Home Theater Projector Opinion

SmokyBear

Now yer talking!  Some good ideas there and it sounds like you're well on your way.

I suggest checking out Green Glue and RSIC clips if you're serious about sound isolation.

My room is built as a "room within a room" hanging on RSIC clips with 2 layers of drywall and Green Glue between.  It was a ROYAL PITA doing sound isolation "right" as it's like building an aquarium..you can't have any "leaks" in the sound isolation, or you wind up defeating much of the whole thing.  BUT - if you get it right..wow.  Then, when you add the sound treatments to handle the reflections..you've got one heck of a room.

I may be able to dig up contact info for the guy who did my sound treatment plan..he has a company that sells the RSIC clips, Green Glue, etc and was a good guy to work with.  Got hooked up with him on AVSForum.  All the sound isolation stuff I did was from reading AVS. 

One word of advice - build a detailed plan before you do thing one.  I didn't do that and was forever running into things that I'd boxed myself into a corner on (like, how I was going to run power to my lights so that I didn't cross the wiring for my A/V - that's a big no-no, for example).  We got through it, but I REALLY wish I had taken the time to do a plan FIRST!!

Ladeback69

SmokyBear said:

Now yer talking!  Some good ideas there and it sounds like you're well on your way.

I suggest checking out Green Glue and RSIC clips if you're serious about sound isolation.

My room is built as a "room within a room" hanging on RSIC clips with 2 layers of drywall and Green Glue between.  It was a ROYAL PITA doing sound isolation "right" as it's like building an aquarium..you can't have any "leaks" in the sound isolation, or you wind up defeating much of the whole thing.  BUT - if you get it right..wow.  Then, when you add the sound treatments to handle the reflections..you've got one heck of a room.

I may be able to dig up contact info for the guy who did my sound treatment plan..he has a company that sells the RSIC clips, Green Glue, etc and was a good guy to work with.  Got hooked up with him on AVSForum.  All the sound isolation stuff I did was from reading AVS. 

One word of advice - build a detailed plan before you do thing one.  I didn't do that and was forever running into things that I'd boxed myself into a corner on (like, how I was going to run power to my lights so that I didn't cross the wiring for my A/V - that's a big no-no, for example).  We got through it, but I REALLY wish I had taken the time to do a plan FIRST!!

Thanks @SmokeyBear.  I know what you mean about not crossing power over A/V lines.  I don't have that going up to my current set upstairs from my basement and at times it creates an issue.  I am the only one who notices it.  the nice thing is my breaker panel is close to the area I want to build in and thinking about it I should be able to avoid crossing the power to lights I hope.  My Father in law will want to do the wiring for the lights, but I think I will pay some to do it right and I want it inspected so it meats code.

So you recommend 2 sheets of sheet rock with the green glue over QuiteRock?  That's what my brother in law was thinking of using in his new house.  He knows a lot about the systems and electronics, I am just not sure he does about the soundproofing.  

I am trying to decide whether to wait to get the projector after it is all built or get it now and work around it.  I know that dust can be a killer to the projector and lamp.  I am trained in AutoCad so I have been playing with drawings of the area.  I know I need to get more detailed after what you just wrote.  I am very visually oriented so I have a picture in my head of how each piece is going to go together, I just need to put a plan together.   

SmokyBear

I used 2 layers of regular drywall (I "think" both were the same - 5/8s?  Or maybe I did one 5/8 and one 3/4..can't remember - there's a reason you do different thicknesses if I remember right..)

Green Glue between the two layers or drywall.  No QuietRock.  (I put that in my library since we have noisy neighbors..good product but VERY expensive!!) Hang the drywall on channels attached to the studs with RSIC clips.  You don't want the drywall connected directly to the studs as that lets the sound travel through your whole house.

Your goal should be to minimize ANY/ALL holes in the drywall as that's the "aquarium principle" - think of the room as an aquarium and it can't have any holes or the water (sound) will leak out.  Where you DO have a hole (eg: for power or A/V lines coming in), you need to engineer the heck out of it, caulk it with sound isolating caulk, etc.  AVS has a TON of great info on all that.

You should also consider putting all your ceiling cans in sound isolating boxes.  I did that, and then the &*(*&(!^&*^! electrician drilled holes in my boxes before I realized it.  Had to take them ALL down and redo every one (urgh).  Ceiling lights are one of the biggest sources of sound leaks unless you isolate.

Oh, and isolate your ductwork also.  That was one of the biggest PITAs for me.  You should SEE what we came up with - I literally built a "U" shaped box that the ductwork exits the room through - more turns in the duct reduce sound travel. 

