Love my city

nolaegghead

johnnyp said:

nolaegghead said:

johnnyp said:

nolaegghead said:

We need to make public colleges free to students who qualify by funding them enough and making them more efficient with more online options.   Private schools can keep doing whatever they want.  Countries that do this have a more educated work force (and electorate). 

Local high schools in my area are adopting what they call the “Academy model”, where after 9th grade families can make a decision on whether their child wants to pursue academic or career focused pursuits after high school.

Based on their choices, the child’s electives are essentially chosen by the program. If they pick an academic option, they focus electives on either stem or liberal art areas of study (with the path being chosen by the families).  Or if they choose a vocational route, they still meet the minimum requirements of a high school diploma but graduate with a certification that can yield them (hopefully) gainful employment in fields such as welding, culinary arts or hospitality. 

Since each student will be a bona fide graduate, they can still switch later on, but may be more or less appealing to certain universities based on their areas of study.  

We've yet to have a round of students graduate from the program, but our region is optimistic that it will give kids a ladder to success out of high school. 

That educational model is very pragmatic and has been used in Europe for generations.  It's new to us, but has been refined on the other side of the pond.

My point in mentioning it is in regards to a college for everyone idea. The primary rationale I’ve heard is that Grade 12 is no longer a quality benchmark for a minimum acceptable level of education. That, In the 21st century we need more as a baseline.  

I’m curious as to whether or not that thought process is true. Maybe we need more specialization and expertise at the base level of our economy, not necessarily well-roundedness. 

"College for everyone" is impractical, obviously everyone is different and many are not college material insofar as having the combination of right stuff to go through academia.

And that's the whole point of the European systems - you find what people like to do, have an aptitude for, and give them the trade training to be excellent at it.  Society can't exist if everyone is a doctor and no one is running plumbing.

Your work force in this system isn't just college educated and high school educated, but trained and educated in a broad, practical spectrum.

theyolksonyou

JohnInCarolina said:

TEXASBGE2018 said:

frazzdaddy said:

Careful, That could be construed as a pretty liberal statement.

Again, where have I stated that I am some uber-right wing conservative? Do none of you know what a Libertarian is? Y'all have a nice night. It's not worth elevating my blood pressure trying to defend myself against people who claim to be the most tolerant open minded people on the planet and then turn around and just bash anyone that disagrees with them.

I think by and large folks here have made a good-faith effort to engage you in your arguments.  

Salaries really aren't a significant factor here, by the way.  At one point not all that long ago, college was fairly affordable for middle-class families.  Since then what has happened by and large is that tuition has been increasing at roughly twice the rate of inflation, whereas faculty salaries have pretty much tracked with inflation.  This kind of information has all been fairly well documented in the public space if you're just willing to spend some time looking for it.  

But I get it.  Faculty at universities are "liberal elitists" who are "brainwashing the kids" and thus, easy targets.  

Come down from your ivory tower, John. 

theyolksonyou

  

JohnInCarolina

nolaegghead said:

johnnyp said:

nolaegghead said:

johnnyp said:

nolaegghead said:

We need to make public colleges free to students who qualify by funding them enough and making them more efficient with more online options.   Private schools can keep doing whatever they want.  Countries that do this have a more educated work force (and electorate). 

Local high schools in my area are adopting what they call the “Academy model”, where after 9th grade families can make a decision on whether their child wants to pursue academic or career focused pursuits after high school.

Based on their choices, the child’s electives are essentially chosen by the program. If they pick an academic option, they focus electives on either stem or liberal art areas of study (with the path being chosen by the families).  Or if they choose a vocational route, they still meet the minimum requirements of a high school diploma but graduate with a certification that can yield them (hopefully) gainful employment in fields such as welding, culinary arts or hospitality. 

Since each student will be a bona fide graduate, they can still switch later on, but may be more or less appealing to certain universities based on their areas of study.  

We've yet to have a round of students graduate from the program, but our region is optimistic that it will give kids a ladder to success out of high school. 

That educational model is very pragmatic and has been used in Europe for generations.  It's new to us, but has been refined on the other side of the pond.

