Pizza troubles....

dougcrann · February 2016

Ernie uses a recipe she found on King Arthurs site for the dough. She makes the pizza on a screen. I set the Egg up with the CI plate setter, legs up. Cooking grate and a well seasoned pizza stone. The dome temperature was at 500* for 15 minutes before sliding the screen on. Gave it about 10 minutes before attempting to slide the screen out from under the pizza. Only a very small section stuck to the screen. Ernie noticed that on this slice we had a very thin layer of burnt crust, under the burnt area it was fine. If any more info is needed please fire away....

Skiddymarker · February 2016

Why the screen? I use parchment 'cause it is non-stick. Was the char at the edges where the stone might be close to the edges of your CI setter? I'd so, make the pie a little smaller.

NPHuskerFL · February 2016

Why use screen or parchment? Semolina.
To be fair I've used both the screen and parchment. Slow ferment/retard refrigerator proof dough and no sugar. Bump the egg temp from 500℉ to 650℉ish. Dough is everything when you're talking pizza. And 15 minutes isn't nearly enough to heat the ceramics, PS and stone. + definitely make sure to have an air gap between the PS and stone.

Chubbs · February 2016

Not sure how you burned it with that little of a preheat and that temp egg. Then again I don't have a CI plate setter and have never used a screen. i typically go 550-600 and preheat stone for 30 mins or so. Pizza on and done in 10 or so minutes. Never burned a crust. Had plenty undercooked though until finding what works for me

NPHuskerFL · February 2016

@Chubbs Agree! Key in all that...what works for me. There's no masterful secret. Little tricks and techniques yes but, ultimately on your journey you'll find what works for you.

Mr. & Mrs Potatohead · February 2016

Legs down make it an oven, pizza or what ever. In mu mind, you've made it a convection oven, not a brick oven. Start there (legs down) and then go with a stone set on a spacer. It really works well.
Oh, and the higher in the dome that you can bake, the better.

Ladeback69 · February 2016

I agree; legs down, air gap between PS and stone, make sure they have been ast cooking temp for at least 30-45 minutes. Starting out parchment will help. If at 500, half way the cook about 4-5 minutes turn like a quarter turn and pull parchment paper. The are a lot of good pizza threads on hear. I may have to do some this weekend.

jbreed · February 2016

i use a screen. I have never been able to get crust onto a PS then top it and back on - all while doing 6 or 7 since they only ended up 12 inches or so. Pizza seems to be my nemesis though. The screen let's me do 18 inches (5 people to feed) with 3 -4 pies and get it done in 30 mins or so. Not sure about the burn though - that only happens late into the cook for me (colorado cooking with altitude)

Jupiter Jim · February 2016

When I use a screen I spray heavy with pam, if I don't I have sticking problems. I very much like using a pizza screen. Agree with higher in the dome and I usually stay around 425-450.

jtcBoynton · February 2016

dougcrann said:

Ernie uses a recipe she found on King Arthurs site for the dough. She makes the pizza on a screen. I set the Egg up with the CI plate setter, legs up. Cooking grate and a well seasoned pizza stone. The dome temperature was at 500* for 15 minutes before sliding the screen on. Gave it about 10 minutes before attempting to slide the screen out from under the pizza. Only a very small section stuck to the screen. Ernie noticed that on this slice we had a very thin layer of burnt crust, under the burnt area it was fine. If any more info is needed please fire away....