You'll want to have a pro figure out your airflow in the room, as HTs can get HOT when you sell them up tight (like an aquarium).  I had a pro installer do it and our room STILL gets way hot.  (I really think he didn't do a good job on calculating needed airflow or put big enough vents in - but when you DO put big enough vents in, you get holes in the aquarium and need to do way fussy things to compensate for it).

Hope I haven't caused any due alarm.  This CAN be a fun project, but I wouldn't do thing one until you've figured it "all" out as you'll find yourself undoing and redoing even with the best of plans going in..

I love our room but don't think I'd ever do it again! 

Will try to post some pics of the construction (if I can find them) over the weekend.

Cheers..

Ladeback69

SmokyBear said:

I used 2 layers of regular drywall (I "think" both were the same - 5/8s?  Or maybe I did one 5/8 and one 3/4..can't remember - there's a reason you do different thicknesses if I remember right..)

Green Glue between the two layers or drywall.  No QuietRock.  (I put that in my library since we have noisy neighbors..good product but VERY expensive!!) Hang the drywall on channels attached to the studs with RSIC clips.  You don't want the drywall connected directly to the studs as that lets the sound travel through your whole house.

Your goal should be to minimize ANY/ALL holes in the drywall as that's the "aquarium principle" - think of the room as an aquarium and it can't have any holes or the water (sound) will leak out.  Where you DO have a hole (eg: for power or A/V lines coming in), you need to engineer the heck out of it, caulk it with sound isolating caulk, etc.  AVS has a TON of great info on all that.

You should also consider putting all your ceiling cans in sound isolating boxes.  I did that, and then the &*(*&(!^&*^! electrician drilled holes in my boxes before I realized it.  Had to take them ALL down and redo every one (urgh).  Ceiling lights are one of the biggest sources of sound leaks unless you isolate.

Oh, and isolate your ductwork also.  That was one of the biggest PITAs for me.  You should SEE what we came up with - I literally built a "U" shaped box that the ductwork exits the room through - more turns in the duct reduce sound travel. 

You'll want to have a pro figure out your airflow in the room, as HTs can get HOT when you sell them up tight (like an aquarium).  I had a pro installer do it and our room STILL gets way hot.  (I really think he didn't do a good job on calculating needed airflow or put big enough vents in - but when you DO put big enough vents in, you get holes in the aquarium and need to do way fussy things to compensate for it).

Hope I haven't caused any due alarm.  This CAN be a fun project, but I wouldn't do thing one until you've figured it "all" out as you'll find yourself undoing and redoing even with the best of plans going in..

I love our room but don't think I'd ever do it again! 

Will try to post some pics of the construction (if I can find them) over the weekend.

Cheers..

On you room not being cool enough, you have account for all those bends, because the will slow the air flow down so if that isn't addressed by either bigger ducts, vents or more of them the room won't feel as comfortable.  I have a couple runs of duct going up stairs that I would probably have to deal with too.  I saw the U shape thing for the vent out of the HT that you were talking about.  I now see this is going to bigger project then I thought.  I guess I need to start making a list and schedule to follow.

SmokyBear

Here's a pic of a ceiling mounted RSIC clip (in case you were wondering what the heck those are)..

I have these on all 4 walls - they make different clips for the ceiling (drop down like this) and walls (almost a flat U shape).

SmokyBear

Here's the funky U box for the HVAC..

Ladeback69

SmokyBear said:

Here's a pic of a ceiling mounted RSIC clip (in case you were wondering what the heck those are)..

I have these on all 4 walls - they make different clips for the ceiling (drop down like this) and walls (almost a flat U shape).

I've seen seen videos of these things on YouTube being installed. 

Ladeback69

Ladeback69 said:

SmokyBear said:

Here's a pic of a ceiling mounted RSIC clip (in case you were wondering what the heck those are)..

I have these on all 4 walls - they make different clips for the ceiling (drop down like this) and walls (almost a flat U shape).

I've seen seen videos of these things on YouTube being installed. 

I guess I forgot about this post I made over a year ago on building my home theater.  The walls are up now so I have a little different plan.  My wife is not to worried about the sound getting upstairs, but I more want to keep the sound out, like hearing the furnace run or hearing footsteps upstairs.

I forgot about these clips and have built my walls under my joist and beams.  I guess I could cut the walls down, but not sure it will help much with the way I have the wall though now.  I am thinking of using resilient channel on the walls then DDW with green glue between them.  For the ceiling I plan using isolating clips and hat channel with DDW and GG.  I want to get the walls done and everything insulated before I do the ceiling to see if I need to add any duct into the room to cool or heat it.

