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STUPID GFCI!
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apinion
Posts: 470
Well, I have a deep freeze in the garage and it has been throwing the GFCI lately. Came home to a barely salvageable freezer of food. Since that initial shock it has done it at least 5 more times. I kept thinking it would go away, but I think I was in denial.
Ended up researching and its common for the GFCI to trip when a deep freeze is plugged in d/t the voltage leak from the freezer. So, my option was to toss the freezer, hire an electrician to run a dedicated circuit (TOO EXPENSIVE), or this little trick I read about....
Just ran n extension cord from the garage door outlet to the freezer and tack is to the ceiling. VOILA!!!
Louisianian by birth, Louisianian by death. Austinite for now...
Comments
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GFCI have a finite amount of trip-cycles built into them. One that trips or has tripped frequently (for whatever reason) is more prone to trip later. Sometimes replacing (or having replaced) the sensitive GFCI outlet with a fresh one will remedy this type of issue. Disclaimer...I am NOT an electrician, just a longtime homeowner who has had, and remedied this type of thing with a new GFCI after determining there was no actual ground-fault error causing the issue.When I'm not Eggin', I'm scootin' Eggin' and 'cueing from Temecula Ca; an hour from San Diego, an hour and five minutes from Palm Springs, and an hour and a half from Los Angeles (yeah, right. With THAT traffic?)
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Guess I'm dense, but rather than to be running a freezer on the end of an extension cord why not just replace the GFCI with a common outlet? It really isn't difficult to do. I mean since you are giving up the safety of the GFCI anyway.
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You can buy outlets that are GCI and regular to fit a dual box. Just change the receptacle and plug the freezer into the non GCI side.Delta B.C. - Whiskey and steak, because no good story ever started with someone having a salad!
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The outlet police might get you!? (I bet you remove the tags from your mattresses too!)When I'm not Eggin', I'm scootin' Eggin' and 'cueing from Temecula Ca; an hour from San Diego, an hour and five minutes from Palm Springs, and an hour and a half from Los Angeles (yeah, right. With THAT traffic?)
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@RRP - its code, from what I have read, to have a GFCI in the garage that has the potential to be around water after 2008. I could replace it and have thought of it.Louisianian by birth, Louisianian by death. Austinite for now...
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apinion said:@RRP - its code, from what I have read, to have a GFCI in the garage that has the potential to be around water after 2008. I could replace it and have thought of it.
They ARE a PITA, and they are code. As much as I don't appreciate governmental intervention in EVERY aspect of my life, I choose to respect the laws and the building codes etc. even if I dont like them. While were on the subject, can we talk about incandescent light bulbs and TPMS tire monitoring systems too? :(When I'm not Eggin', I'm scootin' Eggin' and 'cueing from Temecula Ca; an hour from San Diego, an hour and five minutes from Palm Springs, and an hour and a half from Los Angeles (yeah, right. With THAT traffic?) -
I figure if the house is going to burn down, I would rather it be from something that someone else did, inspected, and approved of than my shade tree mechanic tinkering.Louisianian by birth, Louisianian by death. Austinite for now...
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Is this a problem with older deep freezers? I have one that is about 7 years old and it never trips. I wonder if manufacturers solved the problem because they know GFCI outlets are in all new homes where the homeowner would put their product.Austin, TX
BGE-Large, Weber EP-330 -
GFCI's often do not work well with reactive loads such as motors. This is a common issue. I would replace it with a standard outlet and maybe put the GFCI in a plastic bag and hang it from the screw on the outlet cover to remind yourself that it has been replaced in order to return it to service if you move away. If a GFCI remains in the circuit you will more than likely eventually thaw everything in the freezer when it trips and you don't notice it. The only other thing I could suggest is to put a low wattage bulb or LED into the plug to let you know it is energized.
A poor widows son.
See der Rabbits, Iowa -
apinion said:@RRP - its code, from what I have read, to have a GFCI in the garage that has the potential to be around water after 2008. I could replace it and have thought of it.
yet your extension cord solution is also circumventing the intended protection for you and your family - right? Personally I would do as suggested - replace the outlet which has tripped so often and weakened from the multiple trips with a new GFCI. -
Never hurt to try @ RRP! I'll give it a shot! :-)Louisianian by birth, Louisianian by death. Austinite for now...
