Whatcha cooking for tonight's BIG EVENT?

SemolinaPilchard

JohnInCarolina said:

That's great @bhedges1987, except the one I posted points out the problem with yours.  Try harder.

I see that you have Fannie and Freddie mac in there.  G.W., you know, the "idiot" warned congress several times that it was going to crash, but Barney Frank and others refused to do anything. It was keeping their base happy. 

Do you not remember the old Avis car rental commercial. "We're number 2, we try harder. Thanks, but when we are number 1 we don't have to try harder, we are doing just fine.

JohnInCarolina

SemolinaPilchard said:

JohnInCarolina said:

That's great @bhedges1987, except the one I posted points out the problem with yours.  Try harder.

I see that you have Fannie and Freddie mac in there.  G.W., you know, the "idiot" warned congress several times that it was going to crash, but Barney Frank and others refused to do anything. It was keeping their base happy. 

TARP, Freddie, and Fannie are the thin blue slice in there - in between the recovery measures and the economic downturn.  In other words, they're the smallest part of the picture.  

By far the largest piece are the "idiot's" tax cuts. I'm sure you had a brilliant point to make here, somewhere.

HeavyG

bhedges1987 said:

Foghorn said:

HeavyG said:

bhedges1987 said:

Foghorn said:

"trumps more into simple math like adding and subtracting or balancing the budget, same thing "

@fishlessman, you say that - and I've heard other Trump supporters say that as well.  But as a neutral individual who is trying to decide who to vote for (as of today, Gary Johnson has my vote), as near as I can tell, Trump's plan is to put us $5 Trillion MORE THAN ALREADY PROJECTED in debt during his time in office.  I'm no expert on national economics, but it seems to me that if we don't do something about the national debt soon we are basically just stealing from our children and grandchildren - because they will be stuck with it.  All of the Trump supporters I know think of themselves as self-sufficient and would never be supportive of a plan that is overtly defined as "we're going to dump a heaping pile of crap on our kids and grandkids because we're too lazy to man up and take care of our own debt" - yet that seems to be the exact plan they are voting for.   

What am I missing?  Serious question.

 @Foghorn  The same people saying his plan will put us 5 trillion more in debt are the same ones that said obama would take us out of debt, not add 20 trillion to it.... funny how that works huh?

Obama did not "add 20 trillion to it" as you said. The debt will just reach that amount at the end of the next fiscal year.

President's don't add money to the debt. The US Congress, as mandated in the US Constitution, is responsible for federal spending via their budget process. Blame Congress.

@bhedges1987, from what I can gather, @HeavyG is correct.  The blame really is on congress because Obama's plan was never implemented.  It was never implemented because the republicans won't allow any tax increase (his plan was to increase taxes on the rich) and neither the democrats nor the republicans will choose any place to cut spending.  Stating that you support a cut in spending is a nice philosophical stance, but actually naming the program(s) where the cut(s) will be made is something nobody in Washington is willing to do as it would threaten that politician's political longevity.  So we have built a system that can't possibly solve the problem. 

Hillary's plan is probably the same as Obama's so nobody really knows if it will work or not - and it probably won't be implemented either.  Trump's plan might actually get implemented and it probably will add significantly to the current debt trajectory.  I think.  I may be way off because I don't really understand this stuff all that well.  There are too many moving parts.  I'm not convinced that either candidate understands it any better than I do.

@Foghorn oh??? The Democratic Party held the majority in the house and senate from 09-11.......
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/111th_United_States_Congress

The budget for fiscal year 2009 was passed before Obama took office. Every year since Obama has been in office the annual deficit has decreased. Make of that what you will.

pgprescott

JohnInCarolina said:

pgprescott said:

JohnInCarolina said:

That's great @bhedges1987, except the one I posted points out the problem with yours.  Try harder.

Even you have to admit that graph is targeted toward morons. Look at it a bit longer and tell what's wrong here. You can figure it out I'm sure. 

It is for sure designed so that morons can understand it.  Perhaps that bar is a bit too high.

Interesting that you were so attracted to it? I am totally amazed at what educated people consider fact or even data. Just amazed. 

SemolinaPilchard

JohnInCarolina said:

TARP, Freddie, and Fannie are the thin blue slice in there - in between the recovery measures and the economic downturn.  In other words, they're the smallest part of the picture.  

By far the largest piece are the "idiot's" tax cuts. I'm sure you had a brilliant point to make here, somewhere.