My point in mentioning it is in regards to a college for everyone idea. The primary rationale I’ve heard is that Grade 12 is no longer a quality benchmark for a minimum acceptable level of education. That, In the 21st century we need more as a baseline.  

I’m curious as to whether or not that thought process is true. Maybe we need more specialization and expertise at the base level of our economy, not necessarily well-roundedness. 

"College for everyone" is impractical, obviously everyone is different and many are not college material insofar as having the combination of right stuff to go through academia.

And that's the whole point of the European systems - you find what people like to do, have an aptitude for, and give them the trade training to be excellent at it.  Society can't exist if everyone is a doctor and no one is running plumbing.

Your work force in this system isn't just college educated and high school educated, but trained and educated in a broad, practical spectrum.

It really is weird how countries like Germany have figured out a way to make college free for everyone and somehow have those colleges not attended by everyone, or have the degrees be useless.  It’s like magic!

TEXASBGE2018

JohnInCarolina said:

TEXASBGE2018 

I think by and large folks here have made a good-faith effort to engage you in your arguments.  

Salaries really aren't a significant factor here, by the way.  At one point not all that long ago, college was fairly affordable for middle-class families.  Since then what has happened by and large is that tuition has been increasing at roughly twice the rate of inflation, whereas faculty salaries have pretty much tracked with inflation.  This kind of information has all been fairly well documented in the public space if you're just willing to spend some time looking for it.  

But I get it.  Faculty at universities are "liberal elitists" who are "brainwashing the kids" and thus, easy targets.  

And what’s the reason college tuition has increased? It couldn’t possibly be to pay for large salaries, excessive infrastructure improvements, overinflated research budgets, and dozens of other reasons right? At my school( a public university) they have built about 20 multi story buildings in the last 10 years. Most of them are about 1/3 occupied. That is one of the reasons tuition has increased. Again because apparently it was overlooked I said that salaries are just a small portion. And yes thousands of professors across the nation are liberal elitists. There are also thousands that aren’t. Take that professor from California recently that bragged she couldn’t be fired after bashing a recently deceased Barbara Bush. She openly bragged about being a progressive elitist that because she was tenured she couldn’t be fired. There are thousands just like her.

HeavyG

TEXASBGE2018 said:

frazzdaddy said:

Careful, That could be construed as a pretty liberal statement.

Again, where have I stated that I am some uber-right wing conservative? Do none of you know what a Libertarian is? Y'all have a nice night. It's not worth elevating my blood pressure trying to defend myself against people who claim to be the most tolerant open minded people on the planet and then turn around and just bash anyone that disagrees with them.

This sort of stuff elevates your blood pressure?

Lighten up Francis!

theyolksonyou

Good thing you stopped responding 

johnnyp

JohnInCarolina said:

nolaegghead said:

johnnyp said:

nolaegghead said:

johnnyp said:

nolaegghead said:

We need to make public colleges free to students who qualify by funding them enough and making them more efficient with more online options.   Private schools can keep doing whatever they want.  Countries that do this have a more educated work force (and electorate). 

Local high schools in my area are adopting what they call the “Academy model”, where after 9th grade families can make a decision on whether their child wants to pursue academic or career focused pursuits after high school.

Based on their choices, the child’s electives are essentially chosen by the program. If they pick an academic option, they focus electives on either stem or liberal art areas of study (with the path being chosen by the families).  Or if they choose a vocational route, they still meet the minimum requirements of a high school diploma but graduate with a certification that can yield them (hopefully) gainful employment in fields such as welding, culinary arts or hospitality. 

Since each student will be a bona fide graduate, they can still switch later on, but may be more or less appealing to certain universities based on their areas of study.  

We've yet to have a round of students graduate from the program, but our region is optimistic that it will give kids a ladder to success out of high school. 

That educational model is very pragmatic and has been used in Europe for generations.  It's new to us, but has been refined on the other side of the pond.

My point in mentioning it is in regards to a college for everyone idea. The primary rationale I’ve heard is that Grade 12 is no longer a quality benchmark for a minimum acceptable level of education. That, In the 21st century we need more as a baseline.  

