RIP--Charlie Kirk

fishlessman · September 16

JohnInCarolina said:

Why is that ironic, you might ask? Well…

Imagine if Floyd was a political and religious icon with the left shot by a republican maga......

JohnInCarolina · September 16

JohnInCarolina · September 16

Same guy, lol.

Free speech for me, but not for thee…

JohnInCarolina · September 16

Image: https://us.v-cdn.net/5017260/uploads/editor/y7/dlqb4sousc20.jpeg

Botch · September 16

Legume said:
Well, I just dove into the interwebs and found
a) the original commandments were not numbered (Mel Brooks History of the World was wrong),
b) Catholics and Lutherans follow one numbering scheme, Protestants and Orthodox Christian churches follow another numbering scheme, both have origins in different parts of the old testament and they split/combine things so that there are 10, it’s not just a different order.

I was raised Lutheran (I'm now agnostic and leaning more and more to atheism) and I must correct you that the lutherans are the original Protestants; Martin Luther posted about a hundred questions (Protests) to the Pope's website and got into a lot of trouble.

Legume · September 16

Botch said:

Legume said:
Well, I just dove into the interwebs and found
a) the original commandments were not numbered (Mel Brooks History of the World was wrong),
b) Catholics and Lutherans follow one numbering scheme, Protestants and Orthodox Christian churches follow another numbering scheme, both have origins in different parts of the old testament and they split/combine things so that there are 10, it’s not just a different order.

I was raised Lutheran (I'm now agnostic and leaning more and more to atheism) and I must correct you that the lutherans are the original Protestants; Martin Luther posted about a hundred questions (Protests) to the Pope's website and got into a lot of trouble.

They appear to group and number their commandments differently from all of the other Protestant flavors.

GrateEggspectations · September 16

Botch said:

Legume said:
Well, I just dove into the interwebs and found
a) the original commandments were not numbered (Mel Brooks History of the World was wrong),
b) Catholics and Lutherans follow one numbering scheme, Protestants and Orthodox Christian churches follow another numbering scheme, both have origins in different parts of the old testament and they split/combine things so that there are 10, it’s not just a different order.

I was raised Lutheran (I'm now agnostic and leaning more and more to atheism) and I must correct you that the lutherans are the original Protestants; Martin Luther posted about a hundred questions (Protests) to the Pope's website and got into a lot of trouble.

Did the Pope’s website feature a banner touting Christmas all year?

CupCakeEater · September 16

OviedoGoddess said:

CupCakeEater said:

FlyOverCountry said:

Where are the lies? This is all just common cents. He was kilt for telling kids that college is no place for free thoughts a big ideas. Its to expansive for that. If you want to learn big ideas clean toilets at Walmart for ten years.

The lies come from the half posted remarks. That’s a typical tactic. You don’t show it in reference. Just like the empathy reference. He said he didn’t like the word because it’s was a reference to a person feeling what the person hurting feels. He stated you can’t feel what they feel so he preferred the word sympathy. This is no different than how people pull a snippet from the Bible and use it as proof without showing the entire message.

The statement about black women was also not truthful. He was only talking about a few individuals that used affirmative action to get a job. He never used the term “black women” as a collective group. Just showing that these individuals received their jobs because of their skin color and not their merit.

Is there some broader context to him being concerned about a black pilot? Or calling LGBTQ a social contagion?

There was indeed. He was talking DEI as well. One airline had a mandate to hire 50% blacks and women. He was discussing how they had actually lowered the hiring standards to allow these quotas to be applied. The argument was do you want the highest qualified person flying the plane or one that met a quota? Hiring for skin color and gender shouldn’t override a person who was best qualified.

It’s best to simply watch these interactions and see how it comes about. Not everyone agrees with the idea he had but it’s worth talking about.

CupCakeEater · September 16

It comes at no surprise that many people hate Kirk. Anyone with very strong convictions will be. For those that hate the teaching of Christ, they will be not like the message he was giving. It’s the same reason Christ was killed. It’s the same reason, Martin Luther King was killed. It’s not that the words they spoke were inflammatory. It’s that they were dangerous to those that disagree with them. They believe by killing the messenger, the message will die. When in fact, the message grows stronger.

I’ve seen more hate on social media than I can believe imaginable. Horrible things. The lies get posted and they don’t care to look for the truth. The division will continue to go and I’m afraid we will see the violence growing rapidly from both sides as we go forward. One group hates and the other comes for revenge. I hate seeing our country suffer but it’s inevitable at this point.

JohnInCarolina · September 16

The kid who shot him really did look just like one of Pontius Pilate's auxiliary troops. It's uncanny.

JohnInCarolina · September 16

CupCakeEater said:

OviedoGoddess said:

CupCakeEater said:

FlyOverCountry said:

Where are the lies? This is all just common cents. He was kilt for telling kids that college is no place for free thoughts a big ideas. Its to expansive for that. If you want to learn big ideas clean toilets at Walmart for ten years.