So G.W.s tax cuts were the biggest contributor, hmm. If tax cuts are bad, then tax increases must be good, right? During the worst time of the recession, when a reporter asked Obama if he was going to raise taxes he said no, with the economy the way it is, this is not the time to raise taxes." Even he understood. 
When the yacht tax was raised I know some on the left that were ecstatic. They can afford it they said. "Scrooooom" was the attitude. Those short sighted fools were clueless. The result was that many of the rich guys stopped buying yachts. Who was it that took it in the keister? The blue collar guys who build yachts that were laid off. Ah but what do I know, I am just a Deplorable.

JohnInCarolina

Bulletproof logic there. 

SemolinaPilchard

JohnInCarolina said:

Bulletproof logic there. 

I am sure you understood my point, but in case you did not, I will explain it. Part of the problem you say is Fannie and Freddie Mac. That is true. You say that tax cuts are part of the problem, that is your opinion. 

JohnInCarolina

SemolinaPilchard said:

JohnInCarolina said:

Bulletproof logic there. 

I am sure you understood my point, but in case you did not, I will explain it. Part of the problem you say is Fannie and Freddie Mac. That is true. You say that tax cuts are part of the problem, that is your opinion. 

Here's the chart again.  I don't think you really grasped it the first time around:

SemolinaPilchard

(slaps forehead) OH, thanks, I get it now!!!

yljkt

JohnInCarolina said:

SemolinaPilchard said:

JohnInCarolina said:

Bulletproof logic there. 

I am sure you understood my point, but in case you did not, I will explain it. Part of the problem you say is Fannie and Freddie Mac. That is true. You say that tax cuts are part of the problem, that is your opinion. 

Here's the chart again.  I don't think you really grasped it the first time around:

It would appear tax cuts are the biggest slice of the pie on the provided chart. It also says so at the top of the chart. 

bhedges1987

Lol... try harder at what?

You get really worked up over things when people disagree with you. Should think about settling down. It's not good for your health to be angry so much of your life.

@JohnInCarolina

pgprescott

yljkt said:

JohnInCarolina said:

SemolinaPilchard said:

JohnInCarolina said:

Bulletproof logic there. 

I am sure you understood my point, but in case you did not, I will explain it. Part of the problem you say is Fannie and Freddie Mac. That is true. You say that tax cuts are part of the problem, that is your opinion. 

Here's the chart again.  I don't think you really grasped it the first time around:

It would appear tax cuts are the biggest slice of the pie on the provided chart. It also says so at the top of the chart. 

Look at the chart. Digest what it is contending. Look at the dates.  Now consider the source and the timelines again. This is rubbish. Obviously. Consider how the data was analyzed. Consider the opportunities to manipulate the conclusions. Consider the accuracy of these charts in the past. This is just a small part of the propaganda machine. Meant to be digested by unwitting sheep. 

SemolinaPilchard

JIC sure does get his knickers in a wad when someone is too "dense" to understand that he is "right."
What entertains me is how I was not "getting it" about the tax cuts. It was in the chart, so it had to be correct. I have a neighbor like that. In a Vegas gift shop I found a bumper sticker that I gave him that said "We have charts and graphs to back us up, so F@*# OFF!!"

bhedges1987

No no no. Sheepincarolina loves charts and graphs as long as the information agrees with his views. If it doesn't he finds a reason why it's incorrect.  

yljkt

pgprescott said:

yljkt said:

JohnInCarolina said:

SemolinaPilchard said:

JohnInCarolina said:

Bulletproof logic there. 

I am sure you understood my point, but in case you did not, I will explain it. Part of the problem you say is Fannie and Freddie Mac. That is true. You say that tax cuts are part of the problem, that is your opinion. 

Here's the chart again.  I don't think you really grasped it the first time around:

It would appear tax cuts are the biggest slice of the pie on the provided chart. It also says so at the top of the chart. 

Look at the chart. Digest what it is contending. Look at the dates.  Now consider the source and the timelines again. This is rubbish. Obviously. Consider how the data was analyzed. Consider the opportunities to manipulate the conclusions. Consider the accuracy of these charts in the past. This is just a small part of the propaganda machine. Meant to be digested by unwitting sheep. 

Yes, I know. 

HeavyG

pgprescott said:

yljkt said:

JohnInCarolina said:

SemolinaPilchard said:

JohnInCarolina said:

Bulletproof logic there. 

