Knife sharpeners

divr71

I need help on sharpening my knives. I am asking for help on what is the best equipment/technique for sharpening my knives..

Mattman3969

Either get the Ken Onion Work Sharp or its little brother.  I've got the little brother and it works good but wish I had the ability to have more angles.  

http://www.sharpeningsupplies.com/Work-Sharp-Ken-Onion-Edition-Knife-Sharpener-P505.aspx?gclid=CM7u4pWGssoCFYGDaQodL0AEbA

JR_Baas

I have the Ken Onion and it works great!

HeavyG

That is a really open ended question. How much time, money, and effort do you want to put into really learning how to sharpen knives?

Here's a good place to get some tips: https://www.sharpeningforum.com/

Many other sites that discuss all this in depth.

Google is your friend. As is Youtube.

Chubbs

Mattman3969 said:

Either get the Ken Onion Work Sharp or its little brother.  I've got the little brother and it works good but wish I had the ability to have more angles.  

http://www.sharpeningsupplies.com/Work-Sharp-Ken-Onion-Edition-Knife-Sharpener-P505.aspx?gclid=CM7u4pWGssoCFYGDaQodL0AEbA

I have the little brother and I don't see the need for anything more. It has sharpened all of my knives with ease. It even sharpened and old crappy knife I couldn't cut myself on if I tried and turned it into a scary little knife. 

SGH

divr71 said:

I need help on sharpening my knives. I am asking for help on what is the best equipment/technique for sharpening my knives..

Well my friend, there really is no one "best" stone or sharpener for every blade type and edge out there. I recommend no matter what you decide to go with that you add at least one knife steel to your blade care arsenal. Why? Most knives used for cutting meat (if you don't hit bone or wood) are not truly dull or lost their edge. The edge has simply been rolled and simply needs straightening. I'm not saying that knives do not get dull because they certainly do. However a lot of inexperienced guys wear their knives out by constant sharpening when a simple touch up with the steel would have returned the edge to appropriate sharpness. If you will use the steel after every few cuts (it only takes seconds) you will find that you rarely have to recut the edge. Thus extending the useful blade life my friend. You would be suprised at just how few people use a steel. Their reasoning is beyond me. 

shucker

i use one of these for everyday honing.  For sharpening, theres a local guy who does a fantastic job for $3 per blade so we drop knives off with him a couple times a year.  

Lit

SGH said:

divr71 said:

I need help on sharpening my knives. I am asking for help on what is the best equipment/technique for sharpening my knives..

Well my friend, there really is no one "best" stone or sharpener for every blade type and edge out there. I recommend no matter what you decide to go with that you add at least one knife steel to your blade care arsenal. Why? Most knives used for cutting meat (if you don't hit bone or wood) are not truly dull or lost their edge. The edge has simply been rolled and simply needs straightening. I'm not saying that knives do not get dull because they certainly do. However a lot of inexperienced guys wear their knives out by constant sharpening when a simple touch up with the steel would have returned the edge to appropriate sharpness. If you will use the steel after every few cuts (it only takes seconds) you will find that you rarely have to recut the edge. Thus extending the useful blade life my friend. You would be suprised at just how few people use a steel. Their reasoning is beyond me. 

Steels are 500 grit. My cutting stone is 1000 and I only use that once or maybe twice a year. My touch up stone is 6000 grit. I would never ever let a steel touch one of my knives. 

SGH

Lit said:

Steels are 500 grit. My cutting stone is 1000 and I only use that once or maybe twice a year. My touch up stone is 6000 grit. I would never ever let a steel touch one of my knives. 

The "steels" that I use are not true steel. They are high grade ceramic. Their "grit" is 2,200. I assure you my friend that your 6,000 grit stone is removing more blade material than the 2,200 grit steel is. Even the 500 grit steel that you mention will remove less material than your 6,000 grit stone. There is a huge difference in sharpening and honing. Your stone is designed to cut or "sharpen". The steel is not. It is designed to hone or "push". This is why a steel will not sharpen a truly dull knife. It removes minimal material, thus a stone is required. This is honestly not me messing with you. Simply stating the facts my friend. In no way what so ever will a steel hurt your blade if used properly. And it certainly will not remove as much metal as a stone. Here is a basic tutorial on sharpening vs honing. Hope that this helps my friend. 


http://www.thekitchn.com/did-you-know-this-steel-doesnt-actually-sharpen-knives-211855

Dyal_SC

SGH said:

Lit said:

Steels are 500 grit. My cutting stone is 1000 and I only use that once or maybe twice a year. My touch up stone is 6000 grit. I would never ever let a steel touch one of my knives. 

