When theory doesn't match observations...

SkySaw

I was reading a thread here yesterday that included a link to a webpage on Amazingribs about wood smoking: 
http://amazingribs.com/tips_and_technique/zen_of_wood.html

The page has some good and interesting info about wood and wood smoke, but he makes an assertion that I don't think anyone here would agree with. He talks about the necessity for a strong supply of oxygen to create good smoke. He mentions that a fire produces bad smoke when it is starved for oxygen, and goes on to suggest that "This is also a problem with kamados and eggs. They are so well insulated and so efficient with the heat right below the meat that they typically burn small cool fires and smolder white smoke."

There is something wrong with this statement, as we all know that ceramic cookers can produce food ranging from no smoke at all to a broad spectrum of smoke flavours.

So where is Amazing Ribs wrong? I know that when my BGE is coming to temp, it produces bad smoke, which we typically refer to as having lots of VOCs. But once the Egg is up to temp for any length of time it becomes easy to control the smoke. My suspicion is that he is wrong that kamados burn small cool fires. I suspect that the reason why it is so important to use lump charcoal is that the fire is actually a small hot fire. The heat prevents the wood from smouldering and producing the bad smoke. 

Other thoughts? Is Amazing Ribs right? If not, where do you think he goes wrong about kamados and smouldering smoke?

milesvdustin

Yeah he is wrong. When i smoke really anything i bring the temp up past 300, then throw wood on and cool it down to my desired temp, and add a hunk or so of wood depending on what is cooking. Gets the nasty lump smoke outta the way quickly. 

SkySaw

He is also talking about the wood that you put in for smoke flavour. His contention is that the wood that you add after the lump is burning nicely will smoulder and taste bad because the fire is cool and the wood will be starved of oxygen. I don't think that follows with anyone's experience with ceramics.

Focker

His assessment is pretty spot on, and he has the science to support it.  

For the egg, I like to get a stable fire burning for an hour or two before tossing the meat on directly from the fridge.  Today for spares, I let the fire get going, then spread the lit lump around with tongs.  Temp got to 290 dome until the white smoke stopped.  Put ribs on, then backed down on the vent settings, dome temp settled down to 250 and stayed there for 5 more hours.  Left the house after the first hour, returned during the 4th, foiled an hour, and finished.  

I believe this is the reason I prefer traditional Q off the WSM.  

Although I do like the eggs for convenience (like today), where I leave things unattended for long periods.  This, and the minimal cleanup, is where the egg shines. 

clifkincaid

I only live once. Might as well eat BBQ!

cazzy

Nope...he's right. Aaron even talks about it in his book. Honestly, until you've had grub cooked properly (keyword) on a pit with an offset fire source, it is hard to understand how poor the smoke profile is off the egg.  @SGH
 could probably go on and on about the difference in the smoke profile, but most of your guests won't care or notice. 

It has a lot to do with the actual fire temp.  There is a sweet spot that produces the best smoke profile.  Most don't actually monitor the fire temp, you usually look for your wood to be on fire and you know you're good.  @Lit
  can attest to this, because after tweaking his approach on his Backwoods Pit, he is now benefiting greatly being in that sweet spot.  While we don't use wood as our main fuel source, you do get smoldering during low and slows.  The reason why is because we dump a **** ton of lump (prolly more than suggested), light a few spots and add meat after the smoke clears.  The excessive lump blocks the airflow, which doesn't give your fire enough oxygen to thrive.  Your lump ends up burning in a minion method...ie it trickles.  I do feel our bad smoke doesn't compare to what you get from a starved dirty fire on an offset, so don't worry about it too much.  

CenTex and I did a lot of testing to improve our smoke profile.  Our results were great, but did require a lot more work.  What did we do?  We ran a lil hotter with smaller fires.  Pretty difficult for doing a low and slow because you have to add lump.  I used a charcoal starter to add more lump.  The results were much better and is worth a try when you want to fool around.  Again, our smoldering is much different, so I wouldn't worry too much about it. 

Steve753

That hasn't been my experience at all. I monitor the grate temperature and meat temps on my Maverick, and I see no indication that I have a cool fire. I layer my cooking wood in the charcoal, so I don't have to open up the Egg to keep on adding more.

cazzy

Steve753 said:

That hasn't been my experience at all. I monitor the grate temperature and meat temps on my Maverick, and I see no indication that I have a cool fire. I layer my cooking wood in the charcoal, so I don't have to open up the Egg to keep on adding more.

