Opened my last bag of Fogo

ROlin

StillH2OEgger said:

ROlin said:

Burns hotter than any USA lump and longer.

Not trying to pick a fight or anything, but how would you possibly determine this? Also, is there a reason I should care how hot any particular lump charcoal will burn when the lowest high-end temp is still far hotter than anything I will ever want for cooking?

Check out the Naked Whiz that rate the charcoal. They are the pro's that give the charcoal their rating. It is also the site that made STL charcoal #1. Check out your facts. That way you sound a little smarter. 

ROlin

stlcharcoal said:

ROlin said:

After reading the above article about south of the border lump, I thought I would share my 2 cents worth. I burn Jealous Devil Paraguay axe breaker lump. Why? Because it rocks Rockwood and any other USA lump. Its super hard, does NOT break apart if you drop it, its not full of water, & its not uncarbonized. Burns hotter than any USA lump and longer. Its made in hand built brick kilns. Just like it's been done for 1000's of years. So if that's bad then I guess I'm bad. It also has a unique smell that I love. It ships out of CA. Give it a shot and see if I am right. You be the judge. If regulations are too strict here then maybe its time to move south. If you cant beat them, join them.

Yeah, they're also good at stealing copyrighted graphics off our website and ignoring our cease & desist letters.

Glad you like their product.  Did you get a free bag by leaving them a 5-star review on Amazon?  

JD promotional email from 1/27/17......

Actually my wife has won several free bags from Jealous Devil. Also some nice hats too. Don't know if they stole your pictures & copy right rest assured they did NOT steal your charcoal LOL Jealous Devil rocks

EGGjlmh

ROlin said:

stlcharcoal said:

ROlin said:

After reading the above article about south of the border lump, I thought I would share my 2 cents worth. I burn Jealous Devil Paraguay axe breaker lump. Why? Because it rocks Rockwood and any other USA lump. Its super hard, does NOT break apart if you drop it, its not full of water, & its not uncarbonized. Burns hotter than any USA lump and longer. Its made in hand built brick kilns. Just like it's been done for 1000's of years. So if that's bad then I guess I'm bad. It also has a unique smell that I love. It ships out of CA. Give it a shot and see if I am right. You be the judge. If regulations are too strict here then maybe its time to move south. If you cant beat them, join them.

Yeah, they're also good at stealing copyrighted graphics off our website and ignoring our cease & desist letters.

Glad you like their product.  Did you get a free bag by leaving them a 5-star review on Amazon?  

JD promotional email from 1/27/17......

Actually my wife has won several free bags from Jealous Devil. Also some nice hats too. Don't know if they stole your pictures & copy right rest assured they did NOT steal your charcoal LOL Jealous Devil rocks

I would love it too if it was FREE everytime!!!

StillH2OEgger

ROlin said:

StillH2OEgger said:

ROlin said:

Burns hotter than any USA lump and longer.

Not trying to pick a fight or anything, but how would you possibly determine this? Also, is there a reason I should care how hot any particular lump charcoal will burn when the lowest high-end temp is still far hotter than anything I will ever want for cooking?

Check out the Naked Whiz that rate the charcoal. They are the pro's that give the charcoal their rating. It is also the site that made STL charcoal #1. Check out your facts. That way you sound a little smarter. 

Thanks to your prodding I did look it up, but it appears you exaggerated slightly by saying it burns hotter than any USA lump. I'd be curious to hear why you feel I should care if lump hits a top-end temp of 1,200 degrees vs. 900 when I'm not cooking anything in that vicinity? I'm not worried about sounding smarter, since I'm here to learn. I'd be very surprised if you're being honest about your relationship or affiliation with Jealous Devil charcoal, which I'd be happy to try sometime — just not after posting a fake review to get a free bag.

caliking

Is troll spelled with 2 L’s or 3??