I am sure you understood my point, but in case you did not, I will explain it. Part of the problem you say is Fannie and Freddie Mac. That is true. You say that tax cuts are part of the problem, that is your opinion. 

Here's the chart again.  I don't think you really grasped it the first time around:

It would appear tax cuts are the biggest slice of the pie on the provided chart. It also says so at the top of the chart. 

Look at the chart. Digest what it is contending. Look at the dates.  Now consider the source and the timelines again. This is rubbish. Obviously. Consider how the data was analyzed. Consider the opportunities to manipulate the conclusions. Consider the accuracy of these charts in the past. This is just a small part of the propaganda machine. Meant to be digested by unwitting sheep. 

Yeah...only one side in these debates has a propaganda machine manipulating/cherry picking data...yeah...

SemolinaPilchard

HeavyG, I won't disagree with you on that at all. 
I truly enjoy when the charts and graphs get whipped out though. It reminds me of the good old days when the hand grenade with the bad haicut Perot would be on Larry King's show "proving his point" with a pie chart.

bhedges1987

HeavyG said:

pgprescott said:

yljkt said:

JohnInCarolina said:

SemolinaPilchard said:

JohnInCarolina said:

Bulletproof logic there. 

I am sure you understood my point, but in case you did not, I will explain it. Part of the problem you say is Fannie and Freddie Mac. That is true. You say that tax cuts are part of the problem, that is your opinion. 

Here's the chart again.  I don't think you really grasped it the first time around:

It would appear tax cuts are the biggest slice of the pie on the provided chart. It also says so at the top of the chart. 

Look at the chart. Digest what it is contending. Look at the dates.  Now consider the source and the timelines again. This is rubbish. Obviously. Consider how the data was analyzed. Consider the opportunities to manipulate the conclusions. Consider the accuracy of these charts in the past. This is just a small part of the propaganda machine. Meant to be digested by unwitting sheep. 

Yeah...only one side in these debates has a propaganda machine manipulating/cherry picking data...yeah...

That's exactly what @JohnInCarolina would have one believe.

JohnInCarolina

pgprescott said:

yljkt said:

JohnInCarolina said:

SemolinaPilchard said:

JohnInCarolina said:

Bulletproof logic there. 

I am sure you understood my point, but in case you did not, I will explain it. Part of the problem you say is Fannie and Freddie Mac. That is true. You say that tax cuts are part of the problem, that is your opinion. 

Here's the chart again.  I don't think you really grasped it the first time around:

It would appear tax cuts are the biggest slice of the pie on the provided chart. It also says so at the top of the chart. 

Look at the chart. Digest what it is contending. Look at the dates.  Now consider the source and the timelines again. This is rubbish. Obviously. Consider how the data was analyzed. Consider the opportunities to manipulate the conclusions. Consider the accuracy of these charts in the past. This is just a small part of the propaganda machine. Meant to be digested by unwitting sheep. 

LOL

JohnInCarolina

SemolinaPilchard said:

JIC sure does get his knickers in a wad when someone is too "dense" to understand that he is "right."
What entertains me is how I was not "getting it" about the tax cuts. It was in the chart, so it had to be correct. I have a neighbor like that. In a Vegas gift shop I found a bumper sticker that I gave him that said "We have charts and graphs to back us up, so F@*# OFF!!"

LOL.  You guys need to work on your trolling skills.

I reposted the graph because you were obviously confused, since you had interpreted the Fanny/Freddie part of the same chart as fact, while the Bush tax cuts were "my opinion."  

SemolinaPilchard

Oh, aside from the charts and graphs, another thing that I find hilarious is that there are 2 members who, when they can not come up with a decent response, they have to post something, anything, as evidenced at 8:20 above.

JohnInCarolina

HeavyG said:

pgprescott said:

yljkt said:

JohnInCarolina said:

SemolinaPilchard said:

JohnInCarolina said:

Bulletproof logic there. 

I am sure you understood my point, but in case you did not, I will explain it. Part of the problem you say is Fannie and Freddie Mac. That is true. You say that tax cuts are part of the problem, that is your opinion. 

Here's the chart again.  I don't think you really grasped it the first time around:

It would appear tax cuts are the biggest slice of the pie on the provided chart. It also says so at the top of the chart. 