I don't think it's a big deal with the egg, but science does support the article.  Dr. Blonder knows his $hit.  The egg's fire is cool, because there usually is only a small portion of your lump lit at any given time during a low and slow.  Outside of it being the main reason the egg doesn't produce a great smoke profile, there really isn't much to worry about here.

nolaegghead

Generally I agree.  But you can compensate by adding less smoke wood.

Ideally with a kamado or anything like it, the ideal fire is the same as an offset smoker fire.  You burn your wood hot.  But that means a big fire.  So you try to scale this down so you don't generate much heat because the kamado is insulated with ceramic and therefore efficient.  The best you can do with the egg is run a little hotter an try to keep a small fire by starting a small fire, and keep your wood distributed in smaller pieces.

I've experimented with this a lot - taking things to an asymptotic extreme.  I've had to throw out some food after burning some big chunks of wood.

You don't need much smoke wood in an egg.  I would almost say briquette sized chunks of lump and evenly distributed chips would give you the best smoke.  And smoke wood goes a long way in a kamado.

SGH

Brother, I could write pages upon pages about this subject. But atlas, I feel that folks are probably growing tired of reading my long winded ramblings. As such, all I will say is long live the buffalo. On a serious note, Cazzy brought some very good points to light above. What they mean by "cool" fire is based on volume of, not so much as actual temp. What this means is in say a large offset you have upwards of 5 pounds of burning coals plus 5 pounds or more of wood burning at any given time. In the egg you have a volume of mere ounces burning/smoldering when running low temps. Even though the egg and the offset may both be running at 250 degrees, it takes a very large fire to get the offset up to this temp and maintain it. Not so with the egg. When your egg is running at 250 degrees, you can remove the cooking grid and hold your hand within inches of the lump for quite sometime without getting burnt. On the other hand, when one of my very large units (such as #8) is running at the same 250 degrees, you can not even get your hand close to the coal bed for more than a second or two because the heat is so intense. Again, it's more the actual volume of heat as opposed to the actual temp.  Another great point he made was the sweet spot for good smoke. This will be different from unit to unit as size, design and efficiency will vary greatly on each. Due to its size and twice through design, unit #6 performs flawless at 265-295 degrees when going for smoke profile. On the other hand, unit #8 being a once through design and much larger in size, she will lay down near perfect smoke at temps as low as 215 degrees up to 300 degrees (and probably higher) and never blink. I'm not going to debate which is better, the egg or the offsets. I own and use both for different things. Each certainly has their place in the pantheon of Q. However I will say this when it comes to producing a deep, heavy, but still clean smoke profile. Nothing can even seriously approach the amount that a well designed, clean burning offset can produce. That is not sentiment my friend, it's simply the facts. The Q Gods like Mixon and Franklin prove this point everyday. At the end of the day, the ceramic cookers are great all around rigs. They do everything pretty good. On the other side of the coin is the offsets. They do one thing and one thing only, and nothing can match their performance in this arena. For quality smoke, they stand at the top of the mountain and are unchallenged. 

cazzy

Well said @nolaegghead & @SGH

I like posts like these...they're the most helpful for peeps on the come up!

SGH

cazzy said:

Well said @nolaegghead & @SGH

I like posts like these...they're the most helpful for peeps on the come up!

@cazzy
Agree. Not trying to beat a dead horse, but your point above about folks not ever having Q off of a well designed, finely tuned, clean burning offset is about as true as it gets. It's simply a night and day difference. One has to try it for themselves to truly understand the difference. It's not even close. 

YukonRon

@SGH I am curious, you mentioned above you use the egg and offset for completely different things. If I understand your point correctly the deep rich smoke is from the offset, and the egg just can't duplicate that phenomena.
What is the criteria, in your experience, to go to the offset vs. the egg, in terms of the protein to be prepared? I mean, cuts of beef, pork, poultry, seafood, that seem to be better in the absorption and release of smoked flavor? I am such a novice, with smoking compared to others on here, and my approach with the egg has been inconsistent at best. Certain meals I have done extremely well, and some as NOLA had said, I have tossed out. The last few cooks have been encouraging to say the least, however, being CDO TO THE MAX, encouraging is not getting it done. I would appreciate any and all insight that may be shared.

