Cold Smoke Generator-Do all of these load up with creosote?

littlerascal56

I built my first cold smoke generator (venturi style) yesterday, and smoked some cheese last night. I just did a single stick of cheese for 2.5  hours, but it seemed to come out of the smoke very "acrid", with a creosote smell.  Vac packed it and will sample in 8 days or so.

When the smoke generator cooled off, I noticed the top and the inside was covered in black tar (creosote), and there was a puddle of it on the stainless burner grate.  I lit it with lump at the bottom, then layered cherry chips and pieces of apple wood up thru the smoker.  All the wood was old and dry.

My question to you guys that use the venturi style is: Do you have to deal with cleaning all this black sticky mess out of your smoker after every use.  Seems like a pain.  Would it stay cleaner if I re-design it to run the venturi thru the chamber at the bottom?  Then all the smoke would not have to run up thru the chips and out the top, where it is cooler and makeing the creosote?  There is plenty of air going thru it, as I had to add chips & wood every hour. It puts out a LOT of smoke.

Any suggestions would be appreciated!

danguba78

Where did you get that cart/nest?

nolaegghead

I could go into the science behind creosote, aerobic vs anaerobic combustion but it won't help you as much as this suggestion - use a longer smoke tube and put a trap in it to catch any liquid.  You want to condense as much of the smoke as possible to remove the acrid chemicals and particulates before it reaches the food.  Yes, it will need to be cleaned out frequently, but better that crap end up in the tube/trap than the food.

The other suggestion would be to have an oxygen rich, hot fire, but that's not possible with that rig unless you redesign it.

Woodchunk

http://www.amazenproducts.com/

HeavyG

danguba78 said:

Where did you get that cart/nest?

I'm curious also. Those are some proper casters!

littlerascal56

I built the nest, folding shelf, and controller mount.  Used 8” Marathon flat free casters. 

littlerascal56

nolaegghead said:

I could go into the science behind creosote, aerobic vs anaerobic combustion but it won't help you as much as this suggestion - use a longer smoke tube and put a trap in it to catch any liquid.  You want to condense as much of the smoke as possible to remove the acrid chemicals and particulates before it reaches the food.  Yes, it will need to be cleaned out frequently, but better that crap end up in the tube/trap than the food.

The other suggestion would be to have an oxygen rich, hot fire, but that's not possible with that rig unless you redesign it.

I reconfigured it (moved venturi right over firebox), and fired up back up. Didn't put out near as much smoke, but it was "bluish" and not white.  Can see now the difference of having an oxygen rich hotter fire.  Might go back to the drawing board and design a miniture natural draft unit (mini stick burner) and even encorporate your recommendation of an "in line" trap that I could clean out. It would be from steel (welded) and then plumbed to BGE.

I just don't want to use the pellet devices to smoke with. I prefer lump and hardwood flavors over the "sawdust" that pellets are made with.  That's why I got rid of all of my pellet grills.

The Cen-Tex Smoker

littlerascal56 said:

nolaegghead said:

I could go into the science behind creosote, aerobic vs anaerobic combustion but it won't help you as much as this suggestion - use a longer smoke tube and put a trap in it to catch any liquid.  You want to condense as much of the smoke as possible to remove the acrid chemicals and particulates before it reaches the food.  Yes, it will need to be cleaned out frequently, but better that crap end up in the tube/trap than the food.

The other suggestion would be to have an oxygen rich, hot fire, but that's not possible with that rig unless you redesign it.

I reconfigured it (moved venturi right over firebox), and fired up back up. Didn't put out near as much smoke, but it was "bluish" and not white.  Can see now the difference of having an oxygen rich hotter fire.  Might go back to the drawing board and design a miniture natural draft unit (mini stick burner) and even encorporate your recommendation of an "in line" trap that I could clean out. It would be from steel (welded) and then plumbed to BGE.

I just don't want to use the pellet devices to smoke with. I prefer lump and hardwood flavors over the "sawdust" that pellets are made with.  That's why I got rid of all of my pellet grills.

Burning hardwood sawdust is the exact same as burning hardwood logs as far as quality of smoke goes. The difference in burning pellets and sawdust is that they are generally designed to smolder in an oxygen starved fire. Burn them in an oxygen rich fire and they will produce the same quality of smoke as a hardwood log in the same environment. Doing a low and slow in your bge with the vents closed down and few chunks in there is the exact same thing.  It’s the fire, not the fuel that You need to worry about. If you are starving any fire of oxygen, it’s going to produce nasty smoke and creosote. 

littlerascal56

@nolaegghead....took your advice and built a new model. 4" schedule 40 aluminum with a creasote trap. Will fire it up later this week for it's maiden voyage. Hope to be able to get the lump/chips going with the pump, then shut it off and let the natural draft take over from the egg.  The 3/4" hole in the lower base (torch hole) can be adjusted from full open to full shut to add/subtract oxygen to the fire, and supliment the three 3/8" holes located under the fire box.  Will post pics of the creasote jar by the weekend, as I have a bunch of cheese to smoke on Saturday.