RajunCajun

@stlcharcoal thanks for taking the time to provide the info you have.  Very informative.  I've burned a lot of stuff over the past 17 or so years, Rockwood certainly stands out as my new favorite.  That said, I have no idea how the long-term consistency of RW will be.  Time will tell.  Thanks again.

thetrim

I'm a big fan if Fogo, but part of that is that I can go to their distro center in Hialeah (Miami) and pick up their 35lb bags for $40.  Never tried Rockwood.  My local ACE doesn't stock it.  I've asked them to do so a couple times, but I still haven't seen it there.  They stock KJ charcoal which I also like.

THEBuckeye

My first bag of Fogo was my last. 

stlcharcoal

RajunCajun said:

@stlcharcoal thanks for taking the time to provide the info you have.  Very informative.  I've burned a lot of stuff over the past 17 or so years, Rockwood certainly stands out as my new favorite.  That said, I have no idea how the long-term consistency of RW will be.  Time will tell.  Thanks again.

RW has been around longer than 5 yrs......it just wasn't called that before.  For 5 yrs before that, I sold it in blank, non-descript bags direct to consumers around St. Louis out of the back of my SUV.  When I had retail interest, that's when I made the plunge.  In any case, consistency is what we strive for--as best you can with an all natural product with hundreds of variables.

thetrim said:

Never tried Rockwood.  My local ACE doesn't stock it.  I've asked them to do so a couple times, but I still haven't seen it there.  

You can order it on AceHardware.com and have it shipped to any store for free.  The distribution warehouse is in Tampa, so it should show up pretty quick.  Just search for it, then click "check availability", enter your ZIP, select the store you want, then checkout.  Here's a coupon code for $20 off $100.  RMNCHEER17.  With sales tax, that's probably cheaper per pound than we can ship it to you for on our site.

ROlin

StillH2OEgger said:

ROlin said:

StillH2OEgger said:

ROlin said:

Burns hotter than any USA lump and longer.

Not trying to pick a fight or anything, but how would you possibly determine this? Also, is there a reason I should care how hot any particular lump charcoal will burn when the lowest high-end temp is still far hotter than anything I will ever want for cooking?

Check out the Naked Whiz that rate the charcoal. They are the pro's that give the charcoal their rating. It is also the site that made STL charcoal #1. Check out your facts. That way you sound a little smarter. 

Thanks to your prodding I did look it up, but it appears you exaggerated slightly by saying it burns hotter than any USA lump. I'd be curious to hear why you feel I should care if lump hits a top-end temp of 1,200 degrees vs. 900 when I'm not cooking anything in that vicinity? I'm not worried about sounding smarter, since I'm here to learn. I'd be very surprised if you're being honest about your relationship or affiliation with Jealous Devil charcoal, which I'd be happy to try sometime — just not after posting a fake review to get a free bag.

Glad that you checked out the charcoal site. Yes, there is a charcoal hand made in Montana that does burn a hair hotter i guess. It also burns very smoky because the person makes it that way. The theory being the lump should put the flavor in the meat instead of the using wood chunks with the charcoal. Completely opposite theory of Rockwood. i also think he makes it the old fashioned way. Would love to try some but shipping is a killer. There was a great charcoal a few years back made in the USA called Ozark Oak. Did you ever try it? It was by far the #1 charcoal on the charcoal site. Until Bush's recession put them out of business as they had no wood source. SLC in my humble opinion should partner up with these people and bring back the best charcoal. And no did not do a review just to get a free bag of Jealous Devil. And we are not affiliated with them in any way. It just happens that they are a great charcoal company getting started. Hope that this helps.

Yno

@stlcharcoal Many thanks for your post - it was incredibly extensive and quite educational. In appreciation I just entered order # 1215E on your site for three bags. Actually, I was going to order it anyway, but what the heck. I will let you know how it looks when it gets to the Cereal State (land of fruits, nuts, and flakes). I am quite looking forward to testing it out.