SGH

@YukonRon - First let me be clear, the egg can and will give spectacular results on most things. Not everyone likes deeply smoked meat. However there are those who do and this is where the offset comes into its own and really shines. When you move to some of the really large beef primals and subprimals, the ceramics just do not have the volume of moving air to compete with the much larger offsets. If you increase the volume of air in a ceramic cooker to the point that is necessary to keep the smoke truly clean, the temp will get much to high. There is just no way around it. The ceramics are to efficient in a sense to accomplish this. They are also to small. It doesn't take much burning lump at all for temps to skyrocket in a ceramic kamado style cooker. Part of this is compounded by the fact that the actual fire is inside of the cook chamber. This is not the case on a large offset. You can have a rather large and cleaning burning fire in a offset and still maintain low temps. Some of the beef clods that we cook are well in excess of 30 pounds. This alone makes cooking them impractical on most ceramics. Not saying that it can't be done, but chances are, if you cram it in there you will have scorched parts. It will be to close to the dome and the walls for to long of a time and the reflective heat will ultimately take its toll. The beauty of the egg is it does a good job, it's simple to use, uses minimal fuel, and is up to temp fast. For most things and everyday meals, the egg is a tough act to follow. On he other hand, for very large primals, subprimals and carcass, there just is no competing with the much larger and practical offsets. Here is a general rule that I follow, but please remember that this is not law, just what works for me. I have a large BGE, and as such I limit size to around 12 pounds. Anything larger than this goes on one of the big units. Just works for me. As to the smoke on a offset vs the egg or just about anything else for that matter, the offset can't lose. It burns wood. It does not smolder, it truly cooks with live fire. There is a misconception out there that after 160 degrees that meat stops taking on smoke. This is clearly false. I can prove it wrong everyday of the week with one of my offsets. While it is true that it's uptake of smoke slows or lessens as the internal temp rises, it does not stop until you have reduced the meat to almost mere ash. At the end of the day, the egg uses a very small amount of wood to produce some smoke. A offset burns wood for the duration. This is part of the reason that folks such as Franklin wraps. To stop the uptake of smoke. You honestly can reach a point where you taste nothing but smoke. Just to be clear, I'm a huge fan of the egg. I cook most things on it. But as with all things there are times that there are better tools for the job. Again, I refer to clod and even really large briskets. I know some folks get mad when I say things like the above, but I'm almost willing to bet that they have never ate from a primal that was cooked on a large, clean burning offset such as Franklins. There is just no comparison. I have a pic somewhere (and I will look for it) of a smoke ring that penetrated a honest 3/8 deep into a brisket that I cooked on a offset. If you got this deep of a ring (you won't without cheating) on just about any other style of cooker, the meat would be so bitter that you couldn't eat it. The difference is one burns wood as its fuel and has a massive amount of moving air and the other use small pieces of wood to generate a little smoke and has minimal air flow. The type of fuel (wood vs lump) and the amount of moving air make all the difference in the world. Above you asked about particular cuts. Anything that will cook fast goes on the egg. This includes all seafood and most fish. Shrimp, oysters, crabs and most fish are much better cooked (grilled) hot and fast as opposed to low and slow. Smoke adds little to their quality in my opinion. The exception being some of the fishes. Not all, but some. As such the egg wins here. Poultry picks smoke up so easy that most of my poultry goes on the egg. Turkeys over 12 pounds go on the big units. Boston butts go on the egg. However whole pork shoulder (butt + picnic) goes on the big units. Chuck roasts goes on the egg but clod goes on the big units. These are just some examples. But again, I have narrowed it down to weight, 12 pounds or less goes on the egg and over 12 pounds goes on one of the units. Just what works for me. I hope that this answers some of your questions. If it doesn't, I will gladly try again my friend. 

YukonRon

@SGH as you well know I value your experience on all things remotely related to grilling. I appreciate the reply. I am one of those types that re reads everything a couple of times prior to asking questions. This is another post I am keeping on hand for reference. I love cooking with the egg, and I am always trying to dial it in better each time.
Thank you for your response and help. It is much appreciated.

Jeremiah

@SGH when you say "traditional offsets" are you including reverse flow units as well? What are yours? 

KSwoll

@SGH, How does the egg compare to the smaller offsets that are prefabbed from the box stores? I love cooking on my eggs and enjoy the food that comes off of them. I am constantly trying to improve my BBQ skills. Is it worth looking into a smaller offset or would I be better off looking at a large unit?

SGH

Jeremiah said:

@SGH when you say "traditional offsets" are you including reverse flow units as well? What are yours? 