nolaegghead

Looks like some great construction.  My only criticism is you will have more condendation as the effluent cools, so the trap would be better off on the other side of the transfer pipe.  But might be fine, only one way to find out...

littlerascal56

I kind of thought that might be the case (locate trap closer to egg), but I put trap lower than egg, hoping creosote would run downhill back to jar.  I can flip it easily in minutes.
We will know after a few hours of smoke, and the pictures will tell the results!

nolaegghead

Oh, that would work fine.

littlerascal56

You and I are going to get this design perfected....no matter what.  I have used the “smoking tubes” for 30 years...our diesel generators had those in the oil filters.  We lit the used oil filter on fire after every 6 month service, and all that remained in 30 minutes was the core, which is the exact replica of a tube smoker!!!!
These were locomotive engines (era 1965), built by GM.  Tubes were 3” x 24”, and open on both ends.  Used them in our gassers with wood chips and sawdust back then!

milesvdustin

That cart is bitchin, thats all I have to add. 

littlerascal56

Those 8” tires move effortless. Went to the Yoder factory and they were using those 8” Marathon casters on their “competition” carts.   I buy these on e-bay for $31 each.  High quality and never have to add air.  Damn cart rolls with 1 finger from shed to patio!

milesvdustin

well, now I know what casters will be on my 2-egg table this summer

littlerascal56

They use really good ball bearings too, unlike the Chinese no brand casters! Have grease zirks on the hubs. USA quality! 

nolaegghead

Nice.  I love casters.  I have (almost) everything in my shop on them.  I just buy Harbor Freight, but I try to compensate  - if my load is 100 lbs per corner, I buy 250 pound casters.  Mostly stuff just sits there and it's climate controlled, so no rust issues with bearings.

blasting

@littlerascal56 Love the cold smoke project, and the nest.  Great thread.

littlerascal56

We can turn this into a “caster” post!  Every tool in my shop is on casters!  I custom built all the mobile bases, so I can make it a woodworking shop, or a metal fab/welding shop in minutes.  But we can’t forget it’s main purpose in life is a “BBQ-smoking-grilling” man cave with multiple beverage coolers!

nolaegghead

littlerascal56 said:

We can turn this into a “caster” post!  Every tool in my shop is on casters!  I custom built all the mobile bases, so I can make it a woodworking shop, or a metal fab/welding shop in minutes.  But we can’t forget it’s main purpose in life is a “BBQ-smoking-grilling” man cave with multiple beverage coolers!

Nice!  I love to see other people's shops.  Post some pics and show off on the man-cave thread or here.

littlerascal56

nolaegghead

@littlerascal56 Man, love your powermatic saw.  Split AC, heat, TV....you got it goin' on!

littlerascal56

Took me 61 years to trade up to the “good stuff”!  That PM 2000 was 1 year old when the High School traded for a Saw Stop!  I basically stole it.  It’s made st least a dozen walnut & maple end grain cutting boards and 3 walnut jewelry boxes. Had a Delta Unisaw cabinet saw previously, but the PM is in a class above that. Love the smell of fresh cut hardwood, almost as much as oak on the egg!

nolaegghead

I love how you surface-mounted 2x4 troffer lights.  Great use for them and economical lighting.

GrillSgt

Just asking, and I understand a desire to conquer something by overpowering it, but why is this better than one of the pellet trays?

nolaegghead

GrillSgt said:

Just asking, and I understand a desire to conquer something by overpowering it, but why is this better than one of the pellet trays?

It removes most of the combustion heat from the meat area and allows you to burn chips vs pellets.  I'm not convinced there's much of a difference in the two except pellets can have fillers and binders.

littlerascal56

nolaegghead said:

I love how you surface-mounted 2x4 troffer lights.  Great use for them and economical lighting.

I had a local distributor donate those 6 LED troffers to me (old stock on his shelf that was not selling).  About 6 months after I installed them, I had cataract surgery, and implants in both eyes.  Those LED's were so damn bright that I had to put dimmer switches on them!  LED's are definetely the way to go in a workshop.  I usually dim them way down if we are out there watching TV.

I plan to build custom walnut end caps for all those troffers...just to dress them up a little.

GrillSgt

nolaegghead said:

GrillSgt said:

Just asking, and I understand a desire to conquer something by overpowering it, but why is this better than one of the pellet trays?

It removes most of the combustion heat from the meat area and allows you to burn chips vs pellets.  I'm not convinced there's much of a difference in the two except pellets can have fillers and binders.

Sawdust?

littlerascal56

GrillSgt said:

Just asking, and I understand a desire to conquer something by overpowering it, but why is this better than one of the pellet trays?

Pellets do have fillers and binders that leave an aftertaste in cheese.  Wood chips and chunks are 100% natural and impart the best flavor, without that “ashtray” taste.  Pellet trays are for the guy wanting the least amount of work, which is fine for most people’s taste buds!

GrillSgt

So the pellet smokers in general deliver an inferior product?