You cooked the pizza for 10 minutes at 500º on the screen. Seems you then cooked it additional time without the screen. Is this correct? If so for how much longer did it cook? How was the top - done, burnt, or underdone?

fishlessman · February 2016

maybe there was a thin section where a little sauce soaked thru, that will cause burning in a localized area, i make pizzas real thin sometimes and have to get it on the egg within seconds or that sometimes happens

Photo Egg · February 2016

Platesetter legs up causes the heat to roll around the PS and directly into the bottom of your pizza stone. This will make your stone temp much hotter than the temp directly above your pizza. This means you are cooking your pizza crust faster than your toppings. Increasing your Egg temp will only make it worse if you don't change your setup.
Going legs up with cooking grate on the legs topped with pizza stone gives you a very large air gap between your PS and pizza stone. The hot rising air will roll right into the bottom of your pizza stone.
An easy fix would be adding another indirect piece where you now have your pizza stone on top your cooking grid. Then add a spacer for a "smaller" air gap, then your pizza stone.
This will raise your cooking level a little and stop the rolling heat from hitting your pizza stone and heating it up to much.
Other option is to go platesetter legs down, spacer, then pizza stone. No need for your cook grid.
I really like to get my pizza higher in the dome. 4-5 inches, at least, above gasket/felt line. But you need to do this with out creating too large of a gap between your pizza stone and the indirect deflector below the stone. Again, to much gap will allow the bottom of your pizza stone to get to much heat and burn your crust.
Keep playing with your setup till you find what works for you.

Image: https://us.v-cdn.net/5017260/uploads/editor/lm/0pz8rpi1ycsi.jpg

MO_Eggin · February 2016

Perhaps the dough got pushed down onto part of the screen causing it to stick? Also, try rotating the pizza 180 degrees part way through the cook to even out the inevitable hot spot (usually the back of the egg).

dougcrann · February 2016

jtcBoynton said:

dougcrann said:

Ernie uses a recipe she found on King Arthurs site for the dough. She makes the pizza on a screen. I set the Egg up with the CI plate setter, legs up. Cooking grate and a well seasoned pizza stone. The dome temperature was at 500* for 15 minutes before sliding the screen on. Gave it about 10 minutes before attempting to slide the screen out from under the pizza. Only a very small section stuck to the screen. Ernie noticed that on this slice we had a very thin layer of burnt crust, under the burnt area it was fine. If any more info is needed please fire away....

You cooked the pizza for 10 minutes at 500º on the screen. Seems you then cooked it additional time without the screen. Is this correct? If so for how much longer did it cook? How was the top - done, burnt, or underdone?

Let me get this out of the way first...no disrespect here....but there is no way anybody is ever going to convince me that it is going to take 30 minutes to completely warm the Egg to 500* or so. The CI plate setter is only .500" thick at best. It is sitting right over a raging fire. It is a piece of iron, not a tile from the space shuttle. Why the screen? Why not parchment paper? Several reasons, this is what was suggested. Wife makes the pizza on the screen, puts it on another pan, makes it very easy to get the pizza on the stone. As to the paper...can only find 12" wide stuff locally. Obviously need to use 2 pieces. Have tried to, after heating up the stone, lay parchment on top of the stone and slide the pizza on to the paper....didn't happen. Parchment burns at 400 or so, Egg is 500+....hmmm...everytime we have tried the paper we ended up with bits of burnt paper on the pizza...

After sliding the screen out we cooked it an additional 4 minutes. Top was perfect. Didn't have a ton of toppings...a light layer of sauce, pepperoni and a decent amount of cheese.

dougcrann · February 2016

Photo Egg said:

Platesetter legs up causes the heat to roll around the PS and directly into the bottom of your pizza stone. This will make your stone temp much hotter than the temp directly above your pizza. This means you are cooking your pizza crust faster than your toppings. Increasing your Egg temp will only make it worse if you don't change your setup.
Going legs up with cooking grate on the legs topped with pizza stone gives you a very large air gap between your PS and pizza stone. The hot rising air will roll right into the bottom of your pizza stone.
An easy fix would be adding another indirect piece where you now have your pizza stone on top your cooking grid. Then add a spacer for a "smaller" air gap, then your pizza stone.
This will raise your cooking level a little and stop the rolling heat from hitting your pizza stone and heating it up to much.
Other option is to go platesetter legs down, spacer, then pizza stone. No need for your cook grid.
I really like to get my pizza higher in the dome. 4-5 inches, at least, above gasket/felt line. But you need to do this with out creating too large of a gap between your pizza stone and the indirect deflector below the stone. Again, to much gap will allow the bottom of your pizza stone to get to much heat and burn your crust.
Keep playing with your setup till you find what works for you.

