Fire down below

Powak

Lately after lighting my egg and letting it warm up I’ve noticed my fire has been working it’s way down and not getting the top layer of coal burning. Even after sitting at 450-500 for an hour the top layer is still black unlit coal.  It all started when I pulled the shower drain out and installed the kickash can below my Kickash basket. It makes it so cooking raised direct now is like cooking indirect. I’m getting no little to no radiation from below. 

 The only way to get that top red bed of coals is to close the bottom vent, open the dome and let it sit 8-10 minutes like that. I’ve cleaned out the egg beneath the firebox, lit it in a variety of ways with the same result. Last night I was

grilling some chicken and I removed all the old ash and coal and put in all new fresh coal, lit 5 spots with my JJ George torch and an hour later the coals were burning below that top layer at 500°. I was able to get the top layer red after closing the bottom vent for while but as soon as I opened the bottom vent back up and closed the dome the fire went back down below the top coals. I had my PSWOO2 in and finally just ripped that out and put my grate at fire ring level left the dome open and finished the cook no problem.

The next thing I’m gonna try is removing the can and going back to using the shower drain below the basket.  When cleaning it I did notice my firebox has a crack that runs horizontal along the area that has the round holes. That shouldn’t cause it to burn any different right? 

YukonRon

No the crack should not. I have had the ring, almost in shards, and had no problems with my XL. I have changed my gaskets and the bands, and it is working awesome.

Ditch the can.

4TheGrillOfIt

Stupid question: you do have the door cut out of the can lined up with the fire bowl and door of the Egg, right?  Your fire bowl and can have free airflow?   The Can should cause no airflow issue whatsoever.

Powak

4TheGrillOfIt said:

Stupid question: you do have the door cut out of the can lined up with the fire owl and door of the Egg, right?  Your fire bowl and can have free airflow?   The Can should cause no airflow issue whatsoever.

Yup. Sure do. I checked that real close. Really the only thing I can surmise is the can makes the air flow so direct it causes the fire to hover in center, near the intake like that. I might be wrong about that but after burning thru all my old coal, cleaning out, loading with all new coal and still having the same result, that’s all I can come up with.

Bar

jdMyers

I learned after noticing that same effect.  I out my steel drain back in over the kick ash bowl.  Inuse both.  Works great.  Monitoring Temps, the exterior bottom of my egg doesn't get as super hot with the drain in vs just the K.A.B.  I was worried about.my granite under the egg sitting on mini nest legs or what ever they are called.  I figured the Japanese originals began using that steel drain for a reason.  I kept it.  Top coals burn even and thru.  Hope it helps jd.. also assuming you pull the basket and empty the ash around it.  

Powak

jdMyers said:

I learned after noticing that same effect.  I out my steel drain back in over the kick ash bowl.  Inuse both.  Works great.  Monitoring Temps, the exterior bottom of my egg doesn't get as super hot with the drain in vs just the K.A.B.  I was worried about.my granite under the egg sitting on mini nest legs or what ever they are called.  I figured the Japanese originals began using that steel drain for a reason.  I kept it.  Top coals burn even and thru.  Hope it helps jd.. also assuming you pull the basket and empty the ash around it.  

Man that’s definitely it. Glad someone else noticed this too. I thought I was going crazy and maybe using my Weber kettle too much and going back to the egg wondering if maybe it always burned that way. I find the shower drain works as a heat ballast too to slowly heat and cool the base of the egg. And those holes must evenly direct the airflow so you don’t just have one large round hot spot.

Powak

Bar said:

Here comes old Rosie she's looking mighty fine.
Here comes hot Nancy she's steppin' right on time.

Bar

Powak said

Here comes old Rosie she's looking mighty fine.
Here comes hot Nancy she's steppin' right on time

Love it!

Bar

I am actually having similar issues.  I have an XL that is around 10 years old.  I made three changes at the same time so I am not sure if one or all of them are the problem.  I pulled the heavy sewer grate and installed a Kick Ash Basket & Kick Ash Can.  I even bought a High Q style charcoal grate to put under the basket to minimize the coals falling into the can.  I also bought the rEGGulator top.  I always hated cleaning the ash out of the egg and the KAB & KAC make clean up a breeze, I love it, but it does not cook the same.  As far as the rEGGulater, there is a hot spot where the opening is when barely cracked open.

nolaegghead

Why don't you try blocking that air opening in the pan with the fire-box (rotate it) so the air has to go over the fire-box/ring and keep the fire on top?

nolaegghead

(note: I don't have any KAB or pan and have no direct experience with them).