The "steels" that I use are not true steel. They are high grade ceramic. Their "grit" is 2,200. I assure you my friend that your 6,000 grit stone is removing more blade material than the 2,200 grit steel is. Even the 500 grit steel that you mention will remove less material than your 6,000 grit stone. There is a huge difference in sharpening and honing. Your stone is designed to cut or "sharpen". The steel is not. It is designed to hone or "push". This is why a steel will not sharpen a truly dull knife. It removes minimal material, thus a stone is required. This honestly not me messing with you. Simply stating the facts my friend. In no way what so ever will a steel hurt your blade if used properly. And it certainly will not remove as muck metal as a stone. Here is a basic tutorial on sharpening vs honing. Hope that this helps my friend. 


http://www.thekitchn.com/did-you-know-this-steel-doesnt-actually-sharpen-knives-211855

You, sir, have a wealth of knowledge.    I need to pick your brain more often.  

cajunrph

SGH said:

divr71 said:

I need help on sharpening my knives. I am asking for help on what is the best equipment/technique for sharpening my knives..

Well my friend, there really is no one "best" stone or sharpener for every blade type and edge out there. I recommend no matter what you decide to go with that you add at least one knife steel to your blade care arsenal. Why? Most knives used for cutting meat (if you don't hit bone or wood) are not truly dull or lost their edge. The edge has simply been rolled and simply needs straightening. I'm not saying that knives do not get dull because they certainly do. However a lot of inexperienced guys wear their knives out by constant sharpening when a simple touch up with the steel would have returned the edge to appropriate sharpness. If you will use the steel after every few cuts (it only takes seconds) you will find that you rarely have to recut the edge. Thus extending the useful blade life my friend. You would be suprised at just how few people use a steel. Their reasoning is beyond me. 

^^This.  The vast majority of the time a knife only needs to be honed. The knife is dull because the edge is curled over. A honing steel will do you wonders. Very rarely would you need to sharpen them if you are not cutting bones. I learned this from a straight razor forum. They rarely would sharpen their blades. They used the strops to reset the edge. Get yourself a honing steel and see for yourself. 

Lit

SGH said:

Lit said:

Steels are 500 grit. My cutting stone is 1000 and I only use that once or maybe twice a year. My touch up stone is 6000 grit. I would never ever let a steel touch one of my knives. 

The "steels" that I use are not true steel. They are high grade ceramic. Their "grit" is 2,200. I assure you my friend that your 6,000 grit stone is removing more blade material than the 2,200 grit steel is. Even the 500 grit steel that you mention will remove less material than your 6,000 grit stone. There is a huge difference in sharpening and honing. Your stone is designed to cut or "sharpen". The steel is not. It is designed to hone or "push". This is why a steel will not sharpen a truly dull knife. It removes minimal material, thus a stone is required. This honestly not me messing with you. Simply stating the facts my friend. In no way what so ever will a steel hurt your blade if used properly. And it certainly will not remove as muck metal as a stone. Here is a basic tutorial on sharpening vs honing. Hope that this helps my friend. 


http://www.thekitchn.com/did-you-know-this-steel-doesnt-actually-sharpen-knives-211855

I bought a ceramic rod after looking around the highest grit I found anywhere was 1200 grit. I gave it away after lots of questions and reading on knife forums a high grit stone is hands down the better option. Nobody on the forums recommended using a steel or rod. You would have a very hard time convincing me how a 2200 grit rod where you are putting all the pressure onto a small section of the blade removes less from the knife than a 6000 grit stone with the pressure distributed over a much larger area. 

1move

I sharpen my own knives and there is a lot of guys that do the best articles I have read are in these three links that will help you understand it a bit further and far better.

http://modernsurvivalblog.com/survival-skills/sharpening-knives-101/

https://offgridweb.com/gear/a-guide-to-knife-sharpeners-and-sharpening/

http://www.allselfsustained.com/how-to-sharpen-a-knife-while-minimizing-mistakes-and-maximizing-cutting-edge-performance/

SGH

Lit said:
 You would have a very hard time convincing me how a 2200 grit rod where you are putting all the pressure onto a small section of the blade removes less from the knife than a 6000 grit stone with the pressure distributed over a much larger area. 

Again, not trying to argue, but seeing is believing. Simply take a old junk knife and make 10 swipes on a rod and look at it under a microscope. Then make 10 passes on the finest stone that you have and look at it again under a microscope. There will be no denying what you are looking at. It's a simple matter of the design of the two tools. One is designed to cut and the other is not. It's like comparing a huge chainsaw to a hand held hacksaw. For all its power and wickedness, the simple hacksaw will cut circles around the chainsaw on metal. One is designed to cut wood, one is designed to cut metal. The same principal applies to the stone and the steel rod. A simple matter of design. 