I’m curious as to whether or not that thought process is true. Maybe we need more specialization and expertise at the base level of our economy, not necessarily well-roundedness. 

"College for everyone" is impractical, obviously everyone is different and many are not college material insofar as having the combination of right stuff to go through academia.

And that's the whole point of the European systems - you find what people like to do, have an aptitude for, and give them the trade training to be excellent at it.  Society can't exist if everyone is a doctor and no one is running plumbing.

Your work force in this system isn't just college educated and high school educated, but trained and educated in a broad, practical spectrum.

It really is weird how countries like Germany have figured out a way to make college free for everyone and somehow have those colleges not attended by everyone, or have the degrees be useless.  It’s like magic!

 @nolaegghead it seems I have drawn an unintended parallel between your thoughts on free public universities and a “college for everyone” idea.

JohnInCarolina

TEXASBGE2018 said:

JohnInCarolina said:

TEXASBGE2018 

I think by and large folks here have made a good-faith effort to engage you in your arguments.  

Salaries really aren't a significant factor here, by the way.  At one point not all that long ago, college was fairly affordable for middle-class families.  Since then what has happened by and large is that tuition has been increasing at roughly twice the rate of inflation, whereas faculty salaries have pretty much tracked with inflation.  This kind of information has all been fairly well documented in the public space if you're just willing to spend some time looking for it.  

But I get it.  Faculty at universities are "liberal elitists" who are "brainwashing the kids" and thus, easy targets.  

And what’s the reason college tuition has increased? It couldn’t possibly be to pay for large salaries, excessive infrastructure improvements, overinflated research budgets, and dozens of other reasons right? At my school( a public university) they have built about 20 multi story buildings in the last 10 years. Most of them are about 1/3 occupied. That is one of the reasons tuition has increased. Again because apparently it was overlooked I said that salaries are just a small portion. And yes thousands of professors across the nation are liberal elitists. There are also thousands that aren’t. Take that professor from California recently that bragged she couldn’t be fired after bashing a recently deceased Barbara Bush. She openly bragged about being a progressive elitist that because she was tenured she couldn’t be fired. There are thousands just like her.

I don’t know how I can make it any more clear than I have.  Salaries have tracked with inflation.  If you want to assign them part of the blame now, you have to square the circle with college once being affordable.  

nolaegghead

JohnInCarolina said:

nolaegghead said:

johnnyp said:

nolaegghead said:

johnnyp said:

nolaegghead said:

We need to make public colleges free to students who qualify by funding them enough and making them more efficient with more online options.   Private schools can keep doing whatever they want.  Countries that do this have a more educated work force (and electorate). 

Local high schools in my area are adopting what they call the “Academy model”, where after 9th grade families can make a decision on whether their child wants to pursue academic or career focused pursuits after high school.

Based on their choices, the child’s electives are essentially chosen by the program. If they pick an academic option, they focus electives on either stem or liberal art areas of study (with the path being chosen by the families).  Or if they choose a vocational route, they still meet the minimum requirements of a high school diploma but graduate with a certification that can yield them (hopefully) gainful employment in fields such as welding, culinary arts or hospitality. 

Since each student will be a bona fide graduate, they can still switch later on, but may be more or less appealing to certain universities based on their areas of study.  

We've yet to have a round of students graduate from the program, but our region is optimistic that it will give kids a ladder to success out of high school. 

That educational model is very pragmatic and has been used in Europe for generations.  It's new to us, but has been refined on the other side of the pond.

My point in mentioning it is in regards to a college for everyone idea. The primary rationale I’ve heard is that Grade 12 is no longer a quality benchmark for a minimum acceptable level of education. That, In the 21st century we need more as a baseline.  

I’m curious as to whether or not that thought process is true. Maybe we need more specialization and expertise at the base level of our economy, not necessarily well-roundedness. 

"College for everyone" is impractical, obviously everyone is different and many are not college material insofar as having the combination of right stuff to go through academia.

And that's the whole point of the European systems - you find what people like to do, have an aptitude for, and give them the trade training to be excellent at it.  Society can't exist if everyone is a doctor and no one is running plumbing.