Yes sir, I'm including reverse flows. I have some of each. I have a traditional once through rig (Franklin style) a reverse flow (baffle plate) and a direct fired (raised direct). Of these three type, the direct fired does not apply to what I said above. Only the reverse flow and the once through units. The direct fired is akin to cooking on the egg. Just on a much larger scale.  It does not have anywhere near the the amount of air movement as the other two. It's basically smolders rather than burns.  

Jupiter Jim

Thanks so much! what a learning experience.

SkySaw

Dang it. I was kind-of worried that this would be the response. Up here in Toronto, I guess maybe because of our winter weather, offsets are rare, and I admit that I've never had the chance to try BBQ from a real BBQ joint (I did have the pulled pork sammich at Camp 31 in Paris ON once). 

I see that a lot of comments address the fact that ceramic cookers can't lay down as much smoke as the offsets, which makes total sense. It also explains why so many experienced Q'rs who are new to the Egg ask how to get more smoke onto their food. But my issue is with the idea that the kind of smoke produced in the Egg is the wrong (bad) kind produced from smouldering, oxygen-starved wood. I see blue smoke coming from my Egg, and I'm certain that I know the difference between the taste of sooty smoke and good smoke.

Darby_Crenshaw

in the egg, more air means a bigger fire, and that means hotter (and more, whiter) smoke.

it's patently untrue that the small fire in an egg is a starved fire.  it isn't.

a starved fire is one which HAD plenty of air, and no longer does.   that's a candle which has been blown out, and which smolders, because the fire is large (surface area), but no longer fully burning.  this creates incomplete combustion, which is sooty and black (not white) smoke.  lots of particulate matter.

BUT

in the egg, the fire isn't held back, it just isn't allowed to grow.

this is a VERY different thing.  the analogy is a throttle or gas pedal.  the amount of air coming in is fixed, the fire cannot grow (expand).  but the lump is fully allowed to burn at it's 1200 degrees or so.  it's just that 1200 degree fire is asmall one, and dome temps stays low.

250 dowm is a small 1200 degree fie, not a poorly burning 250-degree fire.

big difference.

which means that when you lump is burning at 1200 (and it's pretty much always burning at near a thousand degrees), the combustion is complete.  any smoking wood touching your lit lump, is burning fully.


the very reason charcoal is used instead of pure wood is because charcoal burns more cleanly and at a relatively fixed temp.  yes, charcoal can be hotter or cooler.  don't take the "1000 degrees' as an absolute.  the point here is that it is always fully burning, the fire size just reduces or expands.  at a certain point, wide open, the fire can take off, burning at very high temps.

if you were to choke back that fire then yes, you'd have bad smoke as the fire gets choked.  but that's not how we use the egg.  you don't get a raging 1000 DOME temp going, and then choke back to 250 and put your meat into that dying fire.

you instead build a small fully-combusting fire which only raises the temp to 250.

if you want to see the difference, try the "sear and dwell" method.  perhaps the worst method of cooking devised for the egg.  it uses the dying fire, and sooty choked smoke, to roast the steak after searing, and with vents shut down.

last point...  he talks about the choked fire producing white smoke.  nope.  i mean, yeah, some white smoke, but mostly sooty smoke. puffy white smoke comes from tossing wood on a fire that's going really hot.  and that white is steam.  if your egg is plugging along with blue smoke or very little visible smoke, just open the vents to 400, and you will see, within a minute or so, a plume of free flowing white smoke.  that's due to MORE oxygen, more  fire.

SGH

KSwoll said:

@SGH, How does the egg compare to the smaller offsets that are prefabbed from the box stores? I love cooking on my eggs and enjoy the food that comes off of them. I am constantly trying to improve my BBQ skills. Is it worth looking into a smaller offset or would I be better off looking at a large unit?

That's kind of a trick question my friend. But believe this or not, with practice and proper fire management, the cheap offsets will turn out just as good of food as the much larger and higher price units. The only difference is they are much harder to control until you get use to them and they won't last as long due to being made out of much thinner metal. But the food will be spot on. Look what Franklin started on, look at what he uses in all of his first videos. A cheap store bought offset with a few mods. Also due to their smaller size, they don't have the capacity of the larger units. However for most home cooking, they have more than enough capacity. If you do your part and manage the fire, the meat off of a cheap offset will be just as good as the meat off of a 12,000 dollar Jambo. 

Thatgrimguy

SGH said:

KSwoll said:

@SGH, How does the egg compare to the smaller offsets that are prefabbed from the box stores? I love cooking on my eggs and enjoy the food that comes off of them. I am constantly trying to improve my BBQ skills. Is it worth looking into a smaller offset or would I be better off looking at a large unit?