Lit

@sgh if a rod doesn't cut why are there different grits?

cajunrph

If you want to learn how to keep your knives their sharpest, go to a Straight Razor shaving forum. Those have to be surgical sharp. They hone their blades daily. Sharpen very rarely. Like SGH said, we're talking about two different processes here. Just try a honing steel on your knife and see for yourself. 

HeavyG

cajunrph said:

If you want to learn how to keep your knives their sharpest, go to a Straight Razor shaving forum. Those have to be surgical sharp. They hone their blades daily. Sharpen very rarely. Like SGH said, we're talking about two different processes here. Just try a honing steel on your knife and see for yourself. 

Kitchen knives (for the vast majority of users) do not need to be literally "razor sharp". The finer and more polished an edge you put on your knife the more frequently you'll have to work on that knife to maintain that edge.

It's neat to get that mirror polish on a knife but kitchen knives should be sharp (duh) but still have a bit of toothiness. Unless you are a sushi chef you don't need to go beyond a 1K or 2K grit. Unless, of course, you just really, really enjoy the whole sharpening process. Which, I will admit can be kind of Zen-like.

As Sgh and others have said regular use of a honing rod (preferably ceramic) will greatly ease your burden.

cajunrph

HeavyG said:

cajunrph said:

Just try a honing steel on your knife and see for yourself. 

As Sgh and others have said regular use of a honing rod (preferably ceramic) will greatly ease your burden.

That's exactly what I said. Honing steel is a mediator for honing rod. We are in agreement here. 

HeavyG

cajunrph said:

HeavyG said:

cajunrph said:

Just try a honing steel on your knife and see for yourself. 

As Sgh and others have said regular use of a honing rod (preferably ceramic) will greatly ease your burden.

That's exactly what I said. Honing steel is a mediator for honing rod. We are in agreement here. 

True, but if one is at the straight razor forum the sharpening advice is going to be a bit different than if someone looking to learn how to sharpen kitchen knives went to some place like http://www.kitchenknifeforums.com/

cajunrph

HeavyG said:

cajunrph said:

HeavyG said:

cajunrph said:

Just try a honing steel on your knife and see for yourself. 

As Sgh and others have said regular use of a honing rod (preferably ceramic) will greatly ease your burden.

That's exactly what I said. Honing steel is a mediator for honing rod. We are in agreement here. 

True, but if one is at the straight razor forum the sharpening advice is going to be a bit different than if someone looking to learn how to sharpen kitchen knives went to some place like http://www.kitchenknifeforums.com/

The cutting edge is the same on both. There will be no difference in how you optionally prepare a cutting edge. One cuts hairs, the other cuts meat. You ever see professional chefs sharpen their knives before making a cut, or do you mainly see them use a honing rod of some sort before they make the cut? Like I said before, give the honing rod a try on a dull knife, one not used to whack through bones. And see what it does. 

Lit

SGH said:

Lit said:
 You would have a very hard time convincing me how a 2200 grit rod where you are putting all the pressure onto a small section of the blade removes less from the knife than a 6000 grit stone with the pressure distributed over a much larger area. 

Again, not trying to argue, but seeing is believing. Simply take a old junk knife and make 10 swipes on a rod and look at it under a microscope. Then make 10 passes on the finest stone that you have and look at it again under a microscope. There will be no denying what you are looking at. It's a simple matter of the design of the two tools. One is designed to cut and the other is not. It's like comparing a huge chainsaw to a hand held hacksaw. For all its power and wickedness, the simple hacksaw will cut circles around the chainsaw on metal. One is designed to cut wood, one is designed to cut metal. The same principal applies to the stone and the steel rod. A simple matter of design. 

I use a lupe to sharpen my knives. I will try to find my post on this topic on the chefknivestogo forum. The reason I asked my original question there is I had sharpened and polished my knives to 60000k grit and then after a couple uses I used the ceramic rod and I could visually tell without the lupe that my blade was more toothy after I put the rod to it than before (It had dulled my blade). I think this all comes down to what you prefer like Heavy G said above many people think a knife is sharp between 1k-2k and like the toothyness. If thats what you prefer then a rod or steel is good for you. I keep my knives really sharp where they are always polished and hone on the loaded stop at a half micron most of the time which takes about 30 seconds. Your initial post mentioned wearing a blade down but I have fixed chips and nicks in friends knives before and even a small 1/16" chip will take 500 passes on a 1000 grit stone to take that much off the knife to even the blade out. When I sharpen my knives once or twice a year I do 8 passes on each side at 1000 and then 8 passes on each side at 6000 and then strop. At that rate even twice a year its going to take me 30 years to take 1/16" off my knife.

fishlessman

dmt diamond stone 1200 grit for my kitchen knives, very fast even on the harder to sharpen knives. belgium yellow cotecule for my razor 10,000 grit

hondabbq

So every classically trained chef is doing it all wrong?

