OT - Tankless water heater - or water heater with tank

Foghorn

Question for the experts here.

Option 1: Replace current water heater that has some warrantee coverage  - (with tank - 75 gallons) - would not be free due to labor costs.

Option 2:  Get a new tankless water heater for $3500 more than the quoted price on option #1.

What say ye?

Thanks in advance.

BigGreenKev

Not an expert but I think some places consider tankless a "boiler" so make sure that is your all in price and there isn't extra for new vents. Hopefully that rings a bell for someone that knows more than me.

Ozzie_Isaac

Go tank with a recirculating loop.  No waiting for hot water.  I prefer a gas water heater feeding an electric water heater.  Gas heats it fast, then electric maintains the temp with little energy input.

Ybabpmuts

I don't understand tankless. If it didn't have a tank you should call it tank free. If they don't call it tank free, I'm afraid they might be charging you for a tank anyway, just maybe less than the last time, hence the name. 

That's what I say, but don't call me ye. I'm just a regular guy who's trying to help you, and using words like less and free but just for tanks. Believe me, on other forums, I use words like more and costly

lkapigian

Plus 1 on recirculation loop and skip tankless , I’ve watched them for years, they have there place, cost of ownership for single family dwelling not worth it IMO 

alaskanassasin

+1 on the tank

fishlessman

I'm sick of changing tanks but 3500 is silly.  

Ybabpmuts

lkapigian said:

Plus 1 on recirculation loop and skip tankless , I’ve watched them for years, they have there place, cost of ownership for single family dwelling not worth it IMO 

This is sound advise. Anybody who's spent so much time watching tankless systems has got to learn something in all that time. I have to admit, I'd make maybe 6 months watching a tank system, but if someone took the tank away, I'd last maybe three months. My mind must be tank-centric, there's no other explanation.

stv8r

lkapigian said:

Plus 1 on recirculation loop and skip tankless , I’ve watched them for years, they have there place, cost of ownership for single family dwelling not worth it IMO 

This is sound advice.  Skip the tankless. 

lkapigian

Ybabpmuts said:

lkapigian said:

Plus 1 on recirculation loop and skip tankless , I’ve watched them for years, they have there place, cost of ownership for single family dwelling not worth it IMO 

This is sound advise. Anybody who's spent so much time watching tankless systems has got to learn something in all that time. I have to admit, I'd make maybe 6 months watching a tank system, but if someone took the tank away, I'd last maybe three months. My mind must be tank-centric, there's no other explanation.

LoL

fishlessman

lkapigian said:

Plus 1 on recirculation loop and skip tankless , I’ve watched them for years, they have there place, cost of ownership for single family dwelling not worth it IMO 

Beach house rental in a cellar that floods at high tide in the winter. Old copper  tank lasted over 60 years. New tanks not so good. Thinking about it there.climate change seems to flood things, but it floods a few times every year

kl8ton

I'd go tank.  

I'm just not sold on tankless. Had 75 gallon tank in last house with very quick recovery.  At times,  both dishwashers were running and 6 kids were bathing one after the other while two speed queen washers were churning away.  Never went cold.  

caliking

We have 2 big tankful/tank/tanky water heaters. In the attic. Seems like a bad idea, but its pretty common around here.

It makes me nervy that a water leak is just waiting to happen. So, I've been considering tankless water heaters when these need to be replaced. 

Legume

caliking said:

We have 2 big tankful/tank/tanky water heaters. In the attic. Seems like a bad idea, but its pretty common around here.

It makes me nervy that a water leak is just waiting to happen. So, I've been considering tankless water heaters when these need to be replaced. 

We had the same in Austin.  Was going to replace with tankless but decided to move instead.  🤷‍♂️

I will be putting solar on the roof soon and will eventually replace my NG tank heater with electric tankless when the tank is done.

SamIAm2

@Legume - Would not go electric tankless for several reasons. Our experience with an on demand tankless was fine for the first several years. It required running larger gage wire and an electric panel at installation site with 40 amp circuit to operate, so your solar system might be problematic on cloudy days.

The unit was installed in SWMBO's closet because access to water was available there for the two sinks and the shower in the Master bedroom. Losing closet space was an issue she did not appreciate.

Maintenance involved pumping vinegar thru the system to keep the heating elements clean because of corrosion from hard water provided by the city. Recommended maintenance schedule was every 6 months and that meant moving clothing out of the way to perform. Again, not appreciated by SWMBO.