I don't expect there to be no fines in the bags - maybe if I picked it up straight out of the plant, but that is a long trip. Even Fogo has fines and dust after being shipped out here. I keep a Rubbermaid Brute trash can for my lump, and by the time I get to the bottom of a fill of Fogo, there is a fair amount of dust and some very small pieces left. So I don't expect miracles, and I won't hold some dust against you! I just hope the delivery demons don't treat the box any worse than normal.

Thanks again, and Happy New Year!

stlcharcoal

ROlin said:

 There was a great charcoal a few years back made in the USA called Ozark Oak. Did you ever try it? It was by far the #1 charcoal on the charcoal site. Until Bush's recession put them out of business as they had no wood source. SLC in my humble opinion should partner up with these people and bring back the best charcoal. 

You are proving how little you know about this industry.  Bush's recession?  This took place in 2016!  No wood shortage.  WTF are you talking about?

That plant you speak of is still in operation.  They sold out to another company, who is still running it at full capacity.  The charcoal just goes in a different colored bag.  We looked at it, but they use steel kilns and are too far away from St. Louis.....not a good investment for us.

thetrim

stlcharcoal said:

RajunCajun said:

@stlcharcoal thanks for taking the time to provide the info you have.  Very informative.  I've burned a lot of stuff over the past 17 or so years, Rockwood certainly stands out as my new favorite.  That said, I have no idea how the long-term consistency of RW will be.  Time will tell.  Thanks again.

RW has been around longer than 5 yrs......it just wasn't called that before.  For 5 yrs before that, I sold it in blank, non-descript bags direct to consumers around St. Louis out of the back of my SUV.  When I had retail interest, that's when I made the plunge.  In any case, consistency is what we strive for--as best you can with an all natural product with hundreds of variables.

thetrim said:

Never tried Rockwood.  My local ACE doesn't stock it.  I've asked them to do so a couple times, but I still haven't seen it there.  

You can order it on AceHardware.com and have it shipped to any store for free.  The distribution warehouse is in Tampa, so it should show up pretty quick.  Just search for it, then click "check availability", enter your ZIP, select the store you want, then checkout.  Here's a coupon code for $20 off $100.  RMNCHEER17.  With sales tax, that's probably cheaper per pound than we can ship it to you for on our site.

Thanks a lot.    I'll take a look on there.  

StillH2OEgger

ROlin said:

Glad that you checked out the charcoal site. Yes, there is a charcoal hand made in Montana that does burn a hair hotter i guess. It also burns very smoky because the person makes it that way. The theory being the lump should put the flavor in the meat instead of the using wood chunks with the charcoal. Completely opposite theory of Rockwood. i also think he makes it the old fashioned way. Would love to try some but shipping is a killer. There was a great charcoal a few years back made in the USA called Ozark Oak. Did you ever try it? It was by far the #1 charcoal on the charcoal site. Until Bush's recession put them out of business as they had no wood source. SLC in my humble opinion should partner up with these people and bring back the best charcoal. And no did not do a review just to get a free bag of Jealous Devil. And we are not affiliated with them in any way. It just happens that they are a great charcoal company getting started. Hope that this helps.

I've been going to Naked Whiz for years. It's a tremendous resource. I also used Ozark Oak and found it to be very similar to Rockwood. 1A and 1B out of all the varieties I have tried. Curious about what you thought was different or better about the Ozark Oak. Also, would love an explanation about why I should care about how hot it burns, since you indicated earlier it's so important to you. Thanks in advance.

ROlin

stlcharcoal said:

ROlin said:

 There was a great charcoal a few years back made in the USA called Ozark Oak. Did you ever try it? It was by far the #1 charcoal on the charcoal site. Until Bush's recession put them out of business as they had no wood source. SLC in my humble opinion should partner up with these people and bring back the best charcoal. 

You are proving how little you know about this industry.  Bush's recession?  This took place in 2016!  No wood shortage.  WTF are you talking about?

That plant you speak of is still in operation.  They sold out to another company, who is still running it at full capacity.  The charcoal just goes in a different colored bag.  We looked at it, but they use steel kilns and are too far away from St. Louis.....not a good investment for us.