Your work force in this system isn't just college educated and high school educated, but trained and educated in a broad, practical spectrum.

It really is weird how countries like Germany have figured out a way to make college free for everyone and somehow have those colleges not attended by everyone, or have the degrees be useless.  It’s like magic!

I'll tell you what, John, I was as perplexed as I'm sure most of you who have heard about there being such a thing as free college and it didn't result in they sky falling and crushing all the educated people residing under it.

In my research, I discovered an old magic, deep within the hills and valleys of the Black Forest, with veins running as far South as France and North as Sweden.   Not surprisingly, it is that very magic that must prop up the impossibility of governance and society there, not that they have had millennia to figure this sh!t out on their own.

nolaegghead

johnnyp said:

JohnInCarolina said:

nolaegghead said:

johnnyp said:

nolaegghead said:

johnnyp said:

nolaegghead said:

We need to make public colleges free to students who qualify by funding them enough and making them more efficient with more online options.   Private schools can keep doing whatever they want.  Countries that do this have a more educated work force (and electorate). 

Local high schools in my area are adopting what they call the “Academy model”, where after 9th grade families can make a decision on whether their child wants to pursue academic or career focused pursuits after high school.

Based on their choices, the child’s electives are essentially chosen by the program. If they pick an academic option, they focus electives on either stem or liberal art areas of study (with the path being chosen by the families).  Or if they choose a vocational route, they still meet the minimum requirements of a high school diploma but graduate with a certification that can yield them (hopefully) gainful employment in fields such as welding, culinary arts or hospitality. 

Since each student will be a bona fide graduate, they can still switch later on, but may be more or less appealing to certain universities based on their areas of study.  

We've yet to have a round of students graduate from the program, but our region is optimistic that it will give kids a ladder to success out of high school. 

That educational model is very pragmatic and has been used in Europe for generations.  It's new to us, but has been refined on the other side of the pond.

My point in mentioning it is in regards to a college for everyone idea. The primary rationale I’ve heard is that Grade 12 is no longer a quality benchmark for a minimum acceptable level of education. That, In the 21st century we need more as a baseline.  

I’m curious as to whether or not that thought process is true. Maybe we need more specialization and expertise at the base level of our economy, not necessarily well-roundedness. 

"College for everyone" is impractical, obviously everyone is different and many are not college material insofar as having the combination of right stuff to go through academia.

And that's the whole point of the European systems - you find what people like to do, have an aptitude for, and give them the trade training to be excellent at it.  Society can't exist if everyone is a doctor and no one is running plumbing.

Your work force in this system isn't just college educated and high school educated, but trained and educated in a broad, practical spectrum.

It really is weird how countries like Germany have figured out a way to make college free for everyone and somehow have those colleges not attended by everyone, or have the degrees be useless.  It’s like magic!

 @nolaegghead it seems I have drawn an unintended parallel between your thoughts on free public universities and a “college for everyone” idea.

Sorry Jonny, I have pretty bad reading comprehension now and then.  (seriously, it's probably the dyslexia).  I apologize if you thought I was in any way beating up you by either suggesting you were a (yuck) liberal ahole like I'm told I am or if you were slighted by any myriad of ways that I seem to have to unwittingly alienate friends and family, if only briefly.

TEXASBGE2018

JohnInCarolina said:

TEXASBGE2018 said:

JohnInCarolina said:

TEXASBGE2018 

I think by and large folks here have made a good-faith effort to engage you in your arguments.  

Salaries really aren't a significant factor here, by the way.  At one point not all that long ago, college was fairly affordable for middle-class families.  Since then what has happened by and large is that tuition has been increasing at roughly twice the rate of inflation, whereas faculty salaries have pretty much tracked with inflation.  This kind of information has all been fairly well documented in the public space if you're just willing to spend some time looking for it.  

But I get it.  Faculty at universities are "liberal elitists" who are "brainwashing the kids" and thus, easy targets.  

