as a violent mob stormed” it.

Two in-person witnesses will appear: MATTHEW POTTINGER, Trump’s deputy national security adviser at the time of the insurrection, and SARAH MATTHEWS , Trump’s deputy press secretary. Both resigned in disgust after witnessing Trump’s inaction and indifference during those notorious three hours and seven minutes.

Stepping into the spotlight tonight to co-lead the proceedings with the more well-known Rep. ADAM KINZINGER (R-Ill.) will be Rep. ELAINE LURIA (D-Va.), a 20-year Navy veteran elected in 2018. Nicholas Wu caught up with Luria on Wednesday, and emailed Playbook these highlights from their conversation:

— The topline: Luria said that the hearing “is going to show how that played out — the last-ditch attempt, after all other efforts within this plan had failed … to stop the certification of election results to keep Trump in office.”

— The visuals: She said the committee would use “news coverage,” among other visuals, to show what people outside the Capitol — including the TV-loving president — knew about what was going on at the time. “When we're talking about the 187 minutes,” she said, “I think it's important to anchor like, what were people seeing? What did people who are not here at the Capitol know about what's going on at the time?”

— The future: “They failed at overturning the results of the 2020 election. But in many ways, they were successful in quite a few of their objectives,” Luria said of Trump and his allies, who she accused of spreading disinformation and undermining faith in the electoral system. “If we look at the purpose of the committee, which is to provide recommendations, essentially, it will prevent something like this from happening in the future.”

“The protesters were forced out of the Capitol, the work of Congress went on, we certified the election results,” Luria said. “But, like, what about next time?”

Luria thought an examination of the law enforcement response on Jan. 6, while not a focus of Thursday’s hearing, could be a “bridge” to the final stage of their investigation, where the select panel would still continue to learn more while working to put out the “ultimate purpose and product from the committee, which would be [a] report and recommendations.” "

Can't wait!

lousubcap

And another teaser:
"The Jan. 6 committee has in its possession video outtakes of Trump’s message to his supporters the day after the attack. The panel is expected to show clips of the outtakes during today’s public hearing, according to sources familiar with the matter. The outtakes show that over the course of an hour trying to tape the message, Trump resisted holding the attackers to account, tried to call them patriots, and refused to say the election was over. Amy Gardner, Josh Dawsey and Paul Kane report for the Washington Post. "

JohnInCarolina

http://twitter.com/protctdemocracy/status/1550106186279788544?s=20&t=Xjjo4h-F-AJS1GRUF7F2Xg

lousubcap

^^^^ That should be required reading for every voting age citizen of this country.  

Buckwoody Egger

NY Times article …

We Are Retired Generals and Admirals. Trump’s Actions on Jan. 6 Were a Dereliction of Duty.

July 21, 2022

Joseph Prezioso/Getty Images 

By Steve Abbot, Peter Chiarelli, John Jumper, James Loy, John Nathman, William Owens and Johnnie Wilson

Admirals Abbot, Loy, Nathman and Owens and Generals Chiarelli, Jumper and Wilson are retired four-star generals and admirals in the U.S. armed forces.

The inquiry by the House’s Jan. 6 committee has produced many startling findings, but none to us more alarming than the fact that while rioters tried to thwart the peaceful transfer of power and ransacked the Capitol on Jan. 6, 2021, the president and commander in chief, Donald Trump, abdicated his duty to preserve, protect and defend the Constitution.

In the weeks leading up to that terrible day, allies of Mr. Trump also urged him to hold on to power by unlawfully ordering the military to seize voting machines and supervise a do-over of the election. Such an illegal order would have imperiled a foundational precept of American democracy: civilian control of the military.

Americans may take it for granted, but the strength of our democracy rests upon the stability of this arrangement, which requires both civilian and military leaders to have confidence that they have the same goal of supporting and defending the Constitution.

We hope that the country will never face such a crisis again. But to safeguard our constitutional order, military leaders must be ready for similar situations in which the chain of command appears unclear or the legality of orders uncertain.