Thank you very much for the detailed explanation with 0 attitude. What ring is under your plate setter, is it from The Ceramic Grill Store?

dougcrann · February 2016

fishlessman said:

maybe there was a thin section where a little sauce soaked thru, that will cause burning in a localized area, i make pizzas real thin sometimes and have to get it on the egg within seconds or that sometimes happens

The area that was burnt was also the area that was stuck. It was just to the left of center, in the rear of the Egg. Last pizza did this as well, in the same spot. Neither one of them seemed thin in this area. Will pay better attention next time...

fishlessman · February 2016

dougcrann said:

fishlessman said:

maybe there was a thin section where a little sauce soaked thru, that will cause burning in a localized area, i make pizzas real thin sometimes and have to get it on the egg within seconds or that sometimes happens

The area that was burnt was also the area that was stuck. It was just to the left of center, in the rear of the Egg. Last pizza did this as well, in the same spot. Neither one of them seemed thin in this area. Will pay better attention next time...

are you rotating during the cook, thats the hotspot in the egg

dougcrann · February 2016

MO_Eggin said:

Perhaps the dough got pushed down onto part of the screen causing it to stick? Also, try rotating the pizza 180 degrees part way through the cook to even out the inevitable hot spot (usually the back of the egg).

I did forget to spin it this time, perhaps I shouldn't have had so many beers prior to cooking...previous pizza had the same issue in the same spot, left of center on the back side. Read someplace a while back the the plate setter needs to have one of the legs in the rear center of the Egg to help with this hot spot. Wonder if there is any truth to this?

Ladeback69 · February 2016

dougcrann said:

jtcBoynton said:

dougcrann said:

Ernie uses a recipe she found on King Arthurs site for the dough. She makes the pizza on a screen. I set the Egg up with the CI plate setter, legs up. Cooking grate and a well seasoned pizza stone. The dome temperature was at 500* for 15 minutes before sliding the screen on. Gave it about 10 minutes before attempting to slide the screen out from under the pizza. Only a very small section stuck to the screen. Ernie noticed that on this slice we had a very thin layer of burnt crust, under the burnt area it was fine. If any more info is needed please fire away....

You cooked the pizza for 10 minutes at 500º on the screen. Seems you then cooked it additional time without the screen. Is this correct? If so for how much longer did it cook? How was the top - done, burnt, or underdone?

Let me get this out of the way first...no disrespect here....but there is no way anybody is ever going to convince me that it is going to take 30 minutes to completely warm the Egg to 500* or so. The CI plate setter is only .500" thick at best. It is sitting right over a raging fire. It is a piece of iron, not a tile from the space shuttle. Why the screen? Why not parchment paper? Several reasons, this is what was suggested. Wife makes the pizza on the screen, puts it on another pan, makes it very easy to get the pizza on the stone. As to the paper...can only find 12" wide stuff locally. Obviously need to use 2 pieces. Have tried to, after heating up the stone, lay parchment on top of the stone and slide the pizza on to the paper....didn't happen. Parchment burns at 400 or so, Egg is 500+....hmmm...everytime we have tried the paper we ended up with bits of burnt paper on the pizza...

After sliding the screen out we cooked it an additional 4 minutes. Top was perfect. Didn't have a ton of toppings...a light layer of sauce, pepperoni and a decent amount of cheese.

Yes it shouldn't take 30 minutes to heat up a CI plate setter, but it does take 30 minutes more to get a ceramic pizza stone up to temp to cook on that I have found to get good results. The only part on parchment paper that burns on me is the outside corners in direct fire. I have never tried a pizza pan other then what comes from Papa Murphy's or a desert pie. Make your pizza on the parchment paper and when you have it made, cut off the extra. That's what I do. It makes it easier to transfer from the peel to the stone. Here are some from the Pizza Throwdown.