And what’s the reason college tuition has increased? It couldn’t possibly be to pay for large salaries, excessive infrastructure improvements, overinflated research budgets, and dozens of other reasons right? At my school( a public university) they have built about 20 multi story buildings in the last 10 years. Most of them are about 1/3 occupied. That is one of the reasons tuition has increased. Again because apparently it was overlooked I said that salaries are just a small portion. And yes thousands of professors across the nation are liberal elitists. There are also thousands that aren’t. Take that professor from California recently that bragged she couldn’t be fired after bashing a recently deceased Barbara Bush. She openly bragged about being a progressive elitist that because she was tenured she couldn’t be fired. There are thousands just like her.

I don’t know how I can make it any more clear than I have.  Salaries have tracked with inflation.  If you want to assign them part of the blame now, you have to square the circle with college once being affordable.  

Clearly you don’t get what I’m saying. Have a nice night John. I’m done again. This time for real.

https://www.usnews.com/news/college-of-tomorrow/articles/2014/09/22/why-college-costs-so-much-overspending-on-faculty-amenities

johnnyp

nolaegghead said:

johnnyp said:

JohnInCarolina said:

nolaegghead said:

johnnyp said:

nolaegghead said:

johnnyp said:

nolaegghead said:

We need to make public colleges free to students who qualify by funding them enough and making them more efficient with more online options.   Private schools can keep doing whatever they want.  Countries that do this have a more educated work force (and electorate). 

Local high schools in my area are adopting what they call the “Academy model”, where after 9th grade families can make a decision on whether their child wants to pursue academic or career focused pursuits after high school.

Based on their choices, the child’s electives are essentially chosen by the program. If they pick an academic option, they focus electives on either stem or liberal art areas of study (with the path being chosen by the families).  Or if they choose a vocational route, they still meet the minimum requirements of a high school diploma but graduate with a certification that can yield them (hopefully) gainful employment in fields such as welding, culinary arts or hospitality. 

Since each student will be a bona fide graduate, they can still switch later on, but may be more or less appealing to certain universities based on their areas of study.  

We've yet to have a round of students graduate from the program, but our region is optimistic that it will give kids a ladder to success out of high school. 

That educational model is very pragmatic and has been used in Europe for generations.  It's new to us, but has been refined on the other side of the pond.

My point in mentioning it is in regards to a college for everyone idea. The primary rationale I’ve heard is that Grade 12 is no longer a quality benchmark for a minimum acceptable level of education. That, In the 21st century we need more as a baseline.  

I’m curious as to whether or not that thought process is true. Maybe we need more specialization and expertise at the base level of our economy, not necessarily well-roundedness. 

"College for everyone" is impractical, obviously everyone is different and many are not college material insofar as having the combination of right stuff to go through academia.

And that's the whole point of the European systems - you find what people like to do, have an aptitude for, and give them the trade training to be excellent at it.  Society can't exist if everyone is a doctor and no one is running plumbing.

Your work force in this system isn't just college educated and high school educated, but trained and educated in a broad, practical spectrum.

It really is weird how countries like Germany have figured out a way to make college free for everyone and somehow have those colleges not attended by everyone, or have the degrees be useless.  It’s like magic!

 @nolaegghead it seems I have drawn an unintended parallel between your thoughts on free public universities and a “college for everyone” idea.

Sorry Jonny, I have pretty bad reading comprehension now and then.  (seriously, it's probably the dyslexia).  I apologize if you thought I was in any way beating up you by either suggesting you were a (yuck) liberal ahole like I'm told I am or if you were slighted by any myriad of ways that I seem to have to unwittingly alienate friends and family, if only briefly.

You remain ok-by-me, you America hating, free ride loving, liberal nutcase, you 

nolaegghead

@JohnInCarolina Hey man, I thought you were supposed to among other things specialize in some mumbo jumbo computer modeling for non-destructive testing.  Clearly you are running folks off the forum!  Stop it!

JohnInCarolina

I gather we went from huge faculty salaries being central to the problem at hand, where maybe we could fix the problem by all of us being paid like high school teachers, to them being only a small part of the problem, just one that doesn’t line up with any sort of data.  That’s progress I suppose.

thetrim

Speaking of "colleges"

Here is reporting day at two of our Nation's Military academies.

johnnyp

thetrim said:

Speaking of "colleges"

Here is reporting day at two of our Nation's Military academies.

