Real Sports w/Brian Gumbel - maybe the best sports segment I've ever seen. Must watch.

nolaegghead

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B-gb2Fnhz5o

nolaegghead

This is a tale of a golf course.  Nothing to do with politics.  

HeavyG

"The choice between sanity and insanity". 

I have a dream that one day citizens everywhere will tell billionaire's that make promises and talk taxpayers into giving them hundreds of millions of tax dollars for stadiums, ballparks, arenas, etc. to go fvck themselves.

The folks in San Diego did the right thing so the Chargers are now going to sucker the fine folks in LA. The Redskins are now trying to sucker the taxpayers in either MD or VA to buy/build them a new playground. May we find the strength that San Diegans had to say enough is enough.

JohnInCarolina

I'm not sure why we should listen to all of these people he's screwed over.  They obviously have a bone to pick and are biased.

Just because someone has failed spectacularly in their personal and business lives, and has a history of screwing clients and contractors over, doesn't mean we shouldn't give him a chance at a job that literally impacts millions of people in this country and elsewhere.

NPHuskerFL

I love you like brothers @JohnInCarolina @nolaegghead you know this. 
"If you like your healthcare plan you can keep it"  "families will see healthcare premiums decrease"

Eggcelsior

NPHuskerFL said:

I love you like brothers @JohnInCarolina @nolaegghead you know this. 
"If you like your healthcare plan you can keep it"  "families will see healthcare premiums decrease"

For what it's worth, I did get to keep my plan and my premiums decreased.

¯\_(ツ)_/¯

GATraveller

Give the people their entertainment. 

I didn't keep my plan and my premiums more than doubled and the plan is more than doubly as worser. 

Eggcelsior

GATraveller said:

Give the people their entertainment. 

I didn't keep my plan and my premiums more than doubled and the plan is more than doubly as worser. 

Grammar Fox is going to get you.

https://youtu.be/Ltb_14CWqDA

pgprescott

Eggcelsior said:

NPHuskerFL said:

I love you like brothers @JohnInCarolina @nolaegghead you know this. 
"If you like your healthcare plan you can keep it"  "families will see healthcare premiums decrease"

For what it's worth, I did get to keep my plan and my premiums decreased.

¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Deductibles too? BS? Coverage within the plan reduced? 

Eoin

Can someone explain the health insurance / Obamacare thing to an outsider please?  Why is it bad, is it basically cross subsidising the poorer with the premiums from those who can pay their insurance?

jonnymack

JohnInCarolina said:

I'm not sure why we should listen to all of these people he's screwed over.  They obviously have a bone to pick and are biased.

Just because someone has failed spectacularly in their personal and business lives, and has a history of screwing clients and contractors over, doesn't mean we shouldn't give him a chance at a job that literally impacts millions of people in this country and elsewhere.

Things will be more better. Trust me. 

Eggcelsior

pgprescott said:

Eggcelsior said:

NPHuskerFL said:

I love you like brothers @JohnInCarolina @nolaegghead you know this. 
"If you like your healthcare plan you can keep it"  "families will see healthcare premiums decrease"

For what it's worth, I did get to keep my plan and my premiums decreased.

¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Deductibles too? BS? Coverage within the plan reduced? 

Nope. Literally, everything stayed the same with the exception that the premium dropped by 60% or so. 

Spaightlabs

Everything Drumpf said during his campaign is true, and everyone is going to be covered beautifully.

"we will have housing, and things."
"it will look exactly the same, but better"

Classic Trumpsims.

nolaegghead

Spaightlabs said:

Everything Drumpf said during his campaign is true, and everyone is going to be covered beautifully.

Whew!!  What a relief!!!

lousubcap

@Eoin I won't try to address Obama Care other than to say that the health care system needed something to move it from the status quo.  At least Obama care caused disruption to the health care industry.  For me, that was a positive regardless of where we are today.  There are many opportunities for change and improvement and now there is some dialog.
BTW - the Republicans have had six years to come up with a better plan-I'm sure it's imminent as it has been for quite a while.  Just kidding with that last sentence.  If it was easy something would have been offered by now.  
Big business (health insurance companies) wants to go back to prior to Obama care.  That should not happen. They should open the health insurance market across state-lines (more competition).  Doubt that will happen due to pressure from the companies.  Enough for now.

JohnInCarolina

I just find it hilarious that there's this notion of some unicorn that will still allow for all of the "good parts" of the ACA like pre-existing conditions without any of the "bad parts" like the mandate and somehow also be better and cost less. As though math and statistics don't exist.

I guess someone didn't study the Iron Triangle of Health Care while they were attending Wharton.

nolaegghead

JohnInCarolina said:

I just find it hilarious that there's this notion of some unicorn that will still allow for all of the "good parts" of the ACA like pre-existing conditions without any of the "bad parts" like the mandate and somehow also be better and cost lest.  As though math and statistics don't exist.