Lit

hondabbq said:

So every classically trained chef is doing it all wrong?

Not sure who you are referring to here but I didn't say a steel is wrong. A chef is using his knife all day every day so keeping it polished and razor sharp is not what they are going for they are usually going for just sharp enough to use. And saying every classically trained chef is not a very good statement if you look at the knife forums there are chefs that range from using a steel to using high grit stones to hone and even chefs that say they sharpen their knives every day. I guess it comes down to how sharp you want to keep your knives and how much time you want to spend doing it. I saw that putting a rod on my knife visible made it more dull but I never let my knives get to the point where a rod would be an improvement. If I havent used the strop in a couple weeks a couple passes on the 6000 stone and I am good to go again or if I do remember to strop them even every couple uses they stay polished and will shave your arm. 

gdenby

@divr71,

If you have fair manual skills, and the inclination to practice, there are lots of of hand powered systems out there.

If you don't have the time or deftness, it might be better if you took your knives to a reputable sharpener.

Then, get a couple of strops and grades of stropping compound. Or a honing steel so called, tho' I've had better results from stropping. That way, the edge can have the frequent touch up it will most likely need, and someone else can go thru the trouble of making the edge as exact as possible.

Otherwise:

Most of the older electric powered kitchen sharpeners were disasters. Inexact, and too coarse. Some of the models made in the past few years are much better, and considered passable for standard and good knives. Variable or multiple edge bevels should be available. Note that even new power systems can make it easy to go too far, and sometimes can do serious damage if misused.

As far as I can tell, more people who want a good edge go with hand powered. After a few tries, I decided than I'm too clumsy to use a basic stone set. I can't hold a steady edge. I looked over various sets that provide fixed angles, and settled on the Apex Edge Pro. Currently, there's a similar model made by Wicked Edge. DMT and Spyderco make simpler (and cheaper) sets that are quite good.

For my kitchen drawer knives, the one's my wife abuses, I have a hand sharpener from Harbor Freight, cost maybe $2. Its wearing out, but 10 - 15 passes will keep the 2nd hand store blades as sharp as they should be.

Hi54putty

I have got to stop reading this forum. Although Amazon would probably call me to ask what happened. 

xfire_ATX

I dont own this my chef neighbor does- its puts an incredibly good edge on my knives.

http://v-sharp.com/products/v-sharp-classic-ii

Jeepster47

xfire_ATX said:

I dont own this my chef neighbor does- its puts an incredibly good edge on my knives.

http://v-sharp.com/products/v-sharp-classic-ii

Whew ... finally a gadget shows up on the BGE Forum and I can pass on buying it!  It looks fantastic ... look at all those rods, and levers, and crossed stones ... kind of warmed my heart.  Then I read the seller's advertising ... "Cheap Metal Frame" ... really?  Wow, high marks for honesty.  Oh damn, it's discontinued and there is no warranty on ... well, no warranty on anything.  Looked at the reviews ... hmmm ... is their rating system reversed?  Damn, 16 reviews and they are universal in their one-star rating.  Now, if it was April 1st I'd understand ... but it's not ...  @xfire_ATX I'll have to watch you in the future.

Cheers mate.

Simcan

I use Chef'sChoice 15 Trizor XV EdgeSelect Electric Knife Sharpener which I got just because it was the top-rated one on Cook's Illustrated. Works great...I use it only about once a year and I use a honing steel pretty regularly. Not sure there is a "right" answer despite the very strong views on this chain, but I can tell you my knives (I use Global for the most part) are always very sharp, so it works for me.

DeltaNu1142

Lit said:

hondabbq said:

So every classically trained chef is doing it all wrong?

A chef is using his knife all day every day so keeping it polished and razor sharp is not what they are going for they are usually going for just sharp enough to use.

Categorically, quite the opposite. 

gdenby

Simcan said:

Not sure there is a "right" answer...

I'd have to agree. Various steels need different edge treatments.

The classic example is between very hard, brittle steels that can be made really sharp, maybe a total 12 - 15 degree bevel. Perfect for the smoothest cuts, but prone to chip. Then there is the tougher steels more commonly used that will never hold 15 degrees, may not even hold 30 long, but almost never chip, and can be used banging against bones w. little grief.

I forget what steel it was, maybe S30V, that has carbides that are larger than the grain of the steel crystals that hold them. If the edge is made crazy sharp, after a few uses, it get duller because the carbides pull out. Then after more use, it seems sharper as the steel matrix get smoothed w. use. I read a forum where quite a few guys waste a lot of time super-fining the edges, only to have them fail.