This is what I have so far. 


The room is lot cleaner then they are in these photos.  I am working on moving my equipment of over to a new AV rack and running my power for electrical next.  That I have a plan for.  I am trying to limit where I cross at 90 degrees and am trying to stay more then 2' from the lines or more if possible.  I am also thinking of building a soffit all the way around the inside of the after I put the ceiling up.  The soffit is where I plan to put my lights and rope lights around the outside parameter.  My current new preamp is a Integra DCH-60.5 which is 7.2.  I should have looked more into Dolby Atmos when @cazzy was talking about it last year.  I am going to run wire and build 4 backer boxes to add 4 future speakers in my ceiling in the future if the boss will ever let me upgrade to Dolby Amos.  Better to plan for the future so I don't have to tear out the ceiling.  I will probably be using Klipsch in ceiling speakers since that is what I using in HT now.

for project I am looking at the Epson 6040ub or the Sony VPL-HW45ES.  The dealer I am using sells both, the Sony is $1999 and the Epson is $3699 which includes a mount and extra bulb with a 3 year warranty.  The Epson has 4K up-scaling and to me a good transition till there is more 4K content out there.

I will try an upload new photos as I go now that I am working on it again.  Hoping to have some walls up by Christmas.

Thanks for looking. 
 

lkapigian

Less than $10.00 Invested

Toxarch

So much for the $1000 projector budget. I always say, when building a HT, come up with a budget and then expect to triple that budget by the time you are done. The AVS forum is a GREAT resource for information but you have to be careful there. If you try to keep up with the latest and greatest stuff, you will go broke. Imagine you buy a green egg. Then in 8 months a better green egg with upgraded tech and features comes out. Then 18 months later your egg is old tech and only lower cheaper companies are making similar stuff, but still better than yours. And you still haven't finished building out your patio.

I would say don't buy the projector until you are almost done building. One reason is so that you have the latest tech in your budget. Another reason is that once the projector goes up, the tools tend to be put down. You have some free time, you could either work on the theater or you could watch a movie. Movie wins majority of the time. If you have stuff you really want done in the theater, especially in the finishing look, then don't hang the projector.

For HVAC, more A/C than you think is better. People put out a lot of BTUs. Then you add the projector and amps and that is a lot of heat in a well insulated and mostly air tight room. Put in several vents and definitely put in a return duct. I had my HVAC zoned so that the theater had its own thermostat. I can have the 4 ton heat pump only cooling the theater.

I have an Epson 5010 (bought years ago) and it has been a great projector. I have a Stewart 123" screen. I think it is a 1.3 gain screen. If you do switch to a 180" screen like you talked about, you are going to need a light cannon and a high gain screen. Of course high gain screens need high contrast projectors. I love my 123" screen, but it was bought when 720P was the latest and greatest picture. Now, I could fit a bigger screen with my setup. It would be nice, but I am OK with this size. If I did go bigger, I'd go for a cinemascope screen and DIY motorized masking.

Oh yeah, 3D is cool when you first get your theater setup. You will watch a few and then it will dwindle down. It is neat at first but I never watch in 3D anymore. I can't even remember the last time I watched one. I would not suggest making that a requirement in the selection process.

Ladeback69

Toxarch said:

So much for the $1000 projector budget. I always say, when building a HT, come up with a budget and then expect to triple that budget by the time you are done. The AVS forum is a GREAT resource for information but you have to be careful there. If you try to keep up with the latest and greatest stuff, you will go broke. Imagine you buy a green egg. Then in 8 months a better green egg with upgraded tech and features comes out. Then 18 months later your egg is old tech and only lower cheaper companies are making similar stuff, but still better than yours. And you still haven't finished building out your patio.

I would say don't buy the projector until you are almost done building. One reason is so that you have the latest tech in your budget. Another reason is that once the projector goes up, the tools tend to be put down. You have some free time, you could either work on the theater or you could watch a movie. Movie wins majority of the time. If you have stuff you really want done in the theater, especially in the finishing look, then don't hang the projector.

For HVAC, more A/C than you think is better. People put out a lot of BTUs. Then you add the projector and amps and that is a lot of heat in a well insulated and mostly air tight room. Put in several vents and definitely put in a return duct. I had my HVAC zoned so that the theater had its own thermostat. I can have the 4 ton heat pump only cooling the theater.