I work closely with both a West Point and and an Annapolis grad.

Both stand-up, great guys befitting of their schools. 

JohnInCarolina

theyolksonyou said:

JohnInCarolina said:

TEXASBGE2018 said:

frazzdaddy said:

Careful, That could be construed as a pretty liberal statement.

Again, where have I stated that I am some uber-right wing conservative? Do none of you know what a Libertarian is? Y'all have a nice night. It's not worth elevating my blood pressure trying to defend myself against people who claim to be the most tolerant open minded people on the planet and then turn around and just bash anyone that disagrees with them.

I think by and large folks here have made a good-faith effort to engage you in your arguments.  

Salaries really aren't a significant factor here, by the way.  At one point not all that long ago, college was fairly affordable for middle-class families.  Since then what has happened by and large is that tuition has been increasing at roughly twice the rate of inflation, whereas faculty salaries have pretty much tracked with inflation.  This kind of information has all been fairly well documented in the public space if you're just willing to spend some time looking for it.  

But I get it.  Faculty at universities are "liberal elitists" who are "brainwashing the kids" and thus, easy targets.  

Come down from your ivory tower, John. 

Why?  It’s so much fun up here man!

nolaegghead

JohnInCarolina said:

theyolksonyou said:

JohnInCarolina said:

TEXASBGE2018 said:

frazzdaddy said:

Careful, That could be construed as a pretty liberal statement.

Again, where have I stated that I am some uber-right wing conservative? Do none of you know what a Libertarian is? Y'all have a nice night. It's not worth elevating my blood pressure trying to defend myself against people who claim to be the most tolerant open minded people on the planet and then turn around and just bash anyone that disagrees with them.

I think by and large folks here have made a good-faith effort to engage you in your arguments.  

Salaries really aren't a significant factor here, by the way.  At one point not all that long ago, college was fairly affordable for middle-class families.  Since then what has happened by and large is that tuition has been increasing at roughly twice the rate of inflation, whereas faculty salaries have pretty much tracked with inflation.  This kind of information has all been fairly well documented in the public space if you're just willing to spend some time looking for it.  

But I get it.  Faculty at universities are "liberal elitists" who are "brainwashing the kids" and thus, easy targets.  

Come down from your ivory tower, John. 

Why?  It’s so much fun up here man!

Mingle with the plebeians, builds character!

thetrim

And Abraham Lincoln's final judicial nominee may open another vacancy on the court soon.

nolaegghead

thetrim said:

And Abraham Lincoln's final judicial nominee may open another vacancy on the court soon.

Gee, I can't wait for the ensuing 17th century good-ol-days draconian Christian-sharia law that will inevitably follow.

Hans61

TEXASBGE2018 said: I don't care what you do in your bedroom as long as you don't try to force me, my wife or kids to join you.

I've never heard of a gay person forcing a straight person to become gay. (reminds me of hide your kids, hide your wife, cause they raping errrbody up in here) :-)

JohnInCarolina

johnnyp

The Brain is more important than the mouth 

BigGreenBean

nolaegghead said:

BigGreenBean said:

@TEXASBGE2018 is a helluva patriot, and he cooks, too!  Although I met a Texan once at a party and told him my brother had lived in Dallas for a while, to which he responded:  "Well, that's almost Texas."  Got a kick out of that.  

Trump won.  You know, democracy and all.  Whine, ****, piss, and moan all you want.  Kinda how it works in these United States.

That whenever any Form of Government becomes destructive of these ends, it is the Right of the People to alter or to abolish it, and to institute new Government, laying its foundation on such principles and organizing its powers in such form, as to them shall seem most likely to effect their Safety and Happiness. Prudence, indeed, will dictate that Governments long established should not be changed for light and transient causes; and accordingly all experience hath shewn that mankind are more disposed to suffer, while evils are sufferable than to right themselves by abolishing the forms to which they are accustomed. But when a long train of abuses and usurpations, pursuing invariably the same Object evinces a design to reduce them under absolute Despotism, it is their right, it is their duty, to throw off such Government, and to provide new Guards for their future security.