The lies come from the half posted remarks. That’s a typical tactic. You don’t show it in reference. Just like the empathy reference. He said he didn’t like the word because it’s was a reference to a person feeling what the person hurting feels. He stated you can’t feel what they feel so he preferred the word sympathy. This is no different than how people pull a snippet from the Bible and use it as proof without showing the entire message.

The statement about black women was also not truthful. He was only talking about a few individuals that used affirmative action to get a job. He never used the term “black women” as a collective group. Just showing that these individuals received their jobs because of their skin color and not their merit.

Is there some broader context to him being concerned about a black pilot? Or calling LGBTQ a social contagion?

There was indeed. He was talking DEI as well. One airline had a mandate to hire 50% blacks and women. He was discussing how they had actually lowered the hiring standards to allow these quotas to be applied. The argument was do you want the highest qualified person flying the plane or one that met a quota? Hiring for skin color and gender shouldn’t override a person who was best qualified.

It’s best to simply watch these interactions and see how it comes about. Not everyone agrees with the idea he had but it’s worth talking about.

I see. It's not that Kirk was actually a racist, it's just that the left had created an environment in which he had to be. He didn't actually want to be racist, the left just left him no choice.

DoubleEgger · September 16

This thread definitely has “The Weave”.

fishlessman · September 16

JohnInCarolina said:

i did not know knocking someones hat is an offense in texas, i guess she didnt either

lkapigian · September 16

"Your Homie Dead Your Homie Dead He Got Shot In The Head Your Homie Dead", such nice not hateful people ...arrestable offence , not really, crass yes....grow up America

Gulfcoastguy · September 16

lkapigian said:

"Your Homie Dead Your Homie Dead He Got Shot In The Head Your Homie Dead", such nice not hateful people ...arrestable offence , not really, crass yes....grow up America

Not to mention that there are people recording these videos and forwarding them to these people’s employers, particularly those in education fields. Not that that is anything new, it’s been going on since the advent of Facebook. Not how I would choose to handle matters personally.

Ozzie_Isaac · September 16

fishlessman · September 16

lkapigian said:

"Your Homie Dead Your Homie Dead He Got Shot In The Head Your Homie Dead", such nice not hateful people ...arrestable offence , not really, crass yes....grow up America

not nice to hit people mourning either, well best to double down and do it infront of a police officer....the guy was nice enough not to press charges

Legume · September 16

If you're not happy with how people express themselves, start with the leadership in this country, local, state and national. Not random citizens caught on camera.

And while I don't condone or celebrate murder, Kirk lived his life stirring conflict with some very bad takes. While he should not have been shot, it's not unreasonable or shocking to learn that he was. He spewed strong opinions for a living in a country that is highly divided. And yes, his opinions contributed to that.

lkapigian · September 16

Legume said:

If you're not happy with how people express themselves, start with the leadership in this country, local, state and national. Not random citizens caught on camera.

And while I don't condone or celebrate murder, Kirk lived his life stirring conflict with some very bad takes. While he should not have been shot, it's not unreasonable or shocking to learn that he was. He spewed strong opinions for a living in a country that is highly divided. And yes, his opinions contributed to that.

With all due respect, that type of behavior starts at home, the Nations leadership does not raise your children , I would hardly call it self expression

DoubleEgger · September 16

lkapigian said:

Legume said:

If you're not happy with how people express themselves, start with the leadership in this country, local, state and national. Not random citizens caught on camera.

And while I don't condone or celebrate murder, Kirk lived his life stirring conflict with some very bad takes. While he should not have been shot, it's not unreasonable or shocking to learn that he was. He spewed strong opinions for a living in a country that is highly divided. And yes, his opinions contributed to that.

With all due respect, that type of behavior starts at home, the Nations leadership does not raise your children , I would hardly call it self expression

I remember a survey a while back where more people believed Trump more than family members or religious leaders.

https://www.axios.com/2023/08/21/trump-republican-2024-voters-poll

Starts at home… where are the adults at home getting their info to teach their kids?

Additionally, from what I have read, this kid grew up in a conservative “All-American” household.

Legume · September 16

Larry, I agree, starts at home, but that's not the beginning and the end, agree?

Take a look around at how so many politicians speak out, carry themselves these days. Compare the Obama administration or the Biden administration or any past administration from either side of the aisle to Trump and his maga ilk. Do you not see how that makes it more acceptable and how we've been on this downward slide when he has the megaphone?

It's amazing to me that people choose to make this the issue - how many shootings did we have just last week? But my god, someone said something bad about a divisive maga podcaster that got killed.

Are you not even curious why so many people hated him and make the choice to say bad things about him now? Some people just want harmony on the surface, regardless of what is going on under the water, but that's not really truth, is it.

lkapigian · September 16

DoubleEgger said:

lkapigian said:

Legume said:

If you're not happy with how people express themselves, start with the leadership in this country, local, state and national. Not random citizens caught on camera.

And while I don't condone or celebrate murder, Kirk lived his life stirring conflict with some very bad takes. While he should not have been shot, it's not unreasonable or shocking to learn that he was. He spewed strong opinions for a living in a country that is highly divided. And yes, his opinions contributed to that.