I have an Epson 5010 (bought years ago) and it has been a great projector. I have a Stewart 123" screen. I think it is a 1.3 gain screen. If you do switch to a 180" screen like you talked about, you are going to need a light cannon and a high gain screen. Of course high gain screens need high contrast projectors. I love my 123" screen, but it was bought when 720P was the latest and greatest picture. Now, I could fit a bigger screen with my setup. It would be nice, but I am OK with this size. If I did go bigger, I'd go for a cinemascope screen and DIY motorized masking.

Oh yeah, 3D is cool when you first get your theater setup. You will watch a few and then it will dwindle down. It is neat at first but I never watch in 3D anymore. I can't even remember the last time I watched one. I would not suggest making that a requirement in the selection process.

@Toxarch, thanks for the comments and advice.  I currently have a 720 projector my BIN gave me and it is fine till I get the build pretty much done.  So I will be waiting on that.  As for a 180" screen that is out the window now that my room is only 14" wide.  I have a n Elite 120" screen with a 1.1 gain and is pretty good for the money.  Going with a motorized screen to go between 16:9 and 2.35:1 would be nice, but not in the budget.  3D seems to come with most of the better projectors, but I agree it is kind on not needed except for Avatar.  That was a great 3D movie that I want to watch again when I get this thing somewhat done.  Is a home theater ever really done?

On  HVAC I have been looking at doing a mini zone system for it.  The HT is the first room in my unfinished basement that I am finishing and will be doing the bath room near by next.  If I finish the whole basement I may need a whole other system from one HVAC guy I have had an estimate from.  That would be getting up to the thousands of dollar.  That's why I am doing the ceiling last and waiting to see how the feels for comfort.  My wife doesn't understand about a closed room, BTU's and body heat making the room warmer.

Soundproofing the room is what is so expensive.  I am trying to figure out why this Green Glue they say to put between two layers of sheet rock is so expensive. The stuff is like $16 to $17 for 32oz tube and it takes two tubes to do one 4x8 sheet of sheet rock.  Right now the plan is to get the wiring done, insulate the room and check the sound quality and feeling of the room before I continue on.

I am currently working on a spread sheet to see how much it is going to cost to finish the room.  It is adding up fast.  My wife now wants me to wall in an area so our dog can't get into an area of one of our 2 sump pumps she likes to bark out so we can have her in the basement with us.  It is also so we get her to start using the doggy door and platform we have for her to use.  That is what I will be working on this weekend.

Toxarch

I wasn't talking about buying a motorized screen. That is expensive. I was talking about buying a big screen and then making your own motorized parts in front. Back when I built my theater, people were using the motorized curtain motors and X10 plugs/controls. You could DIY a motorized screen for around $100-150 in parts plus the fabric.

Oh yeah, I will suggest remote control lighting. It's not terribly expensive now and it's something I use all the time in the theater. Bass shakers in the seats is nice too. I went with the smaller Aura bass shakers mounted to the frames of the recliners. Run it on a single amp and send it the really low bass frequencies. If nothing else, you can wire for it now so you can add it later if desired. Run a 2" conduit with sweeping elbows for the projector. Makes it a lot easier for upgrading in the future. Back when mine was built, I had to run DVI cables with the monster plugs.

Don't go too overboard trying to get a sound proof room. Look around on AVS and there are some cheaper alternatives that work OK. Remember, once you add air ducts, there's a hole in your sound proof room. Mine is 1/2" sound board behind 5/8" sheetrock and I used construction adhesive between. Is it perfect? No. Is it good enough? I think so. It's above the garage and the only bedroom nearby is mine. I've had severe thunderstorms roll through while watching a movie and all I heard was a faint rumble of thunder. I thought it was in the movie background and kept waiting for a storm to finally show up and never did. I didn't know there was a thunderstorm outside the house until I walked out of the theater. And the theater is on the 2nd floor.

Ladeback69

Toxarch said:

I wasn't talking about buying a motorized screen. That is expensive. I was talking about buying a big screen and then making your own motorized parts in front. Back when I built my theater, people were using the motorized curtain motors and X10 plugs/controls. You could DIY a motorized screen for around $100-150 in parts plus the fabric.

That's not a bad Idea, but I think I will stick with the 16:9 for now.  I could change it later.

Oh yeah, I will suggest remote control lighting. It's not terribly expensive now and it's something I use all the time in the theater. Bass shakers in the seats is nice too. I went with the smaller Aura bass shakers mounted to the frames of the recliners. Run it on a single amp and send it the really low bass frequencies. If nothing else, you can wire for it now so you can add it later if desired. Run a 2" conduit with sweeping elbows for the projector. Makes it a lot easier for upgrading in the future. Back when mine was built, I had to run DVI cables with the monster plugs.