Look at the chart. Digest what it is contending. Look at the dates.  Now consider the source and the timelines again. This is rubbish. Obviously. Consider how the data was analyzed. Consider the opportunities to manipulate the conclusions. Consider the accuracy of these charts in the past. This is just a small part of the propaganda machine. Meant to be digested by unwitting sheep. 

Yeah...only one side in these debates has a propaganda machine manipulating/cherry picking data...yeah...

It's the same kind of trope brought out to "refute" climate scientists.  "JUST THINK OF ALL THE OPPORTUNITIES TO MANIPULATE THE DATA!!!"

bhedges1987

HeavyG said:

pgprescott said:

yljkt said:

JohnInCarolina said:

SemolinaPilchard said:

JohnInCarolina said:

Bulletproof logic there. 

I am sure you understood my point, but in case you did not, I will explain it. Part of the problem you say is Fannie and Freddie Mac. That is true. You say that tax cuts are part of the problem, that is your opinion. 

Here's the chart again.  I don't think you really grasped it the first time around:

It would appear tax cuts are the biggest slice of the pie on the provided chart. It also says so at the top of the chart. 

Look at the chart. Digest what it is contending. Look at the dates.  Now consider the source and the timelines again. This is rubbish. Obviously. Consider how the data was analyzed. Consider the opportunities to manipulate the conclusions. Consider the accuracy of these charts in the past. This is just a small part of the propaganda machine. Meant to be digested by unwitting sheep. 

Yeah...only one side in these debates has a propaganda machine manipulating/cherry picking data...yeah...

I will admit... I am impressed with someone on the left side admitting that the manipulation of data is on both sides of the table and not just the conservative side. Witnessing evolution first hand right here.

JohnInCarolina

bhedges1987 said:

Lol... try harder at what?

You get really worked up over things when people disagree with you. Should think about settling down. It's not good for your health to be angry so much of your life.

@JohnInCarolina

Try harder at making something resembling an argument there sport.  And please don't confuse pointing and laughing with anger.  It's unbecoming!

The debt increase under Obama is due in part to policies that he passed, but that's only part of the story.  Much of it is due to policies that were in place before he came into office.  I mean, do you blame him for the economic downturn that started in the fall of 2008?  How about the government response to Hurricane Katrina?  Also his fault?

The point is that while it may be fun to post the little pic you did, it doesn't stand up to any scrutiny.

bhedges1987

JohnInCarolina said:

bhedges1987 said:

Lol... try harder at what?

You get really worked up over things when people disagree with you. Should think about settling down. It's not good for your health to be angry so much of your life.

@JohnInCarolina

Try harder at making something resembling an argument there sport.

The debt increase under Obama is due in part to policies that he passed, but that's only part of the story.  Much of it is due to policies that were in place before he came into office.  I mean, do you blame him for the economic downturn that started in the fall of 2008?  How about the government response to Hurricane Katrina?  Also his fault?

The point is that while it may be fun to post the little pic you did, it doesn't stand up to any scrutiny.

Bless your little heart.  The whole 'bush is responsible' argument is tired my man.  It's been 8 years. 

JohnInCarolina

bhedges1987 said:

JohnInCarolina said:

bhedges1987 said:

Lol... try harder at what?

You get really worked up over things when people disagree with you. Should think about settling down. It's not good for your health to be angry so much of your life.

@JohnInCarolina

Try harder at making something resembling an argument there sport.

The debt increase under Obama is due in part to policies that he passed, but that's only part of the story.  Much of it is due to policies that were in place before he came into office.  I mean, do you blame him for the economic downturn that started in the fall of 2008?  How about the government response to Hurricane Katrina?  Also his fault?

The point is that while it may be fun to post the little pic you did, it doesn't stand up to any scrutiny.

Bless your little heart.  The whole 'bush is responsible' argument is tired my man.  It's been 8 years. 

Right.  How can I forget, after 8 years, nobody's responsible for anything that happened on their watch.  That's conservative responsibility, in a nutshell.

Somehow I think the ACA is still going to be called "Obamacare" well past eight years from now, when the GOP is trying to repeal it with their 538th vote on the bill in the House.

pgprescott

JohnInCarolina said:

HeavyG said:

pgprescott said:

yljkt said:

JohnInCarolina said:

SemolinaPilchard said:

JohnInCarolina said:

Bulletproof logic there. 

I am sure you understood my point, but in case you did not, I will explain it. Part of the problem you say is Fannie and Freddie Mac. That is true. You say that tax cuts are part of the problem, that is your opinion. 