I guess someone didn't study the Iron Triangle of Health Care while they were attending Wharton.

Maybe their new plan involves "money trees"?  I dunno.  I understand the economics of health care and would be happy to explain it to anyone.

YukonRon

This is more than just about the ACA. This is about having to look the rest of the world in the eye, and tell them, as Americans, this is the best we could do.

Shame on us for allowing ourselves to be duped into having to choose between either Hillary or Donald.

I just hope, for the next election, the voting citizenship of our great country has a massive load of IQ shoved in their brains.

Do your research. You owe it to the rest of the world, because they depend upon us for doing what is right. We failed them this time. I hope we never fail again.

JustineCaseyFeldown

-open up insurance to out of state insurers (more competition)
-require insurers to reimburse all healthcare givers, rather than just those doctors/systems they negotiate deals with
-require everyone to have insurance (because those of us paying higher premiums are already paying for their health care anyway, and usually in an emergency)
-charge more to people with unhealthy lifestyle factors (obesity, smoking, alcohol, etc.), just like you would charge more to insure a driver who has chronic history of moving violations
-require coverage of pre-existing conditions (otherwise you may never be able to move from one job to another and/or switch insurers)

most of, if not all of these, were proposed as a part of the whole process of writing the ACA , some from both sides of the aisle, too IIRC.

they were gutted by the lobbyists, whose job it is to maintain the status quo.

Eoin

@lousubcap We have a taxpayer funded system here, so everyone gets the same treatment, or they can insure separately if they want a 'premium' product, but don't get to opt out of the tax if they do.

Our system is creaking at the seams with demand because of funding and various dubious policy decisions made by various Governments, but generally if you need to get fixed up in an emergency you will get treatment and it will be free at point of use.

pgprescott

Eggcelsior said:

pgprescott said:

Eggcelsior said:

NPHuskerFL said:

I love you like brothers @JohnInCarolina @nolaegghead you know this. 
"If you like your healthcare plan you can keep it"  "families will see healthcare premiums decrease"

For what it's worth, I did get to keep my plan and my premiums decreased.

¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Deductibles too? BS? Coverage within the plan reduced? 

Nope. Literally, everything stayed the same with the exception that the premium dropped by 60% or so. 

BS! unless it is subsidized by others in some way. Simply don't believe that. You have a pet unicorn as well?

Eoin

JustineCaseyFeldown said:

-require everyone to have insurance (because those of us paying higher premiums are already paying for their health care anyway, and usually in an emergency)

Most of Europe has this model, either through private insurers of state run insurance.

In the UK, we pay National Insurance as an employer and as an employee, which is supposed to pay for health care, social security and basic state pensions.  This has been used by successive Governments as general taxation and not segregated into money for specific programmes.  State pensions especially have not been funded, they have run it like a Ponzi scheme and now people are living longer and the elderly population is increasing, the scheme doesn't add up.

Lifestyle is interesting - there are certain procedures here in certain areas (not everywhere) where people are told to lose weight or they don't get the hip (or other) operation, or don't get the cancer drug if they carry on smoking (sick people sat in gowns outside the hospital smoking is a very sad sight).

pgprescott

JustineCaseyFeldown said:

-open up insurance to out of state insurers (more competition)
-require insurers to reimburse all healthcare givers, rather than just those doctors/systems they negotiate deals with
-require everyone to have insurance (because those of us paying higher premiums are already paying for their health care anyway, and usually in an emergency)
-charge more to people with unhealthy lifestyle factors (obesity, smoking, alcohol, etc.), just like you would charge more to insure a driver who has chronic history of moving violations
-require coverage of pre-existing conditions (otherwise you may never be able to move from one job to another and/or switch insurers)

most of, if not all of these, were proposed as a part of the whole process of writing the ACA , some from both sides of the aisle, too IIRC.

they were gutted by the lobbyists, whose job it is to maintain the status quo.

Also, establish pricing. If you go to the hospital and ask what an appendectomy cost, they will ask what kind of insurance you have. What difference should that make? The price should be the price. It's not a used car. The price can be set a number of negotiable ways, but it should be set. It's a scam. The insurance industry in cahoots with the providers has remove normal capitalistic forces from the market. 

nolaegghead

pgprescott said:

JustineCaseyFeldown said:

-open up insurance to out of state insurers (more competition)
-require insurers to reimburse all healthcare givers, rather than just those doctors/systems they negotiate deals with
-require everyone to have insurance (because those of us paying higher premiums are already paying for their health care anyway, and usually in an emergency)
-charge more to people with unhealthy lifestyle factors (obesity, smoking, alcohol, etc.), just like you would charge more to insure a driver who has chronic history of moving violations
-require coverage of pre-existing conditions (otherwise you may never be able to move from one job to another and/or switch insurers)

most of, if not all of these, were proposed as a part of the whole process of writing the ACA , some from both sides of the aisle, too IIRC.

they were gutted by the lobbyists, whose job it is to maintain the status quo.