The relationship between America’s civilian leadership and its military is structured by an established chain of command: from unit leaders through various commanders and generals and up to the secretary of defense and the president. Civilian authorities have the constitutional and legal right and responsibility to decide whether to use military force. As military officers, we had the duty to provide candid, expert advice on how to use such force and then to obey all lawful orders, whether we agreed or not.

The events of Jan. 6 offer a demonstration on how military and civilian leaders execute this relationship and what happens when it comes under threat. When a mob attacked the Capitol, the commander in chief failed to act to restore order and even encouraged the rioters. As Gen. Mark Milley, chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, testified to Congress, Vice President Mike Pence attempted to fill the void by calling on the National Guard to intervene.

Given the urgent need to secure the Capitol, Mr. Pence’s request was reasonable. Yet the vice president has no role in the chain of command unless specifically acting under the president’s authority because of illness or incapacitation, and therefore cannot lawfully issue orders to the military. Members of Congress, who also pleaded for military assistance as the mob laid siege to the Capitol, are in the same category. In the end, the National Guard deployed not in response to those pleas but under lawful orders issued by the acting secretary of defense, Christopher Miller.

Should civilians atop the chain of command again abandon their duties or attempt to abuse their authority, military ranks can and must respond in accordance with their oaths — without a lawful order from appropriate command authority, they cannot unilaterally undertake a mission. Concurrent with a duty to obey all lawful orders is a duty to question and disobey unlawful orders — those a person “of ordinary sense and understanding,” as a Court of Military Review ruling put it, would know to be wrong.

Operations on U.S. soil must also specifically comply with the Standing Rules for the Use of Force, which limit use of force but explicitly authorize it to protect people from imminent threat of death or serious harm, to defend “assets vital to national security” and “to prevent the sabotage of a national critical infrastructure.”

These are essential checks on civilian officials who would make unlawful use of U.S. military personnel. Governors, who possess broad command authority over our 54 National Guard organizations, for example, may face political pressure to deploy these forces to illegally interfere with elections or other democratic processes.

To recognize these threats to our democracy, military leaders must continue to develop robust training, guidance and resources for service members in accordance with these safeguards, ensuring the integrity of the chain of command and effective operation of civil-military relations.

But while such preparedness is necessary, it is not sufficient.

We each took an oath as former leaders of the armed forces to “support and defend the Constitution of the United States against all enemies, foreign and domestic.” We fulfilled that oath through service to civilian leadership elected by and accountable to the American people. This essential arrangement, however, is not self-executing; it relies on civilian leaders equally committed to protecting and defending the Constitution — including, most important, the commander in chief.

The principle of civilian control of the military predates the founding of the Republic. In 1775, George Washington was commissioned as the military commander of the Continental Army under the civilian command authority of the Second Continental Congress. The next year, among the grievances listed in the Declaration of Independence against King George III was his making “the military independent of and superior to the civil power.”

The president’s dereliction of duty on Jan. 6 tested the integrity of this historic principle as never before, endangering American lives and our democracy.

The lesson of that day is clear. Our democracy is not a given. To preserve it, Americans must demand nothing less from their leaders than an unassailable commitment to country over party — and to their oaths above all.

Adm. Steve Abbot, Gen. Peter Chiarelli, Gen. John Jumper, Adm. James Loy, Adm. John Nathman, Adm. William Owens and Gen. Johnnie Wilson are retired four-star generals and admirals in the U.S. armed forces.

JohnInCarolina

Buckwoody Egger

If the Republican platform is so strong it should stand by itself without Trump.  Seems like Republicans could offer him up for prosecution and find a way to lead others without name-calling and paranoid division. 

JohnInCarolina

Probably one of the main themes of tonight’s hearing:

HeavyG

https://twitter.com/rootwoman123/status/1550177078577872899

Spot on.

HeavyG

https://twitter.com/PGourevitch/status/1550272642439122945

JohnInCarolina

You really cannot make this sh!t up.