Here's the chart again.  I don't think you really grasped it the first time around:

It would appear tax cuts are the biggest slice of the pie on the provided chart. It also says so at the top of the chart. 

Look at the chart. Digest what it is contending. Look at the dates.  Now consider the source and the timelines again. This is rubbish. Obviously. Consider how the data was analyzed. Consider the opportunities to manipulate the conclusions. Consider the accuracy of these charts in the past. This is just a small part of the propaganda machine. Meant to be digested by unwitting sheep. 

Yeah...only one side in these debates has a propaganda machine manipulating/cherry picking data...yeah...

It's the same kind of trope brought out to "refute" climate scientists.  "JUST THINK OF ALL THE OPPORTUNITIES TO MANIPULATE THE DATA!!!"

If it is true science and the data is so clean, how can they be so wrong so often? I mean profoundly wrong. I'm just astounded that people accept this drivel as anything other than the crap it is. To quote another "durp, durp, durp, durp"  or something like that. The real tragedy is even if they might accidentally be correct about something, they have so badly mishandled their own integrity, that it's likely useless. 

JohnInCarolina

pgprescott said:

JohnInCarolina said:

HeavyG said:

pgprescott said:

yljkt said:

JohnInCarolina said:

SemolinaPilchard said:

JohnInCarolina said:

Bulletproof logic there. 

I am sure you understood my point, but in case you did not, I will explain it. Part of the problem you say is Fannie and Freddie Mac. That is true. You say that tax cuts are part of the problem, that is your opinion. 

Here's the chart again.  I don't think you really grasped it the first time around:

It would appear tax cuts are the biggest slice of the pie on the provided chart. It also says so at the top of the chart. 

Look at the chart. Digest what it is contending. Look at the dates.  Now consider the source and the timelines again. This is rubbish. Obviously. Consider how the data was analyzed. Consider the opportunities to manipulate the conclusions. Consider the accuracy of these charts in the past. This is just a small part of the propaganda machine. Meant to be digested by unwitting sheep. 

Yeah...only one side in these debates has a propaganda machine manipulating/cherry picking data...yeah...

It's the same kind of trope brought out to "refute" climate scientists.  "JUST THINK OF ALL THE OPPORTUNITIES TO MANIPULATE THE DATA!!!"

If it is true science and the data is so clean, how can they be so wrong so often? I mean profoundly wrong. I'm just astounded that people accept this drivel as anything other than the crap it is. To quote another "durp, durp, durp, durp"  or something like that. The real tragedy is even if they might accidentally be correct about something, they have so badly mishandled their own integrity, that it's likely useless. 

What are they "wrong" about?  I think your expectation is that somehow scientists should be capable of making perfect predictions, but this is a misunderstanding about how science and theory works.

bhedges1987

JohnInCarolina said:

bhedges1987 said:

JohnInCarolina said:

bhedges1987 said:

Lol... try harder at what?

You get really worked up over things when people disagree with you. Should think about settling down. It's not good for your health to be angry so much of your life.

@JohnInCarolina

Try harder at making something resembling an argument there sport.

The debt increase under Obama is due in part to policies that he passed, but that's only part of the story.  Much of it is due to policies that were in place before he came into office.  I mean, do you blame him for the economic downturn that started in the fall of 2008?  How about the government response to Hurricane Katrina?  Also his fault?

The point is that while it may be fun to post the little pic you did, it doesn't stand up to any scrutiny.

Bless your little heart.  The whole 'bush is responsible' argument is tired my man.  It's been 8 years. 

Right.  How can I forget, after 8 years, nobody's responsible for anything that happened on their watch.  That's conservative responsibility, in a nutshell.

Somehow I think the ACA is still going to be called "Obamacare" well past eight years from now, when the GOP is trying to repeal it with their 538th vote on the bill in the House.

LOL... You're blaming bush for 8 years of bad obama policies. So, that would mean liberal responsibility is blaming their predecessors for everything they do wrong?  Funny how that works isn't it?  You're making this too easy man.  Just go to bed and bring down that blood pressure @JohnInCarolina

SemolinaPilchard

JohnInCarolina said:

  How about the government response to Hurricane Katrina?  Also his fault?

No, the pathetic government response to Katrina was because of Governor Blanco. Even CNN's Tom Foreman said the slow response was because of "decisional paralysis of the Mayor and the Governor."