Thanks for your info SLC. I knew that the plant was still in operation. But, does not sell the same quality charcoal than before. I believe it's RO oak, right? And WTF I'm talking about is buying the best charcoal lump for my buck and is NOT a bunch of scraps & bark. Thanks for your support. 

ROlin

StillH2OEgger said:

ROlin said:

Glad that you checked out the charcoal site. Yes, there is a charcoal hand made in Montana that does burn a hair hotter i guess. It also burns very smoky because the person makes it that way. The theory being the lump should put the flavor in the meat instead of the using wood chunks with the charcoal. Completely opposite theory of Rockwood. i also think he makes it the old fashioned way. Would love to try some but shipping is a killer. There was a great charcoal a few years back made in the USA called Ozark Oak. Did you ever try it? It was by far the #1 charcoal on the charcoal site. Until Bush's recession put them out of business as they had no wood source. SLC in my humble opinion should partner up with these people and bring back the best charcoal. And no did not do a review just to get a free bag of Jealous Devil. And we are not affiliated with them in any way. It just happens that they are a great charcoal company getting started. Hope that this helps.

I've been going to Naked Whiz for years. It's a tremendous resource. I also used Ozark Oak and found it to be very similar to Rockwood. 1A and 1B out of all the varieties I have tried. Curious about what you thought was different or better about the Ozark Oak. Also, would love an explanation about why I should care about how hot it burns, since you indicated earlier it's so important to you. Thanks in advance.

The Hasty Bake Grill Community has a cult following for the Ozark Oak lump. Because it was also sold under Hasty Bake Charcoal. They have been around since 1948. People who are on that site hoard the charcoal, show pictures and tantalize people with this great charcoal. What made it great was the light off smell and the way that it impacted food. Hasty Bake brought out a new charcoal a few months back and the people did not like it very well. Because they were so used to Ozark Oak. I myself miss the great smell. If it would come back I would buy a pallet tomorrow. As far as the temperature issue, the hotter lump burns the better it performs @ 7500 feet elevation where I live. Not everyone lives at sea level. It really help to keep the temp up on a 8 hour smoke. Hope that this helps. A lot of my opinions are not popular here but I just state it as it is. 

StillH2OEgger

ROlin said:

The Hasty Bake Grill Community has a cult following for the Ozark Oak lump. Because it was also sold under Hasty Bake Charcoal. They have been around since 1948. People who are on that site hoard the charcoal, show pictures and tantalize people with this great charcoal. What made it great was the light off smell and the way that it impacted food. Hasty Bake brought out a new charcoal a few months back and the people did not like it very well. Because they were so used to Ozark Oak. I myself miss the great smell. If it would come back I would buy a pallet tomorrow. As far as the temperature issue, the hotter lump burns the better it performs @ 7500 feet elevation where I live. Not everyone lives at sea level. It really help to keep the temp up on a 8 hour smoke. Hope that this helps. A lot of my opinions are not popular here but I just state it as it is. 

Well, I think you might be the only person I can recall who doesn't care for Rockwood. A few prefer cheaper varieties because they don't want to pay $1 a pound, but that doesn't seem to be the problem you have. Not sure you have really explained what you don't care for about Rockwood.

northGAcock

Sounds to me like you need to find a bud man and then a lump man.....maybe not in that order. I guess like dope (your term) I am sure the smoke gives off a different taste profile......which can lead to a state of glutney...from either the munchies or that big steak you just rolled / ate. 

Warning, I have used Rockwood for the last couple of years. Things may have changed on the other, but will leave that to you Californians. 

edit....sorry, thought you were asking to compare Rockwood to dope. My bad.