Also, establish pricing. If you go to the hospital and ask what an appendectomy cost, they will ask what kind of insurance you have. What difference should that make? The price should be the price. It's not a used car. The price can be set a number of negotiable ways, but it should be set. It's a scam. The insurance industry in cahoots with the providers has remove normal capitalistic forces from the market. 

hmmm...I wonder who does have a set price...could it be medicare/aid?

Eggcelsior

pgprescott said:

Eggcelsior said:

pgprescott said:

Eggcelsior said:

NPHuskerFL said:

I love you like brothers @JohnInCarolina @nolaegghead you know this. 
"If you like your healthcare plan you can keep it"  "families will see healthcare premiums decrease"

For what it's worth, I did get to keep my plan and my premiums decreased.

¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Deductibles too? BS? Coverage within the plan reduced? 

Nope. Literally, everything stayed the same with the exception that the premium dropped by 60% or so. 

BS! unless it is subsidized by others in some way. Simply don't believe that. You have a pet unicorn as well?

You do realize that your reality and life experiences may not match other people's? Your expressed opinion is the literal definition of confirmation bias.

nolaegghead

Most health insurance is through your employer.  I don't understand him either Dylan.

pgprescott

Eggcelsior said:

pgprescott said:

Eggcelsior said:

pgprescott said:

Eggcelsior said:

NPHuskerFL said:

I love you like brothers @JohnInCarolina @nolaegghead you know this. 
"If you like your healthcare plan you can keep it"  "families will see healthcare premiums decrease"

For what it's worth, I did get to keep my plan and my premiums decreased.

¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Deductibles too? BS? Coverage within the plan reduced? 

Nope. Literally, everything stayed the same with the exception that the premium dropped by 60% or so. 

BS! unless it is subsidized by others in some way. Simply don't believe that. You have a pet unicorn as well?

You do realize that your reality and life experiences may not match other people's? Your expressed opinion is the literal definition of confirmation bias.

Say what you want. I don't believe you. Without some sort of outside factor, it is illogical.

NPHuskerFL

JohnInCarolina said:

I just find it hilarious that there's this notion of some unicorn that will still allow for all of the "good parts" of the ACA like pre-existing conditions without any of the "bad parts" like the mandate and somehow also be better and cost less. As though math and statistics don't exist.

I guess someone didn't study the Iron Triangle of Health Care while they were attending Wharton.

The more things change the more they stay the same. I seriously doubt there is a clear cut healthcare plan or policy that'll make everybody happy.  It's far easier to piss and moan. I challenge both sides of the aisle to see the good in each other's ideas in lieu of their faults. Me included. 

pgprescott

nolaegghead said:

Most health insurance is through your employer.  I don't understand him either Dylan.

Someone pays genius. Its still at a cost. Don't believe me, ask your CFO.

How bout we tax that benefit as income? Oh wait, that would kick in real soon. The idiot in chief just wanted to make sure he was out of office prior to implementing that part. 

pgprescott

nolaegghead said:

pgprescott said:

JustineCaseyFeldown said:

-open up insurance to out of state insurers (more competition)
-require insurers to reimburse all healthcare givers, rather than just those doctors/systems they negotiate deals with
-require everyone to have insurance (because those of us paying higher premiums are already paying for their health care anyway, and usually in an emergency)
-charge more to people with unhealthy lifestyle factors (obesity, smoking, alcohol, etc.), just like you would charge more to insure a driver who has chronic history of moving violations
-require coverage of pre-existing conditions (otherwise you may never be able to move from one job to another and/or switch insurers)

most of, if not all of these, were proposed as a part of the whole process of writing the ACA , some from both sides of the aisle, too IIRC.

they were gutted by the lobbyists, whose job it is to maintain the status quo.

Also, establish pricing. If you go to the hospital and ask what an appendectomy cost, they will ask what kind of insurance you have. What difference should that make? The price should be the price. It's not a used car. The price can be set a number of negotiable ways, but it should be set. It's a scam. The insurance industry in cahoots with the providers has remove normal capitalistic forces from the market. 

hmmm...I wonder who does have a set price...could it be medicare/aid?

That's the part i do find troubling, but it has to be in combo with all the other free market ideas mentioned prior. Even if they set their own prices and were required to post them publicly, there would be competition. We would not be in the dark. we could choose to pay for the service we wanted based upon not only cost, but convenience and impenitence.

nolaegghead

@pgprescott Did you watch the video?