With all due respect, that type of behavior starts at home, the Nations leadership does not raise your children , I would hardly call it self expression

I remember a survey a while back where more people believed Trump more than family members or religious leaders.

https://www.axios.com/2023/08/21/trump-republican-2024-voters-poll

Starts at home… where are the adults at home getting their info to teach their kids?

Additionally, from what I have read, this kid grew up in a conservative “All-American” household.

This problem did not start suddenly with this administration, if people want to think that fine.. there are always outliers in any situation whether business, home etc, it happens . The ease and influence of social media and associated technology speeds things up “ Grew up in a conservative home” doesn’t make a perfect family. My kids are all grown and gone, never had cell phones until later in life, monitored anything social constantly and I’ve always tried to parent by example, doesn’t always work

WeberWho · September 16

Legume said:

Larry, I agree, starts at home, but that's not the beginning and the end, agree?

Take a look around at how so many politicians speak out, carry themselves these days. Compare the Obama administration or the Biden administration or any past administration from either side of the aisle to Trump and his maga ilk. Do you not see how that makes it more acceptable and how we've been on this downward slide when he has the megaphone?

Ilhan Omar anyone?

Legume · September 16

WeberWho said:

Legume said:

Larry, I agree, starts at home, but that's not the beginning and the end, agree?

Take a look around at how so many politicians speak out, carry themselves these days. Compare the Obama administration or the Biden administration or any past administration from either side of the aisle to Trump and his maga ilk. Do you not see how that makes it more acceptable and how we've been on this downward slide when he has the megaphone?

Ilhan Omar anyone?

Not all that familiar with all that she's said, but I know she's been controversial and hated by some and has strong views. There indeed is a theme here.

DoubleEgger · September 16

WeberWho said:

Legume said:

Larry, I agree, starts at home, but that's not the beginning and the end, agree?

Take a look around at how so many politicians speak out, carry themselves these days. Compare the Obama administration or the Biden administration or any past administration from either side of the aisle to Trump and his maga ilk. Do you not see how that makes it more acceptable and how we've been on this downward slide when he has the megaphone?

Ilhan Omar anyone?

I don’t think she was part of anyone’s administration.

JohnInCarolina · September 16

The student was expelled after making her remarks in the "free speech area" on campus. One would imagine that would be a spot where controversial things could be said... but perhaps not.

I think we effectively broke the irony meter somewhere back on page 2 of this thread.

WeberWho · September 16

DoubleEgger said:

WeberWho said:

Legume said:

Larry, I agree, starts at home, but that's not the beginning and the end, agree?

Take a look around at how so many politicians speak out, carry themselves these days. Compare the Obama administration or the Biden administration or any past administration from either side of the aisle to Trump and his maga ilk. Do you not see how that makes it more acceptable and how we've been on this downward slide when he has the megaphone?

Ilhan Omar anyone?

I don’t think she was part of anyone’s administration.

I believe she's a politician

lkapigian · September 16

Legume said:

Larry, I agree, starts at home, but that's not the beginning and the end, agree?

Take a look around at how so many politicians speak out, carry themselves these days. Compare the Obama administration or the Biden administration or any past administration from either side of the aisle to Trump and his maga ilk. Do you not see how that makes it more acceptable and how we've been on this downward slide when he has the megaphone?

It's amazing to me that people choose to make this the issue - how many shootings did we have just last week? But my god, someone said something bad about a divisive maga podcaster that got killed.

Are you not even curious why so many people hated him and make the choice to say bad things about him now? Some people just want harmony on the surface, regardless of what is going on under the water, but that's not really truth, is it.

Absolutely agree to the it’s not the beginning or the end ( cheers my friend) to the point of the people hating him, I would offer up he pushed open dialogue up a notch to where many of those open dialogue is new territory and are used to “ not talking “ ( I go back to social media on that one and the solitude many lives are )

JohnInCarolina · September 16

lkapigian said:

Legume said:

Larry, I agree, starts at home, but that's not the beginning and the end, agree?

Take a look around at how so many politicians speak out, carry themselves these days. Compare the Obama administration or the Biden administration or any past administration from either side of the aisle to Trump and his maga ilk. Do you not see how that makes it more acceptable and how we've been on this downward slide when he has the megaphone?

It's amazing to me that people choose to make this the issue - how many shootings did we have just last week? But my god, someone said something bad about a divisive maga podcaster that got killed.

Are you not even curious why so many people hated him and make the choice to say bad things about him now? Some people just want harmony on the surface, regardless of what is going on under the water, but that's not really truth, is it.

Absolutely agree to the it’s not the beginning or the end ( cheers my friend) to the point of the people hating him, I would offer up he pushed open dialogue up a notch to where many of those open dialogue is new territory and are used to “ not talking “ ( I go back to social media on that one and the solitude many lives are )

I'm hard pressed to understand how maintaining a "watch list" of college faculty, most of whom were from minority groups, is designed to push "open dialogue".

DoubleEgger · September 16

This guy is so full of crap.

RIP--Charlie Kirk

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