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apinion said:Never hurt to try @ RRP! I'll give it a shot! :-)
I agree! BTW we built in 1980 so that was prior to that code, but I've had issues in my work shop where a circuit breaker dedicated to my table saw and central vac system for the shop. It was fine with the most powerful being the saw, but would trip from the 1/3 horse vacuum motor! That's when I too learned that frequent trips weaken the circuit breakers the same way as your GFCI has also weakened. I hope it works out to be a simple solution for you! -
I have a question. How old is the freezer? Also is this the only item on the circcircuit?
I personally wouldn't advise swapping a regular GFCI with a standard because of a ground fault. Take that information and ask what is going on with this. It's tripping for a reason. Now, that's not to say when the compressor starts that an unbalance is detected and trips.
I would replace the GFCI first and see if that helps. If still trtripping something is not right with your appliance. Also, ensure the electrician uses the posts of the outlet instead of the push terminals.
Please be careful.------------------------------
Thomasville, NC
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I dislike the GFI's as well. Here is a solution to most of your problem. As Ron said above, change the GFI receptical to a standard non GFI receptical. Then match your breaker to the amps of the freezer. This will be adequate to prevent overload and catching fire because the breaker will trip if something gets out of sorts. However it will not prevent electrical shock as well as a GFI. That said, in 50 years I have never been shocked by a freezer nor do I know of anyone who has. It's not a very common problem. I would ditch the GFI and match the breaker to the amps of the freezer. For the record and to be perfecly clear, I'm not a electrician. But I did stay in a Holiday Inn Express a time or two.
Location- Just "this side" of Biloxi, Ms.
Status- Standing by.
The greatest barrier against all wisdom, the stronghold against knowledge itself, is the single thought, in ones mind, that they already have it all figured out. -
What else do you use that receptacle for? If you are also using it to run your shop vac in wet conditions, or a hair dryer near a bathtub, you may want to keep the GFCI. If not, replace with standard. Since its in the garage I'm guessing power tools in wet conditions may be a possibility.They/Them
Morgantown, PA
XL BGE - S BGE - KJ Jr - HB Legacy - BS Pizza Oven - 30" Firepit - King Kooker Fryer - PR72T - WSJ - BS 17" Griddle - XXL BGE - BS SS36" Griddle - 2 Burner Gasser - Pellet Smoker -
bettysnephew said:If a GFCI remains in the circuit you will more than likely eventually thaw everything in the freezer when it trips and you don't notice it.Fill a small container with water almost to the top and freeze it. Then place a penny or two on top of the ice and add more water and freeze again. Place that container in a very conspicuous spot in your freezer. Then if it goes out and things thaw but refreeze meaning you might not even know the difference, but if your coins sunk you'll know!BTW if you are a big spender use a quarter or even two LOL!
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How many outlets are on that circuit? Where are they located and what do they service? If it's in the garage, there are probably other outlets on that same circuit that the GFCI serves to protect ... one GFCI protects the entire circuit. Don't change out the GFCI with a standard outlet unless that is the only outlet on that circuit, otherwise you loose protection for the rest of the outlets.
The garage door outlet might also be protected by a GFCI unit somewhere else in its circuit ... it is in my house. If you can prove that, then you know that the freezer isn't the culprit. It probably is a weak GFCI unit. Wally World has a GFCI tester for about $8.
I agree with @SGH, the chances of a freezer zapping you is pretty low, so keeping it plugged into the garage door outlet is a reasonable risk.
Washington, IL > Queen Creek, AZ ... Two large eggs and an adopted Mini Max
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Well, my last post didn't like all my quotes so I'll just tag everyone....@RRP I heard of people doing something similar by filling an ice tray and then storing it upside down.@Jeepster47 I believe its the only thing on the circuit.@DMW I don't use it for anything else.@tarheelmatt Its an older freezer acquired from my mom. It gets super cold still.Louisianian by birth, Louisianian by death. Austinite for now...
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Jeepster47 said:How many outlets are on that circuit? Where are they located and what do they service? If it's in the garage, there are probably other outlets on that same circuit that the GFCI serves to protect ... one GFCI protects the entire circuit. Don't change out the GFCI with a standard outlet unless that is the only outlet on that circuit, otherwise you loose protection for the rest of the outlets.
The garage door outlet might also be protected by a GFCI unit somewhere else in its circuit ... it is in my house. If you can prove that, then you know that the freezer isn't the culprit. It probably is a weak GFCI unit. Wally World has a GFCI tester for about $8.
