Pizza - Several process questions (HELP!)

junkyarddawg

So, I have been making pizza on the egg off and on for about a year now, with mixed results (From really good to terrible). For some reason lately I have failed more than succeeded. I usually buy the already made dough from Whole Foods. Well, Friday evening I left the dough out on the counter for a few hours before we made the pizza. I think it was easier to form the dough into a nice, round and evenly structured crust. But man, as soon as I tried to slide it onto the stone (already heated on the egg), it just started to stick to the stone immediately and fold up on itself. I even had parchment paper under it. It was a disaster.  Here's my setup:

XL BGE

2 plate setters (One leg on the old one broke a few years ago. So now I have 2)

I have tried both direct and indirect.

Direct: Grate with plate setter on top of grate.

Indirect: New PS with legs up, then grate, then old PS on grate as the stone.

This last disaster I had the egg (XL) at about 500 degrees, grate only, with the plate setter on top of the grate as the stone. Maybe that was part of the mistake. So, 500 degrees, grate, then plate setter, and I slide the pizza with parchment paper onto stone / plate setter.

I did the indirect setup above recently but I didn't feel the egg got hot enough. The top of the pizza was cooked but the crust needed longer cooking, I think.

Anyway, any tips regarding my setup from those much more experienced than me would be greatly appreciated. I just can't seem to pin down a consistent process that yields good or even decent pizza every time. So to sum it up...

1) Should dough bought at the store be allowed to reach room temp?

2) Is direct or indirect the best method?

3) How different is using the old plate setter from using a pizza stone? I like the XL plate setter because of the size. It allows a lot of room to work with. I haven't found a pizza stone as large.

I am really starting to get frustrated. Thanks in advance.

jtcBoynton

1) Should dough bought at the store be allowed to reach room temp?

Yes yes and yes

2) Is direct or indirect the best method?

Indirect will give you more consistent results. Make sure warm up time is long enough.

3) How different is using the old plate setter from using a pizza stone? I like the XL plate setter because of the size. It allows a lot of room to work with. I haven't found a pizza stone as large.

Not much if any different.

Raw dough will stick to a hot stone. It will release when set. Good aim when launching is important.

You may want to move the cooking stone higher in the egg. The proper height will depend on the dough recipe, cooking temp, dough thickness, and amount of toppings. Many find the sweet spot to have the stone 2-3" above the felt line - but remember you will need to dial it in for yourself. We all make our pizzas a little different so take all the advice as a starting point and make adjustments for your personal style.

StillH2OEgger

junkyarddawg said:

But man, as soon as I tried to slide it onto the stone (already heated on the egg), it just started to stick to the stone immediately and fold up on itself. I even had parchment paper under it.

Just wanted to clarify that you left the pizza on the parchment paper and slid the parchment paper (with pizza on top) onto the hot stone. This doesn't seem to add up to me unless something on the stone prevented the parchment paper from sliding on smoothly.

smokesniffer

Here is what works for me. I run the egg around 500*. I go indirect, PS legs down, then I use the little ceramic feet that used to come with the eggs,( don't think they do that any more) or you could use crumpled up AF, making them into little balls. Place the balls onto the PS and then the pizza stone.I like an air gap between the PS and the pizza stone.Let the stone get up to temp. I use Parchment paper, I sprinkle a bit of corn meal on the parchment, and then the dough. Place the whole thing onto the pizza stone and leave it for about 4-5 minutes, you will see the dough starting to firm up, and thats when I pull the parchment out. I use the pizza peel to lift up the crust and then a grab the paper with a pair on tongs and pull it out. I will turn the crust around a couple of times during the cook. Good Luck Za off the egg is awesome.

ElkhornHusker

I used parchment paper to transfer pizza from peel to stone and nothing stuck.  I was then able to slide paper out from under the pizza after a few minutes.  I also used two fire bricks on the grate to raise the stone.

I have only complete 2 attempts at pizza, but using the method above my 2nd attempt went really well.

Skiddymarker

ElkhornHusker said:

I used parchment paper to transfer pizza from peel to stone and nothing stuck.  I was then able to slide paper out from under the pizza after a few minutes.  I also used two fire bricks on the grate to raise the stone.

I have only complete 2 attempts at pizza, but using the method above my 2nd attempt went really well.

Agree with ElkhornHusker - Been making pizza for some time and I like using parchment. I cut the paper to be about 1/2" smaller than my stone and then she the dough to be about 1/2" smaller than the paper. Paper doesn't burn and it is way easier to pull. 
Try making your own dough, once you get onto it, it is super simple. 

blasting

I'm in the camp of no parchment.  It's a crutch, and only foodsafe to 425-450 degrees.  Those that use parchment will disagree, and that's ok.

Doing it the "pro" way really isn't that difficult.  Build pie on the peel with plenty of dusting of semolina flour on the peel.  Shake back and forth between toppings to ensure nothing is sticking.  No need to flour the stone.  Aim right.  Quick pull back on the peel and your golden.

hoofaloos

I've never once used parchment paper and have never had a pizza stick to the stone.  I run about 550 and my setup is:

PS legs up, regular grid, 4- 28oz tomato cans and the pizza stone on top of that.  The cans allow my stone to sit as high as possible in the egg while still allowing the lid to close.  I've never lacked any space with the XL pizza stone either.  I've never tried using the PS as a stone so I can's speak to that.  I do let the stone sit in the egg at 550 for about 30 minutes before i put that first pizza on.  just use a bit of corn meal on the peel so that the pizza doesn't stick to that

StillH2OEgger

blasting said:

I'm in the camp of no parchment.  It's a crutch, and only foodsafe to 425-450 degrees.  Those that use parchment will disagree, and that's ok.