(commonly misconstrued as "whining")

Did you write that??  You're good.  Bullying people in a restaurant with whom you disagree, however vehemently, is whining.  Don't like Sarah Huckabee Sanders?, fine, but you don't get to F up her appetizer round and generally make an a$$ of yourself.  Never in my life have I seen conservatives behave in such a childish and intolerant manner.  Liberals either, for that matter.  Look, I can't stand either one of the lying, thieving, narcisisstic Clintons, but I never tried to run Stephanopolous or Lanny Davis out of a restaurant.  Never seen it until now.  

I still dig your crawfish boil, though.  

johnnyp

JohnInCarolina

BigGreenBean said:

nolaegghead said:

BigGreenBean said:

@TEXASBGE2018 is a helluva patriot, and he cooks, too!  Although I met a Texan once at a party and told him my brother had lived in Dallas for a while, to which he responded:  "Well, that's almost Texas."  Got a kick out of that.  

Trump won.  You know, democracy and all.  Whine, ****, piss, and moan all you want.  Kinda how it works in these United States.

That whenever any Form of Government becomes destructive of these ends, it is the Right of the People to alter or to abolish it, and to institute new Government, laying its foundation on such principles and organizing its powers in such form, as to them shall seem most likely to effect their Safety and Happiness. Prudence, indeed, will dictate that Governments long established should not be changed for light and transient causes; and accordingly all experience hath shewn that mankind are more disposed to suffer, while evils are sufferable than to right themselves by abolishing the forms to which they are accustomed. But when a long train of abuses and usurpations, pursuing invariably the same Object evinces a design to reduce them under absolute Despotism, it is their right, it is their duty, to throw off such Government, and to provide new Guards for their future security.

(commonly misconstrued as "whining")

Did you write that??  You're good.  Bullying people in a restaurant with whom you disagree, however vehemently, is whining.  Don't like Sarah Huckabee Sanders?, fine, but you don't get to F up her appetizer round and generally make an a$$ of yourself.  Never in my life have I seen conservatives behave in such a childish and intolerant manner.  Liberals either, for that matter.  Look, I can't stand either one of the lying, thieving, narcisisstic Clintons, but I never tried to run Stephanopolous or Lanny Davis out of a restaurant.  Never seen it until now.  

I still dig your crawfish boil, though.  

“Grab her by the ****!” was right up there in maturity I suppose.  

As for the members of the White House running into trouble dining out on the town, I don’t know what to say other than: carry yourself with the confidence of someone enforcing the nation's current immigration policy who has zero fear about the kitchen's preparation of their Mexican dinner.

GoldenQ

I am not Republican, Democrat, or Libeterian.   I am just old school Federalist like the original guys that wrote the constitution and bill of rights but there are not many left. WE believe the documents mean exactly what they say and that if states want to have it mean something else they should the process set forth to change it not have a court or congress or presidential decree change since the documents give the real power except for a very limited few things to the states.      However I also believe we should be polite and talk things out not act as the present day Republicans and democrats do. We should put country first and political agendas should be not be first or anyway interfere with what is best for the country.
With that I will shut up.

jeroldharter

Blah, blah, blah. Didn't have the patience to read the whole thread. Mention a conservative thought on this forum and the socialists will mob you.

Yes, Germany is a great case study. Start two world wars, have the USA bail out your economy post-war, turn West Germany into a capitalist center while East Germany is suffocated in communism. Then let the USA execute a cold war and West Germany takes East. Have the USA subsidize Europe's defense through NATO while Germany fails to pay its 2% GDP bills. Watch Germany take over the EU because all of the other countries have weaker socialist economies. Etc. It is great that they pay for college. With its history of successes, I am sure that Germany is a paragon of managed economies.

And really? The big government socialists here somehow think that ruining someone's dinner at a restaurant puts them in the company of George Washington or Abraham Lincoln? How about people stick to talking about food.

TheToast

I think perhaps if you don't want to get kicked out of a restaurant, then don't support policies as despicable as seperating kids from families. People who are outraged by the former and not the latter need to take a look at themselves.