Image: https://us.v-cdn.net/5017260/uploads/editor/g9/h8i36udr0jam.jpg

Photo Egg · February 2016

dougcrann said:

Photo Egg said:

Platesetter legs up causes the heat to roll around the PS and directly into the bottom of your pizza stone. This will make your stone temp much hotter than the temp directly above your pizza. This means you are cooking your pizza crust faster than your toppings. Increasing your Egg temp will only make it worse if you don't change your setup.
Going legs up with cooking grate on the legs topped with pizza stone gives you a very large air gap between your PS and pizza stone. The hot rising air will roll right into the bottom of your pizza stone.
An easy fix would be adding another indirect piece where you now have your pizza stone on top your cooking grid. Then add a spacer for a "smaller" air gap, then your pizza stone.
This will raise your cooking level a little and stop the rolling heat from hitting your pizza stone and heating it up to much.
Other option is to go platesetter legs down, spacer, then pizza stone. No need for your cook grid.
I really like to get my pizza higher in the dome. 4-5 inches, at least, above gasket/felt line. But you need to do this with out creating too large of a gap between your pizza stone and the indirect deflector below the stone. Again, to much gap will allow the bottom of your pizza stone to get to much heat and burn your crust.
Keep playing with your setup till you find what works for you.

Thank you very much for the detailed explanation with 0 attitude. What ring is under your plate setter, is it from The Ceramic Grill Store?

Welcome. Many good ways to cook pizza. You will find what works for you.
Important not to make to many changes at one time and try to be consistent until you find your groove.
Even the pizza dough can make a big difference especially dough with more sugar in it.
If you are going to use a cooking screen I would NOT form the pizza on the screen. It takes to long and the dough will "dig" into the screen.
I still like parchment. It's cheap and easy to use and it does not matter if the parchment burns a little around the edges.
Like others have said. It does not matter if you are using CI platesetter as your indirect. The key is proper spacing/gap of your cooking pizza stone and giving it time to get hot. Higher in the dome also helps a bunch.

Yes, my platesetter is resting on a "Flip Ring" from Ceramic Grill Store.
My favorite product of all my CGS stuff. I should have bought stock in the company years ago.lol

chadpsualum · February 2016

dougcrann said:

Parchment burns at 400 or so, Egg is 500+....hmmm...everytime we have tried the paper we ended up with bits of burnt paper on the pizza...

I have been using parchment paper but only for the first 3 minutes of the cook (at 650F, heated for 40min before putting on first pizza). The paper does start to burn around that point but hasn't quite got there yet. Since the dough is starting to crisp it slides right off. No issues with uneven cooking.

I do agree...lots of different ways to skin this cat. You just need to find what works. If your way didn't work, change 1 thing and see the impact. Rinse, recycle and repeat until you get what you want.

dougcrann · February 2016

Photo Egg said:

dougcrann said:

Photo Egg said:

Platesetter legs up causes the heat to roll around the PS and directly into the bottom of your pizza stone. This will make your stone temp much hotter than the temp directly above your pizza. This means you are cooking your pizza crust faster than your toppings. Increasing your Egg temp will only make it worse if you don't change your setup.
Going legs up with cooking grate on the legs topped with pizza stone gives you a very large air gap between your PS and pizza stone. The hot rising air will roll right into the bottom of your pizza stone.
An easy fix would be adding another indirect piece where you now have your pizza stone on top your cooking grid. Then add a spacer for a "smaller" air gap, then your pizza stone.
This will raise your cooking level a little and stop the rolling heat from hitting your pizza stone and heating it up to much.
Other option is to go platesetter legs down, spacer, then pizza stone. No need for your cook grid.
I really like to get my pizza higher in the dome. 4-5 inches, at least, above gasket/felt line. But you need to do this with out creating too large of a gap between your pizza stone and the indirect deflector below the stone. Again, to much gap will allow the bottom of your pizza stone to get to much heat and burn your crust.
Keep playing with your setup till you find what works for you.