Doing it the "pro" way really isn't that difficult.  Build pie on the peel with plenty of dusting of semolina flour on the peel.  Shake back and forth between toppings to ensure nothing is sticking.  No need to flour the stone.  Aim right.  Quick pull back on the peel and your golden.

I need every crutch I can get! I'm not a fan of the texture using corn meal adds and too much flour isn't much better. I'm neither smart enough or talented enough make a good one without the trimmed up parchment paper.

Braggart

blasting said:

I'm in the camp of no parchment.  It's a crutch, and only foodsafe to 425-450 degrees.  Those that use parchment will disagree, and that's ok.

Doing it the "pro" way really isn't that difficult.  Build pie on the peel with plenty of dusting of semolina flour on the peel.  Shake back and forth between toppings to ensure nothing is sticking.  No need to flour the stone.  Aim right.  Quick pull back on the peel and your golden.

Ditto.   Easy peasy. 

junkyarddawg

StillH2OEgger said:

junkyarddawg said:

But man, as soon as I tried to slide it onto the stone (already heated on the egg), it just started to stick to the stone immediately and fold up on itself. I even had parchment paper under it.

Just wanted to clarify that you left the pizza on the parchment paper and slid the parchment paper (with pizza on top) onto the hot stone. This doesn't seem to add up to me unless something on the stone prevented the parchment paper from sliding on smoothly.

Yes. I slid the paper with pizza on. Maybe I just need to do it more carefully.

NavyMatty

I'm late to the party but will chime in as Pizza was my first cook on my egg.  I use setup platesetter legs up, grid on top of that, and the BGE stone on top of the grid.  If I was like you and had a 2nd platesetter with a leg broken off, I'd use that one (with the remaining 2 legs up and towards the back of the egg) on top of the grid--same height/location as my pizza stone.

1.  Yes--store bought dough at room temperature helps.  Being from NJ, I like my pizza as thin as one can get it.  I'll take a store-bought dough from the refrigerator section of the local supermarket and leave it on the counter for an hour or so before I want to roll it out.  I'll cut a dough into two pieces so I can make two thin pies out of it.  After cutting, I will lightly flour it and fold it in on itself multiple times before flattening and rolling out.  This will help it warm up a bit if it's still cold.

2.  Indirect is what I use and have had zero issues.  I keep dome temp between 550-650.  But you want everything to stabilize at least 20 minutes before first pie goes on so you can make sure the your stone is equalized.  If the stone isn't as hot as the oven the top will redone and you'll have very soft crust--think limp tortilla crust.

3.  You should be completely fine with using the old platesetter as your stone.

Parting shot...  I'm in the cornmeal camp as well--i don't think there's any reason for parchment UNLESS you don't have a wooden pizza peel to build your pies on.  If you have a wooden peel, a dusting of cornmeal before you put your dough down will serve as "ball bearings" to help the pie slide onto the stone from the peel.  The cornmeal shouldn't stick to your pizza unless the dough is really wet--which it won't be if you follow the method above.  If you make more than a few pizzas, you'll want to brush the old cornmeal off the stone after pizza #3 so that it doesn't burn.

Good luck!  Happy to explain further if there are any questions.

Miked125

Use parchment paper, makes sliding on and off the stone a breeze 

XLentEGG

Dough made in the bread machine...PS legs down...XL stone on green feet... 400* for at least 45minutes to heat stone... parchment paper from start to finish.( lowered my temp from 500* to 400* to trade the corn meal for paper)

stantrb

I AM a pro, and I can tell you parchment isn't a crutch, it's a tool.  With a store-bought dough coming to room temperature (which is too warm), you're going to run a very real risk of humidity condensing on the dough's surface.  Added flour to compensate for that, and to allow a good release, is going to change the hydration characteristics of the dough.  That means inconsistency and a better chance of burning something.

I'd take my store-bought dough and bring it up to about 50-60 degrees internally.  If you're using a rolling pin, roll it a little on the cold side.  If you're opening by hand, press the initial disk out and then back off 15 minutes and let it get a little warmer.  Bringing a dough like that all the way to room temperature almost always means over-proofing, which means sticking to everything and poor texture.

You need to use an indirect setup.  Eggheads hate hearing this, but an Egg isn't a brick oven, and cannot be forced to cook like one.  I bake pizzas at 800F all day every day, but in the Egg I top out at 650F, which is really more like 500F in the dome.  Back off your temperature a little, spin your pie for evenness, and use parchment as a landing aid when you need to.

***A parchment advantage***
You get to build all the pizzas ahead of time while the Egg heats up.  This kind of rest will give you a puffier cornicione and a more relaxed crumb.  Just build them on parchment, trim the parchment, and stage them on your counter until cook time.

xiphoid007

I actually prefer the oval stone with my raised grid. I put the grate on top and my pizza stone on that. I aim for 500-550 as any hotter and I find the stone overheats, burning the pizza before the toppings and cheese are appropriately.

I prefer cornmeal for sliding the pizza on. The large grain size, relatively speaking, acts like tiny lite ball bearings. Also,I love that roasted cornmeal flavor that gets imparted to the crust. That's the biggest reason I like it.

Lately I've been using prebaked Boboli crusts so it's easier to make with the kids. This is partly due to my current living situation as I don't have the counter space or room to keep my pizza peel handy and do it right. Still works really well, and far easier to do with the kids. No sticking either and I just slide the pizzas right on the stone without anything.

Another "pizza peel" that works great is pampered chefs mega cake lifter. It's great for individual sized pizzas and easier to control because it's smaller.

Good luck and don't give up! You'll get it!!

Also, try to only change one variable each time. If you change too many things, you won't be able to decide what changes are working.