Pastrami the Sous Vide Way

HendersonTRKing

Giving it a try.  4.5 lb point, desalinated for 24 hours with 4 water changes. Trimmed and applied Meathead’s rub and into the bath. Have seen good results on here with 136 degrees for 30 hours (@moneyhillbilly) and 155 for 36 hours (@thecen-texsmoker) but I’m planning on 24 hours at 150 — higher temp and shorter time than I’d like — because that’s kind of what I have for time if I’m going to smoke it and get it on the table around 6 tomorrow. 

Looking for advice for the smoke and finish— thinking I want IT around 195-203 like I’d target a brisket?  Also thinking hot smoke rather than cold to help get there — 3-4 hours?  And maybe steam-finish for an hour in a foil-wrapped aluminum pan?  

Lots of variables on this one, so I’d definitely appreciate any offered wisdom from those who’ve dared attempt the sous vide pastrami. 

(Also doing a traditional corned beef and cabbage, which is how this all started.  Not nearly as exciting as pastrami!)

Money_Hillbilly

@HendersonTRKing I always chill after SV to start as cold as possible then apply rub and smoke @225 until meat interior is 125-130.  If you go any higher there is a good chance of coming out with a drier product.  That’s the reason I dropped the SV temp down to 135, makes a nice moist product. 

Legume

Is there a reason you don’t smoke first?

Legume

Bark?  (I may be answering my own question here)

HendersonTRKing

@Legume — when I’ve done it in the past, I simply smoked and then steamed, which hurt the bark but not critically. In this attempt, my thought was to smoke after SV to build the bark. Seems sound, but IDFK. 

@Money_Hillbilly — because it’s a point rather than a flat, I thought the higher SV temp would be ok. Also, higher temp/shorter time. But I also think bc the temp holds steady, I’m having to rely on the time part of the equation to break down the collagen and fat. But I’m completely making that up and relying on hope for a strategy. And whatever thoughts people are kind enough to send 

The Cen-Tex Smoker

The SV will do all the work as far as breaking down the connective tissue/rendering fat. I would ice bath out of the SV and then hot smoke until the bark sets. No need to measure internal temp- just get the bark right and pull it. Cold smoke will add the right flavor but the bark will be really light. 

The Cen-Tex Smoker

Legume said:

Bark?  (I may be answering my own question here)

You are correct. Smoke after SV sets the bark

HendersonTRKing

The Cen-Tex Smoker said:

The SV will do all the work as far as breaking down the connective tissue/rendering fat. I would ice bath out of the SV and then hot smoke until the bark sets. No need to measure internal temp- just get the bark right and pull it. Cold smoke will add the right flavor but the bark will be really light. 

Thanks so much. Very helpful. I want to try for some pastrami bark so I’m inclined to hot smoke low, at like 250, for a maybe 3 hours. No butcher paper, no foil, just low heat smoke. If it looks dry, I might steam. If it looks barkey and moist, I’ll just rest and serve. Whole thing is a crapshoot, but I’m glad to have a good looking point and I like the rub, so fingers crossed on how it comes out. 

Money_Hillbilly

@HendersonTRKing  I have experimented with multiple pastrami methods from steaming to pressure cooker.  The SV method I described above has produced the best pastrami I have been able make.

alaskanassasin

You may have mentioned this earlier @Money_Hillbilly but what spice rub recipe are you using?

Money_Hillbilly

@alaskanassasin I use meat heads recipe from amazing ribs.  I bought a burr coffee grinder and grind the spices now as opposed to cracking them with a mallet in a ziplock bag.  I really like the consistent course ground spices.  

HendersonTRKing

@The Cen-Tex Smoker — what is the purpose of the ice bath out of the SV?  If I’m hot smoking, won’t I just be getting it back up to/past the temp it was at when it came out of the bath?

The Cen-Tex Smoker

HendersonTRKing said:

@The Cen-Tex Smoker — what is the purpose of the ice bath out of the SV?  If I’m hot smoking, won’t I just be getting it back up to/past the temp it was at when it came out of the bath?

 Longer time in the smoke for the bark to darken up and set

HendersonTRKing

Thx @The Cen-Tex Smoker and @Money_Hillbilly. It’s out of the bath and onto the grid. I reapplied some rub and reserved the SV liquid thinking I’ll probably steam-finish on the egg. Although that risks losing some bark, in past efforts (non-SV), I found that gave it the true NY deli-style flavor and texture. Fingers crossed for good results!

