Packer Brisket -- Time Sensitive Question

GaryDZ

I am going to cook a 12# packer brisket over night. 

I only cooked one once before, and that was 3 years ago.  

My plan is indirect cooking at 250°F until done.  I will watch for a stall, but I plan on sleeping. 

I do not plan on wrapping it at all.   


Question: 

Any strong opinions about wrapping?  

Some people use a pan of water under it --- What are your thoughts on that?

Some misty it with vinegar, other with apple juice every hour --  What are your thoughts on misting?  
I tend to not open the grill unless I have to.  "If you're looking you're not cooking" 


Thanks in Advance

Gary DZ

BeecaveKitchen

I mist with beef stock every hour until I get my bark looking good around hour 5 and I do wrap it for about three more hours and keep a water pan in there the whole time.  I’m getting ready to trim my first packer! Always had the butcher do it. Good luck! 

lousubcap

No need for a water-pan but you do need an air-gapped (off your heat deflector) drip pan.  If you go with the water pan, just be aware that it is a heat sink until it loses all the water then your cook temp will climb to the temp for a no water cook based on the vent settings.

Regarding misting-that comes from off-set smokers where the high air flow will tend to dry out the meat surface.  Not needed in the BGE but again your call.

Wrapping-

here's a link to wrapping (remember AF uses an off-set).

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lnRRDSYgdmw 

Basically-wrap in butcher paper if you have the color you want; foil if you need to power it home and nekked if none of the above and just want to get a benchmark.  FWIW-

GaryDZ

Thanks...  I will us a pan.  I anticipate it will be about 10 pounds after trimming

I plan on starting it about 11:00p tonight.  Do you think it will be ready to serve at 3p, including the time to rest it? 

smbishop

GaryDZ said:

Thanks...  I will us a pan.  I anticipate it will be about 10 pounds after trimming

I plan on starting it about 11:00p tonight.  Do you think it will be ready to serve at 3p, including the time to rest it? 

In my opinion, at 250, your timing will be perfect.  You can always FTC (wrap in foil, towel and place in a cooler) for up to around 5 hours before serving.  Did a 12 pound packer Thursday, put is on at 11:00 and it took around 14 hours at a lower temp of 225...until it probed like butter.  I wrapped in butcher paper around 170 when it had a nice bark.  I have cooked without wrapping as well with good results.  

lousubcap

Let me start with the following, "the friggin cow drives the cook." 

With that out of the way, I don't know if you have a controller or not but if not I would load your BGE (size?) up into the fire ring (assuming LBGE) and light around 8-9 PM and get it stable (no vent movement for at least 45 mins) before loading the brisket.  Most BGE's have a sweet spot in the 240-270*F range so if that's the case with yours don't sweat trying to nail 250*F.  Cook times-I have seen packers in your guesstimated weight and temp range take as little as 0.75 hrs/lb and as long as 1.3 hrs/lb.  (see opening comment).

Given the target slice on demand time is 3 PM then my objective would be to get the cook finished inside the FTC window which can easily be six hours early and you want at least a couple of hours rest.  So all you have to do is coax the cow across the finish-line between 9 am and 1 PM.  Easier written than done sometimes.  FWIW-

smbishop

As @lousubcap stated. One thing I have learned is to get the Egg stabilized for at least an hour or more at your desired temp before adding the meat.   Probably learned this from his posts in the past!

SciAggie

GaryDZ said:

Thanks...  I will us a pan.  I anticipate it will be about 10 pounds after trimming

I plan on starting it about 11:00p tonight.  Do you think it will be ready to serve at 3p, including the time to rest it? 

I mean this with all due respect: this is your second brisket. When the guy with over 19,000 posts, that has cooked countless briskets is telling you not to use a water pan consider his advice. Post count does’t equal expertise but I can tell you this man knows brisket and cooking on an egg. 
Do what you want; it’s your cook, but why ask for advice then not take it?

BeecaveKitchen

SciAggie said:

GaryDZ said:

Thanks...  I will us a pan.  I anticipate it will be about 10 pounds after trimming

I plan on starting it about 11:00p tonight.  Do you think it will be ready to serve at 3p, including the time to rest it? 