Thank you very much for the detailed explanation with 0 attitude. What ring is under your plate setter, is it from The Ceramic Grill Store?

Welcome. Many good ways to cook pizza. You will find what works for you.
Important not to make to many changes at one time and try to be consistent until you find your groove.
Even the pizza dough can make a big difference especially dough with more sugar in it.
If you are going to use a cooking screen I would NOT form the pizza on the screen. It takes to long and the dough will "dig" into the screen.
I still like parchment. It's cheap and easy to use and it does not matter if the parchment burns a little around the edges.
Like others have said. It does not matter if you are using CI platesetter as your indirect. The key is proper spacing/gap of your cooking pizza stone and giving it time to get hot. Higher in the dome also helps a bunch.

Yes, my platesetter is resting on a "Flip Ring" from Ceramic Grill Store.
My favorite product of all my CGS stuff. I should have bought stock in the company years ago.lol

Ernie is indeed forming the pizza on the screen. We started using a screen simply because it makes getting the pizza onto the stone simple. We have a metal pizza peel, when I tried to use it to slide the pizza onto the stone it was a wreck. Seemed like no matter what we used as a release agent the pizza stuck to the peel. When we used parchment on top of the stone we had zero luck, we always have a bit of a breeze, open the dome and,the paper just blew away. Tried several types of flour....was just to gritty tasting. And we were getting good charcoaled bottoms and raw tops. Fellow said to keep it on the screen until the pizza had firmed up some. Just like the legs up thing....have had more than one person tell me that is the way to go. But legs down, now that someone has EXPLAINED it to me males sense....same for the minimal gap between the setter-stone. I am one of those people that if someone does not take the time to explain to me WHY something work I will more than likely just ignore them. Simply tired of trusting people.
I do need to apologize for my previous post.....I have some serious mental health troubles and today is just not a good day.
I have been wanting to order some of the CGS equipment...just been dragging my arse...
Thanks again for the explanation....and thanks for all the other advice from those who have posted....going to go sulk in the corner now...

Photo Egg · February 2016

Parchment does burn. I normally zip around the edge of the pizza with a Xacto Knife so there is not much to burn.
Or I pull it after a minute as others have above.
Not sure if quality of paper makes a difference?

Image: https://us.v-cdn.net/5017260/uploads/editor/4d/cn0q4hc6m230.jpg

Image: https://us.v-cdn.net/5017260/uploads/editor/4y/equzzqhjdk1n.jpg

Image: https://us.v-cdn.net/5017260/uploads/editor/tz/xl66fhh2md9x.jpg

jtcBoynton · February 2016

@dougcrann Your 14 minutes of cook time resulted in a perfect top but overdone crust. If you move your pizza stone higher in the dome, it will take less time to cook the toppings and that shorter time should help reduce the burning of the crust. Many people find the sweet spot for the pizza stone to be 2-3" above the felt line. You may want to try this, but remember you will need to dial it in for yourself. We all make our pizzas a little different so take all the advice as a starting point and make adjustments for your personal style.

chadpsualum · February 2016

dougcrann said:

When we used parchment on top of the stone we had zero luck, we always have a bit of a breeze, open the dome and,the paper just blew away.

Doug...when I use parchment paper I lay out the piece I'm going to use in the kitchen and then lay my dough on it (finalizing the shape). I then cut any exposed corners. Finally I put the parchment and dough on the peel to take out to the BGE. The parchment and dough slide right off. I cook for 3 min or so and then remove the parchment. That's it. Good luck.

dougcrann · February 2016

Photo Egg said:

Parchment does burn. I normally zip around the edge of the pizza with a Xacto Knife so there is not much to burn.
Or I pull it after a minute as others have above.
Not sure if quality of paper makes a difference?

Care to share details on your set up please? In particular, what is between the setter and stone?

Pizza troubles....

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