Replacing the heating elements was a nightmare when they could no longer be cleaned with normal maintenance. When the unit eventually failed the water leak did damage to drywall, baseboards, and carpet. Wound up running PEX thru the attic from the hot water heater in our screened porch area. Wasn't cheap during the heat of Florida summer but SWMBO did get her closet space back.  

Ybabpmuts

"Losing closet space was an issue she did not appreciate"

It's always about them and their closet space isn't it. Here you went all tankless and whatnot and still she didn't appreciate it. I hope you pointed out that you could have put in a system with a tank, or for spite, maybe a tank and a half, but you didn't did you? 
It could be worse, I put a tank system in my wife's closet and now all her clothes are stored under the bed in these little baskets with wheels. The only good thing about that is I get to see her bend over near my side of the bed almost every morning. The bad thing about that, is we're old and half the time she miscalculates and headbutts me in the process. Last Thursday she jammed her head right into my thigh, which sounds like fun at first, but she has maybe the largest cranium I've seen outside of a museum, and when it's coming for you, there's almost no place to hide from it. It's like a planet with hair and googly eyes. The only thing that saves me most of the time is her pistol grip ears. I never shot a gun before, but just using those grips to point her face at targets, you can just feel the power in that.

I'd say go with the tank system in her closet if she isn't bending over near your side of the bed enough, but if she doesn't have pistol grip ears, it's your call. Maybe she has a pistol grip nose and that's enough for you both, who am I to figure these tough things out for us both anyway. I don't even know your wife, or her closet. I'm just telling you what works for us is all, and if you learn something in the process, it's a bonus really.

lkapigian

LoL^^^^^^^

JohnInCarolina

We went through this whole thing a couple of years ago (prior to the pandemic) in our house.  Talked a lot to various vendors and utility guys.  We came to understand that tankless probably wasn't the best option for our home, just with how the whole thing was set up, where the heater was located, etc.  I got the sense that there are real variations between homes that make a difference here, so it's not a one-size-fits-all type deal.  

In the end we decided to just get a couple of new tanks.  It works miles better than our old one, and it's very unusual that we run out of hot water.  

fishlessman

my experience with the newer tanks is a 6 year warranty lasts as long as a 10 year/ 12 year. only difference is it costs more if you want the warranty.  my last one will warranty if it fails sooner but you need to ship it somewhere, not call the place you bought it which is another scam on its own. atleast they are easy to swap out, plumb it in so you just need a screw driver and an adjustable wrench

dbCooper

For those that may not know, water heater tanks have a sacrificial anode.  Replacing that anode every few years, schedule dependent on the hardness of the water in your area, will help to extend the life of your tank.

nolaegghead

I installed this sideways one back in 2006 or 2007.  Had a board go out after 10 years, got a free replacement after warranty (even though I did the work myself).  Otherwise no problems and I have a spare unit for parts. 

While out back, spotted Jazz

fishlessman

dbCooper said:

For those that may not know, water heater tanks have a sacrificial anode.  Replacing that anode every few years, schedule dependent on the hardness of the water in your area, will help to extend the life of your tank.

water inlet pipe failed on the last one, it had the 10 year sticker on it. dont fall for pricey stickers.  you CAN break a water heater replacing the anode

nolaegghead

You don’t buy tankless to save energy unless you are rarely home.  You buy them to get unlimited hot water or because you are limited on space.  Most tank heaters are plumbed with 1/2” gas pipe.  If you have to upgrade to 3/4” pipe (or larger), that will drive the price up.  I had to do that, but the main line was close and I did all the work myself because I have the tools, time and know how and I’m a cheap, and I mean CHEAP bastard.

Gulfcoastguy

My electric water heater with tank was in this house when I bought it in 2002. Listening to people at work it seems that the ones being replaced were mostly gas . Don't know if that applies as a general rule. If I has gas I might consider an on demand water heater and would definitely have a gas stove. Since I don't, I won't.

fishlessman

CHEAP AND LAZY here.  the one at the house went down in may, by november i had hot water again

Foghorn

So, our current water heater is gas and we would go with gas with either option.  Does that change things?

When the electricity goes out - like during SNOW-VID in February of 2021 - does that affect the thermostat on either option - or can we get appropriately hot water with either option during a freeze?

nolaegghead

On demand water heaters require electricity to operate.  If you don’t have a generator, you are SOL when the Texas grid goes down.  You are better off in that case with a gas tank that doesn’t need electricity, some do.

nolaegghead

Gas tankless is generally much cheaper than electric depending on where it’s located.  An electric tankless may need over 100 amps of circuits.  Some houses only have 100 amp feeds.  

That said, we love our gas tankless.  

fishlessman

My tank one has a pilot and always works. If you pump from a well you need a generator though