I mean this with all due respect: this is your second brisket. When the guy with over 19,000 posts, that has cooked countless briskets is telling you not to use a water pan consider his advice. Post count does’t equal expertise but I can tell you this man knows brisket and cooking on an egg. 
Do what you want; it’s your cook, but why ask for advice then not take it?

I’m totally rethinking water on now too. Not going to use it tomorrow.

GaryDZ

Thanks Everyone...

SciAggie... "No need for a water-pan but you do need an air-gapped (off your heat deflector) drip pan"   Drip Pan is what I will be using the pan for.  

SciAggie

GaryDZ said:

Thanks Everyone...

SciAggie... "No need for a water-pan but you do need an air-gapped (off your heat deflector) drip pan"   Drip Pan is what I will be using the pan for.  

Yes, that’s a great idea. Looks like you got it - I was just trying to help. Waiting to see the outcome. 

njl

lousubcap said:

No need for a water-pan but you do need an air-gapped (off your heat deflector) drip pan.  

Why?  All my recent packers have been cooked on a grid directly over a foiled over stone in my CGS AR R&B combo.  What am I losing, not using a drip pan?

stlcharcoal

Don't use a water pan, it will throw off your damper/chimney settings when the water evaporates.  Water pans are used to suck up BTU's in drafty smokers where you can't keep the heat down......not a problem in a kamado.

Same story when it comes to misting.  Every time you open the dome to mist, you're releasing more moisture than you're puting on it.  No real reason to wrap either. Sometimes I'll use the inner layer of a charcoal bag to loosely wrap a very lean brisket, but not always.

I just throw it on there at 240-250 and let it sit 9-10 hrs until it hits 205'ish.  Remove and wrap in foil for an hour or so.  If the point is really fatty, then I'll cut that off and throw it back on until it's 205-210 (or cube it first for burnt ends.)

lousubcap

njl said:

lousubcap said:

No need for a water-pan but you do need an air-gapped (off your heat deflector) drip pan.  

Why?  All my recent packers have been cooked on a grid directly over a foiled over stone in my CGS AR R&B combo.  What am I losing, not using a drip pan?

Not losing a thing except for the acrid residue of burned off fat on your foil.  But if that's not happening then no worries. 

The Cen-Tex Smoker

lousubcap said:

njl said:

lousubcap said:

No need for a water-pan but you do need an air-gapped (off your heat deflector) drip pan.  

Why?  All my recent packers have been cooked on a grid directly over a foiled over stone in my CGS AR R&B combo.  What am I losing, not using a drip pan?

Not losing a thing except for the acrid residue of burned off fat on your foil.  But if that's not happening then no worries. 

True- and Most briskets I cook give off the better part of a gallon of liquid. Once that gets into your lump or your ceramics, it takes forever for it to burn off before your next cook. Nasty white smoke. If you catch that in a drip pan you don’t have to worry about those nasty flavors on your current cook or the cooks to follow. 

lousubcap

Upon further review- I had forgotten about the brisket fat induced lump fire that dang near caused cardiac arrest.  I had the foiled drip pan going like always under a SRF brisket cook when, around 6-7 hours in the temp starts to take off.  WTF...fortunately running with the PSWOO so I pull everything out, see the fire (I had created a channel in the foil that enabled some rendered fat to escape the pan and soak into the lump.  Once the fire found it-off to the races.

Nothing a few well placed ice cubes couldn't handle.

First time for that one-I am now more careful with the foiling operation.  FWIW-

BeecaveKitchen

So we were doing great with our SFR packer at 225 first two hours. Came back at 3.5 hours and the temp had spiked to 300!!!  Internal temp is now 170 at flat and and 185 at point we put some ice cubes in drip pan closed up all openings and lowered temp to 250- it will not get lower SO FRUSTRATING!!! My bark is no where near what I want- should I say screw it and wrap it before the whole thing burns up inside? It’s always worked great when I’ve cooked some cheap HEB brisket- but not today with my fancy pants SRF brisket. Oh well- trimmings can make good sandwiches right?? 😩

lousubcap

Wrapping will not impact the temp the brisket sees so I would let it run to get the bark you want, unwrapped (like I cook 95%+ of mine-being lazy.  If you have effectively choked off the fire the temp you are seeing is due to the mass of the ceramics being heated up.  I have had spikes hit the 300*F mark (thermo calibrated?) and the cook turned out just fine.  The feel in the thick part of the flat is the finish-line driver (point is just along for the ride). 