Money_Hillbilly

@HendersonTRKing  No sure what value steaming would add. SV cooked and tenderized, egg applied the smoke.  Process is complete if anything steam will soften the bark. 

Money_Hillbilly

@HendersonTRKing
Not sure

HendersonTRKing

Money_Hillbilly said:

@HendersonTRKing  No sure what value steaming would add. SV cooked and tenderized, egg applied the smoke.  Process is complete if anything steam will soften the bark. 

NY pastramis often are steam finished and steam-tray held. I’m going to see how this one feels — when it came out of the bath after 24 hours, if felt tight. And who wants right meat?
I know you SV for 30 hours at 135 and @The Cen-Tex Smoker does 36 at 155. I did 24 hours at 150 and it may need more cooking to break it down. So I might sacrifice some bark to cover and steam-cook it more using the SV bag liquid at the bottom of the pan. Still has a while to go in the smoke before I get to that decision tho. 

alaskanassasin

I'm heading to Kroger, looks like CB are over half off.

HendersonTRKing

So, to wrap this one up, I was happy with the SV pastrami, but think it would have benefitted from a longer stay in the hot tub. As compared to my prior method of desalinating, smoking at 300 and steam finish, the SV was somewhat more equipment/labor intensive and the end product was somewhat less moist than I prefer. Again, that could be a function of 24 hours versus the recommended 30 or 36 hours in the tub. But, it still was delicious and with all the reubens and hash I’ll be consuming the rest of the week, I’m a happy guy. 

JohnInCarolina

Pretty sure I'd be quite happy with that too!  

< stares at lunch salad angrily >

Money_Hillbilly

@HendersonTRKing Looks like you had a happy ending.  I tried to recommend a process that solved the dryness you encountered.  I have experimented with at least a dozen SV pastramis time and temp,, each time tweaking the process.  I am very happy with the method now. 

alaskanassasin

@MasterC where you at bud.

Photo Egg

HendersonTRKing said:

So, to wrap this one up, I was happy with the SV pastrami, but think it would have benefitted from a longer stay in the hot tub. As compared to my prior method of desalinating, smoking at 300 and steam finish, the SV was somewhat more equipment/labor intensive and the end product was somewhat less moist than I prefer. Again, that could be a function of 24 hours versus the recommended 30 or 36 hours in the tub. But, it still was delicious and with all the reubens and hash I’ll be consuming the rest of the week, I’m a happy guy. 

“  and the end product was somewhat less moist “
Quality difference could also just be the cow.
But the photos look fantastic as I’m sure was the flavor.

StillH2OEgger

That looks wonderful!

HendersonTRKing

The hits keep on coming. Hash last night in the highly-anticipated Breakfast-for-Dinner repurposing. 

Reubens on the menu for Wednesday night (SWMBO has demanded a break from pastrami-related meals tonight and is threatening to go out of town tomorrow, which could bring about an extraordinary multiple-course pastrami event throughout Wednesday evening!)

Photo Egg

HendersonTRKing said:

The hits keep on coming. Hash last night in the highly-anticipated Breakfast-for-Dinner repurposing. 

Reubens on the menu for Wednesday night (SWMBO has demanded a break from pastrami-related meals tonight and is threatening to go out of town tomorrow, which could bring about an extraordinary multiple-course pastrami event throughout Wednesday evening!)

Very nice!
You need a Blackstone Griddle

HendersonTRKing

Last one. There can be no doubt that the best sandwich ever created is the pastrami reuben. Sub sriracha ketchup for Heinz in the Russian dressing and you’re at a whole new level. 

MasterC

Bravo, those look delicious. 

lentsboy007

HendersonTRKing said:

The hits keep on coming. Hash last night in the highly-anticipated Breakfast-for-Dinner repurposing. 

Reubens on the menu for Wednesday night (SWMBO has demanded a break from pastrami-related meals tonight and is threatening to go out of town tomorrow, which could bring about an extraordinary multiple-course pastrami event throughout Wednesday evening!)

I wish my wife would go out of town ….

FreeNHim

My wife was not sold on the Sous vide world. We just had Ruben sandwiches tonight made with Sous vide corned beef, seasoned and smoked to pastrami. She likes it a lot now. 

JohnInCarolina

FreeNHim said:

My wife was not sold on the Sous vide world. We just had Ruben sandwiches tonight made with Sous vide corned beef, seasoned and smoked to pastrami. She likes it a lot now. 

Wait until you make her a batch of the chocolate pots.  They have been described by one of the forum wives as “panty droppers”