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Effects of high-flow aftermarket fire grates
GrateEggspectations
Posts: 9,182
I had previously seen some posters who suspected that aftermarket high-flow fire grates may be responsible for more than a few cracked bases.
While I attempt to make no such claims here, I did want to share an observation I have made with respect to the heat emanating from the bottom of my Mini Max while having a KIck Ash Basket in place.
Tonight, I roasted some veggies before searing a ribeye at 550. Everything was delicious.
When I went to move my Egg back to its home after cooking, I was surprised to see significant singe marks in the cedar table the Egg had been placed on for the cook (photo below). After more than a year of cooking on this table with the stock fire grate with no ill-effects, I think it's safe to conclude that the KAB is responsible (and in a single cook). I suspect that the small pieces of charcoal that fall through the grate during the cook ultimately end up resting on the inside of the cooker's base, throwing a great deal of heat below the Egg.
Just thought that others may benefit from being made aware of this phenomenon.
The steak photos are purely gratuitous.
While I attempt to make no such claims here, I did want to share an observation I have made with respect to the heat emanating from the bottom of my Mini Max while having a KIck Ash Basket in place.
Tonight, I roasted some veggies before searing a ribeye at 550. Everything was delicious.
When I went to move my Egg back to its home after cooking, I was surprised to see significant singe marks in the cedar table the Egg had been placed on for the cook (photo below). After more than a year of cooking on this table with the stock fire grate with no ill-effects, I think it's safe to conclude that the KAB is responsible (and in a single cook). I suspect that the small pieces of charcoal that fall through the grate during the cook ultimately end up resting on the inside of the cooker's base, throwing a great deal of heat below the Egg.
Just thought that others may benefit from being made aware of this phenomenon.
The steak photos are purely gratuitous.
Comments
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Exact same spot. The table is barely wider than the Egg, so there are absolutely no variables in this regard. The burn cannot be the result of repeated uses. It went from unblemished to singed in one cook.
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Interesting scorch pattern.“Reality is that which, when you stop believing in it, doesn't go away.” ― Philip K. Diçk
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Interesting observation, do you have a dual probe thermo? Reason I ask, occasionally when using only the pit probe of my Mav 733, I've "parked" the food probe under my table nested MBGE. I;ve never seen it read over 125ºC. Maybe you could try the same cook with and without the KAB and see if there is a measurable difference in temps under the grill.
BTW - nice looking steak there....Delta B.C. - Whiskey and steak, because no good story ever started with someone having a salad! -
How hot was your fire?-----------------------------------------analyze adapt overcome2008 -Large BGE. 2013- Small BGE and 2015 - Mini. Henderson, Ky.
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So you removed your grate before adding the KAB? I didn't realize I was supposed to.
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In use a KAB, but still use the grate. I do not think the grate should be removed just because you are using a KAB.
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In my MM and medium, I remove the grate. Main selling point for me is increased airflow. KAB is recommended to be used without the grate in all Eggs. Even the XL with the new thicker gauge wire.A bison’s level of aggressiveness, both physical and passive, is legendary. - NPS
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In use a KAB, but still use the grate. I do not think the grate should be removed just because you are using a KAB.
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GrateEggspectations said:Exact same spot. The table is barely wider than the Egg, so there are absolutely no variables in this regard. The burn cannot be the result of repeated uses. It went from unblemished to singed in one cook.
Little Rock, AR
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Another vote for removing the grate when switching to a KAB. The wide open air flow allowed by the design of the KAB is why I went that route! I mean...why hamper the air flow?Re-gasketing America one yard at a time.
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RRP said:Another vote for removing the grate when switching to a KAB. The wide open air flow allowed by the design of the KAB is why I went that route! I mean...why hamper the air flow?
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ninnymugs said:RRP said:Another vote for removing the grate when switching to a KAB. The wide open air flow allowed by the design of the KAB is why I went that route! I mean...why hamper the air flow?A bison’s level of aggressiveness, both physical and passive, is legendary. - NPS
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Any idea why the folks at BGE use a ceramic fire box, ceramic fire ring, and ceramic fire grate (originally)? It would have been less expensive to make an egg without using ceramic for these. Maybe they help protect the base from the intense heat of the fire?Southeast Florida - LBGE
In cooking, often we implement steps for which we have no explanations other than ‘that’s what everybody else does’ or ‘that’s what I have been told.’ Dare to think for yourself. -
ninnymugs said:RRP said:Another vote for removing the grate when switching to a KAB. The wide open air flow allowed by the design of the KAB is why I went that route! I mean...why hamper the air flow?Re-gasketing America one yard at a time.
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Mattman3969 said:How hot was your fire?
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It's not just that small pieces of charcoal fell thru the KAB and onto the ceramic. This happens with the cast iron grate. But what probably happened was the actual amount of hot coals that falls thru the KAB is far greater than the cast iron grate and that is what caused the bottom of the ceramic to get much hotter than before.