You arte about 6 hrs into the cook-don't know the post-trim weight of the brisket but I have had 10-12 lb (post-trim) briskets take anywhere from 0.75 hrs/lb to 1.3 hrs/lb with the temp averaging in the 260-280*F range.

Running with a controller?  Reason I ask is that 225 is a challenge w/o one.

Anyhow, time for a few adult supervisory beverages.   You will save this. 

lousubcap

@BeecaveKitchen - what's happening?? 

SciAggie

Is it done yet?

njl

The Cen-Tex Smoker said:

lousubcap said:

njl said:

lousubcap said:

No need for a water-pan but you do need an air-gapped (off your heat deflector) drip pan.  

Why?  All my recent packers have been cooked on a grid directly over a foiled over stone in my CGS AR R&B combo.  What am I losing, not using a drip pan?

Not losing a thing except for the acrid residue of burned off fat on your foil.  But if that's not happening then no worries. 

True- and Most briskets I cook give off the better part of a gallon of liquid. Once that gets into your lump or your ceramics, it takes forever for it to burn off before your next cook. Nasty white smoke. If you catch that in a drip pan you don’t have to worry about those nasty flavors on your current cook or the cooks to follow. 

Can't say I've noticed either of these issues.  The only downside I've encountered with this method is, the mess left behind on the foiled stone.  I generally open the vents at the end of every cook and get up to 700F+ before shutting down.  Maybe that's helping?

JohnInCarolina

SciAggie said:

Is it done yet?

wardo

Did it turn out?

lousubcap

Surface, surface, surface....hello?

Edit: Clearly not your first brisket rodeo as evidenced with your http://beecavekitchen.blogspot.com/ site.  FWIW-

BeecaveKitchen

Whew! Turned out great. Threw some ice water in the drip pan and it cooled off. I think time to replace the felt. 

BeecaveKitchen

lousubcap said:

Wrapping will not impact the temp the brisket sees so I would let it run to get the bark you want, unwrapped (like I cook 95%+ of mine-being lazy.  If you have effectively choked off the fire the temp you are seeing is due to the mass of the ceramics being heated up.  I have had spikes hit the 300*F mark (thermo calibrated?) and the cook turned out just fine.  The feel in the thick part of the flat is the finish-line driver (point is just along for the ride). 

You arte about 6 hrs into the cook-don't know the post-trim weight of the brisket but I have had 10-12 lb (post-trim) briskets take anywhere from 0.75 hrs/lb to 1.3 hrs/lb with the temp averaging in the 260-280*F range.

Running with a controller?  Reason I ask is that 225 is a challenge w/o one.

Anyhow, time for a few adult supervisory beverages.   You will save this. 

A few adult beverages calmed my nerves for sure! Turned out moist and barky like I wanted. Crisis averted!!!

wardo

That's a fantastic looking piece of brisket. Was that the point or the flat?

BeecaveKitchen

wardo said:

That's a fantastic looking piece of brisket. Was that the point or the flat?

That was the flat- the point was, well.... on point! Unctuous, decadent. SFR did not disappoint. Using the bits to make baked beans. Truly appreciate everyone’s support! 

The Cen-Tex Smoker

Well it sure looks good. 

lousubcap

The suspense was worth it.  Great outcome.  You now have weathered one more challenge in the never-ending brisket cook challenge series.  Congrats. 

lousubcap

@BeecaveKitchen Curious as to how you proceeded once you sounded the above "distress signal?"  Whatever you did would definitely be of value to others going forward as you got quite an impressive outcome.  Thanks in advance.