I agree with @SGH, the chances of a freezer zapping you is pretty low, so keeping it plugged into the garage door outlet is a reasonable risk.They/Them
Morgantown, PA
XL BGE - S BGE - KJ Jr - HB Legacy - BS Pizza Oven - 30" Firepit - King Kooker Fryer - PR72T - WSJ - BS 17" Griddle - XXL BGE - BS SS36" Griddle - 2 Burner Gasser - Pellet Smoker -
@RRP ... I like the coin trick ... that's neat. Thanks @Mickey.
I have an electronic box that will call my cell phone if the power has been off for 45 minutes or if the inside temp of the house has fallen to a preset level. Can't think of any situation where only the power to the freezer would go off and then come back on a day later, but I'm still going to use the coin trick.
Washington, IL > Queen Creek, AZ ... Two large eggs and an adopted Mini Max
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apinion said:... I believe its the only thing on the circuit. ...
I had major trouble figuring out one outlet. It's on the back of the house on the deck and it is connected to the wall outlets in the garage - 30 feet away - and to the yard light in the front yard - another 30 feet away. When you see it on paper it makes sense, but it's not intuitive ... so, do check carefully that that's the only outlet on that circuit.
Washington, IL > Queen Creek, AZ ... Two large eggs and an adopted Mini Max
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I'll trip it and then check some outlets.Louisianian by birth, Louisianian by death. Austinite for now...
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If it is the only thing on the circuit, and the only thing you use that recep for, I would replace it with a standard recep and plug the unused plug with one of those plastic child safety thingies.They/Them
Morgantown, PA
XL BGE - S BGE - KJ Jr - HB Legacy - BS Pizza Oven - 30" Firepit - King Kooker Fryer - PR72T - WSJ - BS 17" Griddle - XXL BGE - BS SS36" Griddle - 2 Burner Gasser - Pellet Smoker -
I'm an Electrician. Usually the outlets in the Garage, outside, and sometimes the bathroom are all on the same circuit. If that is the case, do not replace the GFCI outlet with a regular outlet. If you do then all of the outlets on that circuit will not be protected. If something happens, you or someone else gets hurt and the Insurance company can prove you removed the GFCI your claim will be denied.George Foreman? Who?Tim C. Panama City, Fl.Large, Minimax-soon
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I am not privy to the rules in MERICA but here in the frozen north we only need GFI where there is water, such as kitchens and bathrooms. My house also has GFI on its outside circuit and it serves several plugs. As other suggested, and you have noted, it will be worth seeing what other outlets are on that circuit that could be tripping it. Also if all else fails, call and electrician and ask their opinion, they may not even have to come out to look at it if you are detailed enough in your description and troubleshooting, it might save you in safety or money in the end.Large BGEBBQ Guru DigiQ IIMartensville, Saskatchewan Canada
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the 2008 version of NEC required these in garages:(2) Garages, and also accessory buildings that have a floor located at or below grade level not intended as habitable rooms and limited to storage areas, work areas, and areas of similar use.That said, some local jurisdictions allow a dedicated freezer outlet without GFCI protection in a garage.Personally, i'd just change it out for a new one, false trips from inductive loads are greatly reduced with newer GFCI's, they've come a long way from what they were just 4 or 5 years ago.BGE XL in the Pacific NW
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Also, if you have a freezer full of meat, i'd make an investment in this little guy or something like it:Wouldn't do you any good if you're not home for a weekend, but it is cheap insurance for those times when you are and would hear it. Personally, i have an oregon scientific remote temp sensor in all my freezers tied into my home automation system and get an email and a housewide announcement if the temp in any of them get near "not freezing" point.BGE XL in the Pacific NW
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Unless he is plugged into the first outlet in the series.tcracing said:I'm an Electrician. Usually the outlets in the Garage, outside, and sometimes the bathroom are all on the same circuit. If that is the case, do not replace the GFCI outlet with a regular outlet. If you do then all of the outlets on that circuit will not be protected. If something happens, you or someone else gets hurt and the Insurance company can prove you removed the GFCI your claim will be denied.
If that is the case, all the OP has to do is re place the one that the freezer os plugged into with a normal outlet. AND THEN, find the next one downstream in the series and install the GFCI there. That way every other outlet is protected. -
That is true, but I would still rather have a dedicated circuit for the freezer. There are just to many variables to that equation.George Foreman? Who?Tim C. Panama City, Fl.Large, Minimax-soon
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