The KAB should be used with some trepidation. I know a lot of Eggers on here use it full-time without the cast iron grate, but personally I only do that with a firebox full of smaller lump (ie. towards the bottom of the bag, cheaper lump). A firebox full of small lump is packed together more tightly and tends to struggle for oxygen a little more on the cast fire grate than the bigger lump does. The medium and larger lump will burn hotter, faster and I set the KAB on top of the cast iron grate for that, which is most of the time.
I'm sure I'll get some criticism about this, but to each his own. Just remember, there is a reason BGE states that "using any parts inside the EGG other than authentic BGE components" voids the warranty.
BGE XL
NWArkansas -
CanDid said:...
I'm sure I'll get some criticism about this, but to each his own. Just remember, there is a reason BGE states that "using any parts inside the EGG other than authentic BGE components" voids the warranty.
I'm guessing that clause even pre-dates the existence of the Kick Ash Basket.“Reality is that which, when you stop believing in it, doesn't go away.” ― Philip K. Diçk -
HeavyG said:CanDid said:...
I'm sure I'll get some criticism about this, but to each his own. Just remember, there is a reason BGE states that "using any parts inside the EGG other than authentic BGE components" voids the warranty.
I'm guessing that clause even pre-dates the existence of the Kick Ash Basket.
I have an old owner's manual from 2008 here......different wording, but says a similar thing. I'll be over at my parents' house later today--will see if their mid-90's manual says that.
On the subject of warranties, I had one of my dealers tell me their rep from a bouy shaped grill company said that their warranty is going to prohibit the use of lump charcoal--unless you use their branded briquettes, the warranty is null/void. There no way for them to enforce or monitor it, but maybe it helps with their insurance? I doubt the dealers in the middle will put up with that crap.
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I am an advocate for the use of the grate with the KAB. I have experience running without the fire grate where the base cracked in cold weather in my XL. I have cooked in the snow with the fire grate, no problems.
Use your fire grate if you have a KAB.
That is all.
Thank you."Knowledge is Good" - Emil Faber
XL and MM
Louisville, Kentucky -
I use the original cast iron grate with the KAB atop that. I figured that the KAB alone would allow too many burning coals to rest atop the bare ceramic bottom.
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The entire design of the Egg is built around 'restricting air flow). Unless you are doing very high temp cooks or clean burns, I would think that the air flow is restricted by the vents regardless of the LAB or the grate. Would not a cook at X degrees have the same air flow independent of the means of controlling it?XL BGE in San Jose, CA. Also a Pit Barrel Cooker, a Cal Flame P4 gasser, and lots of toys including the first ever Flame Boss 300 in the wild. And a new Flame Boss 500.
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I use my KAB sans original grate. I just don't buy the notion that little embers have enough energy to harm the ceramic base (which is likely kiln fired at over 2000°F).“Reality is that which, when you stop believing in it, doesn't go away.” ― Philip K. Diçk
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How much difference is there between the bottom of the kick ash and a hi-que? I have hi-ques in my eggs. Just seems to work better than the stock for me. Ive had a couple overnighters try to snuff with the stock but never with a hi-que.
Little Rock, AR
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If it is true that more bases crack when using the KAB versus the original fire grate, my guess is that is has very little to do with some embers dropping through. It is probably more to do with heat radiating down from the fire. The original grate has air holes that make up what, 20% of the entire grate? Much more heat heading south with a KAB. It would be very easy to test all this. Take a temp reading under the egg at X degrees using an original grate, and also with the KAB. Also take readings of both with the embers cleaned out from the bottom. Personally, I am not worried about it. No cracked bases here yet, and if it happens I will change them out. Without the original I have never had an airflow problem, with it I have had a few.
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HeavyG said:I use my KAB sans original grate. I just don't buy the notion that little embers have enough energy to harm the ceramic base (which is likely kiln fired at over 2000°F).
What is the application for the firebox? Is it to assist in air flow? Is it to prevent the base from becoming too hot to touch? Is it to protect the base from cracking? Why not have a fire grate that holds the charcoal next to the base instead of the added cost of a firebox?
Remember, the firebox has a slit in it so that it can expand and contract without cracking. The base does not.
BGE XL
NWArkansas -
CanDid said:
Remember, the firebox has a slit in it so that it can expand and contract without cracking. The base does not.Re-gasketing America one yard at a time. -
@Yno: you are correct; I actually did the math a year or two ago and posted the figures here, the bottom vent (even wide open) is smaller in area than the holes in the original grate.
@SemolinaPilchard : you are correct, the metal plate would block radiant heat from above, which the Hi-Q and KAB would not; I hadn't thought of that before. And actually measuring the bottom temp, w and w/o the OEM plate, is easy enough to do to be sure.
_____________"I mean, I don't just kill guys, I'm notorious for doing in houseplants." - Maggie, Northern Exposure
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Methinks the impact (if any) of radiant heat from a KAB (or other grate) would rapidly diminish once even a thin layer of ash settles onto the base.“Reality is that which, when you stop believing in it, doesn't go away.” ― Philip K. Diçk
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RRP said:CanDid said:
Remember, the firebox has a slit in it so that it can expand and contract without cracking. The base does not.
BGE XL
NWArkansas
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