PS - F Rand Paul

Mattman3969

nolaegghead said:

Why don't you try blocking that air opening in the pan with the fire-box (rotate it) so the air has to go over the fire-box/ring and keep the fire on top?

That’s what I was thinking if people are insistent on using the can. By rotating it it would act similar to closing the bottom vent except you’re still getting air to the fire bowl air holes so the fire may still go down. I have to leave my vent shut when starting the fire if I want a full bed of coals across the top layer.  Fire chases air. Lol. 

Powak

Took out the dog dish and put the shower drain back in. BINGO. Much better bed of coals.

Bar

I may have to do the same thing.  That was an expensive mistake on my end between the XL KAC and the High Q fire grate.  

Powak

Bar said:

I may have to do the same thing.  That was an expensive mistake on my end between the XL KAC and the High Q 


I’m blown away much the can impacts the air flow. Even with no can and no shower drain it burned better.

Powak

The can cutout does seem a bit smaller and different angle than the fire box cutout. That must affect it.

EzraBrooks

I have the can and basket and removed the shower drain.  I do not have this issue.  Is there something else that could be causing it?

Botch

Interesting thread.  My next cook, I'll be replacing the shower drain, but still use the KAB (love the de-ashing feature) and the KAC (any airflow restriction from that is completely dwarfed by the bottom vent setting).  

Powak

EzraBrooks said:

I have the can and basket and removed the shower drain.  I do not have this issue.  Is there something else that could be causing it?

Two other things I’d like to try is leaving the electric starter in for a good 15 minutes and also starting with a grass burner (not same session of course hahahaha). After tonight’s cook I’m under the impression it’s how the drain directs the airflow. It moves the fresh air thru all those little round holes and I’m wondering if that is what affects the fire more so than the ash can itself?

DavidCrumpton

This is interesting Very interesting. I added the ash can and noticed my last cook was crazy. 

I’ll do the pull the ash can trick this weekend and see if things go back to normal. 

4TheGrillOfIt

This is pretty wild.  I have had the can since day one and have never used the cast iron grate.  No issues like this.  I do start the fire from the top using a torch.  

@Powak keeps us posted.  

Powak

4TheGrillOfIt said:

This is pretty wild.  I have had the can since day one and have never used the cast iron grate.  No issues like this.  I do start the fire from the top using a torch.  

@Powak keeps us posted.  

Yup will do. I’m back to the drain and basket in together. I might try throwing the can under the drain just to see if that affects anything. I’d still like to try no drain and using the electric starter for 15 minutes -and see if I can get a real good top fire. The other side of all of this is maybe I have been Weber kettle’n too much lately and have gotten used to red blazing bed of coals.

dbCooper

@Powak

This research seems to indicate there will be less bottom radiated heat when using the Kick Ash Can...

http://www.nakedwhiz.com/kabt/kabt.htm

DavidCrumpton

dbCooper said:

@Powak

This research seems to indicate there will be less bottom radiated heat when using the Kick Ash Can...

http://www.nakedwhiz.com/kabt/kabt.htm

Great info, Thank you!

4TheGrillOfIt

@dbCooper excellent, thanks! 

danhoo

dbCooper said:

@Powak

This research seems to indicate there will be less bottom radiated heat when using the Kick Ash Can...

http://www.nakedwhiz.com/kabt/kabt.htm

Interesting. 

Bar

Very interesting.  

danhoo

Powak said:

4TheGrillOfIt said:

This is pretty wild.  I have had the can since day one and have never used the cast iron grate.  No issues like this.  I do start the fire from the top using a torch.  

@Powak keeps us posted.  

Yup will do. I’m back to the drain and basket in together. I might try throwing the can under the drain just to see if that affects anything. I’d still like to try no drain and using the electric starter for 15 minutes -and see if I can get a real good top fire. The other side of all of this is maybe I have been Weber kettle’n too much lately and have gotten used to red blazing bed of coals.

I'd like to see the outcome of a slow burn with all three: basket, drain and can.

Bar

The KAB & KAC without the shower drain does cause my XL to burn a little different.

When cooking spatchcock chicken at 400 the fire is concentrated in one area toward the back.  Before I added these I would put the bird on and not open the lid until it was done.  Now I need to rotate the grill grate every 15 min to avoid overcooking/burning the one spot. 

When I go to shake the ash out the next day for the next cook I notice that the coals in one area are burned/ash but the rest of the coals are practically unused.  I have been refilling the same spot in the basket for the past month.

4TheGrillOfIt

@bar How are you starting your fire and in what location?  I have noticed on my large that the fire moves toward the back, but I haven’t noticed the same on the XL.