That's kind of a trick question my friend. But believe this or not, with practice and proper fire management, the cheap offsets will turn out just as good of food as the much larger and higher price units. The only difference is they are much harder to control until you get use to them and they won't last as long due to being made out of much thinner metal. But the food will be spot on. Look what Franklin started on, look at what he uses in all of his first videos. A cheap store bought offset with a few mods. Also due to their smaller size, they don't have the capacity of the larger units. However for most home cooking, they have more than enough capacity. If you do your part and manage the fire, the meat off of a cheap offset will be just as good as the meat off of a 12,000 dollar Jambo. 

That's an ole country Pecos he's cooking on in his videos. $400 from Academy!  But you better be ready to babysit and have a large variety of size splits/chunks and know how and when to use them. Not much room for error.

Threads like this make waiting on my Shirley Fab trailer smoker even harder!! Just 6 more months.

Hotch

So @SGH where do the "Vertical Cabinet" smokers come in. I would think they have far less air flow across the protein surface than an offset but much more than a ceramic. Thus the available "Good Smoke" would be somewhat in the middle?

Asking because my next cooker will be either an vertical cabinet or insulated offset.

SkySaw

SGH said:

Brother, I could write pages upon pages about this subject. But atlas, I feel that folks are probably growing tired of reading my long winded ramblings. As such, all I will say is long live the buffalo. On a serious note, Cazzy brought some very good points to light above. What they mean by "cool" fire is based on volume of, not so much as actual temp. What this means is in say a large offset you have upwards of 5 pounds of burning coals plus 5 pounds or more of wood burning at any given time. In the egg you have a volume of mere ounces burning/smoldering when running low temps. Even though the egg and the offset may both be running at 250 degrees, it takes a very large fire to get the offset up to this temp and maintain it. Not so with the egg. When your egg is running at 250 degrees, you can remove the cooking grid and hold your hand within inches of the lump for quite sometime without getting burnt. On the other hand, when one of my very large units (such as #8) is running at the same 250 degrees, you can not even get your hand close to the coal bed for more than a second or two because the heat is so intense. Again, it's more the actual volume of heat as opposed to the actual temp.  Another great point he made was the sweet spot for good smoke. This will be different from unit to unit as size, design and efficiency will vary greatly on each. Due to its size and twice through design, unit #6 performs flawless at 265-295 degrees when going for smoke profile. On the other hand, unit #8 being a once through design and much larger in size, she will lay down near perfect smoke at temps as low as 215 degrees up to 300 degrees (and probably higher) and never blink. I'm not going to debate which is better, the egg or the offsets. I own and use both for different things. Each certainly has their place in the pantheon of Q. However I will say this when it comes to producing a deep, heavy, but still clean smoke profile. Nothing can even seriously approach the amount that a well designed, clean burning offset can produce. That is not sentiment my friend, it's simply the facts. The Q Gods like Mixon and Franklin prove this point everyday. At the end of the day, the ceramic cookers are great all around rigs. They do everything pretty good. On the other side of the coin is the offsets. They do one thing and one thing only, and nothing can match their performance in this arena. For quality smoke, they stand at the top of the mountain and are unchallenged. 

Great post! I quoted the entire thing because it's worth reading again. 

SGH

@SkySaw Again, and just to be clear, you can get a decent amount of smoke with a ceramic cooker. Actually enough to satisfy most people. Due simply to design and fuel source, it just won't ever equal what one can do on a clean burning, wood fired unit. However, there are folks who honestly don't care for the real heavy smoke. They are happier with the food off of a WSM, Kamado or drum. It's simply a matter of personal taste. Even though I have several offsets and cabinets, I have three eggs and KJ Jr in the arsenal as well. There are somethings (especially small things) that it just makes more sense to use the egg for. Example: I can cook a 20 dollar rack of ribs on my egg and only burn a few ounces of fuel. This same 20 dollar rack of ribs cooked on let's say unit #8 would take at least 10 pounds of wood just to get up to cooking temp and online. Then another 10 pounds for the cook. So in this scenario the egg is the clear winner. I can cook this rack of ribs for about a dollar in fuel costs on the egg. However on unit #8, the fuel cost exceeds the price of the meat by a wide margin. Now you can reverse this scenario and cook 100 racks of ribs at one time on unit #8 and then the egg loses. It's kind of give and take. You have to weigh your needs versuses your wants and find a middle ground.  This middle ground is where the egg shines. 