RajunCajun

@stlcharcoal , Thanks, very good to hear.  It looks like I now have a new front runner.  Back in the early days, BGE was the only lump available in this area and came at a premium.  Then, one of the big boxes began selling the John Wayne stuff.....and it was pretty good and affordably priced.  Then the BGE upturn hit and the market became flooded with every brand known to man.  That began the decline of decent lump by most.  Very pleased to hear that consistency is your goal.  I prefer to pay a slight premium to get RW delivered to my door than experience the hit or miss of the others.  Happy New Years to you and yours!

JWBurns

Anyone care to share what Ozark Oak is currently being sold as? 

stlcharcoal

JWBurns said:

Anyone care to share what Ozark Oak is currently being sold as? 

Ozark Oak (per se) isn't made anymore.  A different company brought the plant and now operates it.  So you can be guaranteed there are different manufacturing procedures.  I'm not going to say who it is, but even if someone does allude to it, it's not possible to identify which bags came from which plant.....and they have dozens of plants.

J-dubya

Great thread. Like many others, I only use RW these days, it’s just a great product. 

JohnInCarolina

J-dubya said:

Great thread. Like many others, I only use RW these days, it’s just a great product. 

Agree.  I made the switch after Butt Blast in April and it’s the only stuff I use now.  

Yno

Box just arrived in not so sunny California. For such a long trip it is in amazingly good shape. Just one little ding. I don't know when I will be burning the Rockwood, but I hope to be joining the 'cult' when I do!

Thanks, @stlcharcoal !

lousubcap

Friday night -lump at the top of the page.  Go!

Woodchunk

Is there a minimum production standard that all the lump producers have to meet in the USA?

found this. https://www.thoughtco.com/making-lump-and-briquette-charcoal-1342656

northGAcock

JohnInCarolina said:

J-dubya said:

Great thread. Like many others, I only use RW these days, it’s just a great product. 

Agree.  I made the switch after Butt Blast in April and it’s the only stuff I use now.  

NC = Slow learner. 

stlcharcoal

Woodchunk said:

Is there a minimum production standard that all the lump producers have to meet in the USA?

Nope.....just packaging requirements.  So meet/exceed the stated weight in the bag & have the required CPSC warning label on both sides.  There's a bunch of clean air / particulate emissions rules, but that doesn't have anything to do with quality of the product.

Woodchunk

stlcharcoal said:

Woodchunk said:

Is there a minimum production standard that all the lump producers have to meet in the USA?

Nope.....just packaging requirements.  So meet/exceed the stated weight in the bag & have the required CPSC warning label on both sides.  There's a bunch of clean air / particulate emissions rules, but that doesn't have anything to do with quality of the product.

Thanks

stlcharcoal

Woodchunk said:

stlcharcoal said:

Woodchunk said:

Is there a minimum production standard that all the lump producers have to meet in the USA?

Nope.....just packaging requirements.  So meet/exceed the stated weight in the bag & have the required CPSC warning label on both sides.  There's a bunch of clean air / particulate emissions rules, but that doesn't have anything to do with quality of the product.

Thanks

Everybody is on the honor system which has led to a LOT of false claims.  There were companies claiming on the bag their lump was 100% a certain species of wood, certain carbon or BTU values, where they were made, etc.  It was/is all BS.  The one brand was coming out of Mexico from white oak, but claimed to be 100% hickory.  I've seen Mexican charcoal mixed in with Missouri charcoal and sold as "Made in US".  I also saw some South American charcoal in a "Made in the US" bags here in MO.  I've seen all kinds of buzz words like "organic" and such thrown around, none of which are backed up by anything (but prove them wrong.)  There are a LOT more of this false info when it comes to briquettes......the "professional", "competition", "organic", etc is all BS.  Don't believe it, because limestone, sawdust, and borax are all technically organic and all-natural.

Ours all comes from Missouri.  Mostly oak, some hickory, and it can contain maple, pecan, and/or cherry.  Just depends what the mill is processing that day.  We can't guarantee the carbon content or BTU's are going to be the same, but they're usually 80-85% and 11,500-12,000.  You'll find higher carbonized pieces and lower.  No way they'll ever be all the same.