SkySaw

Darby_Crenshaw said:

in the egg, more air means a bigger fire, and that means hotter (and more, whiter) smoke.

it's patently untrue that the small fire in an egg is a starved fire.  it isn't.

a starved fire is one which HAD plenty of air, and no longer does.   that's a candle which has been blown out, and which smolders, because the fire is large (surface area), but no longer fully burning.  this creates incomplete combustion, which is sooty and black (not white) smoke.  lots of particulate matter.

BUT

in the egg, the fire isn't held back, it just isn't allowed to grow.

this is a VERY different thing.  the analogy is a throttle or gas pedal.  the amount of air coming in is fixed, the fire cannot grow (expand).  but the lump is fully allowed to burn at it's 1200 degrees or so.  it's just that 1200 degree fire is asmall one, and dome temps stays low.

250 dowm is a small 1200 degree fie, not a poorly burning 250-degree fire.

big difference.

which means that when you lump is burning at 1200 (and it's pretty much always burning at near a thousand degrees), the combustion is complete.  any smoking wood touching your lit lump, is burning fully.


the very reason charcoal is used instead of pure wood is because charcoal burns more cleanly and at a relatively fixed temp.  yes, charcoal can be hotter or cooler.  don't take the "1000 degrees' as an absolute.  the point here is that it is always fully burning, the fire size just reduces or expands.  at a certain point, wide open, the fire can take off, burning at very high temps.

if you were to choke back that fire then yes, you'd have bad smoke as the fire gets choked.  but that's not how we use the egg.  you don't get a raging 1000 DOME temp going, and then choke back to 250 and put your meat into that dying fire.

you instead build a small fully-combusting fire which only raises the temp to 250.

if you want to see the difference, try the "sear and dwell" method.  perhaps the worst method of cooking devised for the egg.  it uses the dying fire, and sooty choked smoke, to roast the steak after searing, and with vents shut down.

last point...  he talks about the choked fire producing white smoke.  nope.  i mean, yeah, some white smoke, but mostly sooty smoke. puffy white smoke comes from tossing wood on a fire that's going really hot.  and that white is steam.  if your egg is plugging along with blue smoke or very little visible smoke, just open the vents to 400, and you will see, within a minute or so, a plume of free flowing white smoke.  that's due to MORE oxygen, more  fire.

Darby, I think you've hit the nail on the head here. My suspicion is that Eggs produce a small hot fire, and your post explains this very well. Thanks.

SGH

Hotch said:

So @SGH where do the "Vertical Cabinet" smokers come in. I would think they have far less air flow across the protein surface than an offset but much more than a ceramic. Thus the available "Good Smoke" would be somewhat in the middle?

Asking because my next cooker will be either an vertical cabinet or insulated offset.

Let me say this, if you run them as designed, they fall right in between a offset and a egg. Kind of best of both worlds if you will. However, with practice you can run it with small splits (I do) and start really approaching what the offsets can do. Again, it don't quite equal it in my opinion, but it will come very, very close. For large volume cooking and ease of operation, the big cabinets are a tough act to follow. I love mine. 

Hotch

SGH said:

Hotch said:

So @SGH where do the "Vertical Cabinet" smokers come in. I would think they have far less air flow across the protein surface than an offset but much more than a ceramic. Thus the available "Good Smoke" would be somewhat in the middle?

Asking because my next cooker will be either an vertical cabinet or insulated offset.

Let me say this, if you run them as designed, they fall right in between a offset and a egg. Kind of best of both worlds if you will. However, with practice you can run it with small splits (I do) and start really approaching what the offsets can do. Again, it don't quite equal it in my opinion, but it will come very, very close. For large volume cooking and ease of operation, the big cabinets are a tough act to follow. I love mine. 

Thanks, It's not going to be easy deciding on which one.

SGH

Hotch said:

Thanks, It's not going to be easy deciding on which one.

From a practical stand point and for home use, the cabinet is the way to go. It's light on fuel, can be fired on charcoal, lump, wood, or a combination of all three. Capacity is more than enough as well. The smoke profile is more than enough for most people. The big offsets will always do one thing and one thing only very well, smoke meat. They have a huge appetite for fuel. And the bigger they are, the bigger their appetite for fuel. Also they are a lot of work. The cabinets are just like the egg, you can set it and forget for 24 hours + if you so desire. Not trying to talk you out of getting a offset, quite the contrary. Just pointing out the pros and cons of each. I think that everyone should own at least one offset. 

Hotch

Yep I am leaning towards the Safe from Pitmaker.