I looking at bass shakers to be added to theater seats when I buy them down the road.  I was going to run extra wiring to my projector, but adding the conduit with a pull string to it and the front of the room may be a good idea as well.

Don't go too overboard trying to get a sound proof room. Look around on AVS and there are some cheaper alternatives that work OK. Remember, once you add air ducts, there's a hole in your sound proof room. Mine is 1/2" sound board behind 5/8" sheetrock and I used construction adhesive between. Is it perfect? No. Is it good enough? I think so. It's above the garage and the only bedroom nearby is mine. I've had severe thunderstorms roll through while watching a movie and all I heard was a faint rumble of thunder. I thought it was in the movie background and kept waiting for a storm to finally show up and never did. I didn't know there was a thunderstorm outside the house until I walked out of the theater. And the theater is on the 2nd floor.

Thanks for the advice on this one.  I was looking into putting resilient channel, two layers of 5/8" drywall with Green Glue between them to the walls and to the ceiling; clips, hat channel and two layers of 5/8" drywall with Green Glue between them.  My room is under my kitchen and part of my living room so I am trying to keep people above to not hear me scream at football games or them walking and my wife not hear it when she is sleeping in our bedroom that is over 30' away and above.  I am trying to decouple the room, but I don't think I need to it as much as I think.  I also read on the Green Glue site that using one tube of their glue is good, but not optimal so I may do that and it won't brake the bank.  I am doing this in stages and I am doing the work to save money.

This weekend my wife want's to have our dog with us when we are downstairs so I will be adding a wall to keep our dog away from one our sump pumps she doesn't seem to like.  I hope this works.  I will also allow us to use the ramp and platform to our other doggy door instead of upstairs.  The things we do for our pets, but will make it nicer downstairs.  I am eventually finishing my whole basement.
 

EggNorth

All good stuff covered above - I can add don't spend too much on lighting, it's suppose to be a dark room anyway - I spent money on fancy lighting and haven't turned on except to clean the room.

I like having my AV gear in another room, only thing in the room are the projector and speakers and chairs.  Setup the movie, close the door and enjoy.  I can leave the door open and use the remote.

Most important is to buy the best UPS possible.  I found out the hard way by blowing a $600 bulb.  I now also have one of those flashlights that plugs into the wall and turns on if power is cut in the HT room, if it comes on and stays on, time to shut down.   

We we now have had our HT for 15 years, never been to the theatre since, and enjoy it each week.

Enjoy!

Lit

I think I'm in for about $350 total. Great for football. Go Falcons.

Toxarch

I have the equipment in a wall rack near the door in the back of the room. Access the back of the rack from a closet. IR repeater wired to above the screen and to the rack and light controls. I can control everything except the HVAC with a single remote.
UPS is good to have. Everything but my amps are on UPS. If the sound goes and UPS alarms go off, it's time to shut everything down.
My seats are recliners from Costco. I looked at theater seats and didn't like them. Plus they weren't comfortable. Found recliners I liked so I bought 7 of them. I rotate them around so they get even wear.

Ladeback69

@EggNorth, thanks for the advice on lighting I was going to put remolding lights in a soffit I am going to build around the room and LED rope lighting around the outside of it to give a cool affect.  I will be painting the ceiling and front wall flat black so light doesn't reflect back.  I am putting in 10 lights in the soffit, that should be enough.  I am going to build a 10' riser that is 7'x11' and bar height counter for 4 bar stools.  I am planning on 2 rows of 3 powered theater seats.  I am pre-wiring for Dolby Atmos and will be installing backer boxes for the speakers.  Not sure if I will build a stage or not, haven't decided.  My subs are built into my floor speakers so want to keep the on the floor.  I am thinking of building a in-wall shelving are under the screen for the center channel and a PS3 or other game system.  I will be running extra wires to everything for future.
I had to look up what UPS was.  My equipment is hocked up through a Monster Surge protector, but I do not have a UPS at this time.  I will look into that as well, but our power has only gone out about 3 times in the last 9 years we have lived there and not for more then a few hours, but some kind of backup would be nice.

@Lit, I have had my screen up for a few years now and have a 720 projector, but the other family member's don't like that it is cold and dirty downstairs.  That's why I am building walls and soon a 3rd bathroom.  Below is before the other walls went up.



@Toxarch, my equipment is in another room and I just received a Logitech Harmony Ultimate remote to be able to run all of my equipment.  There will just be chairs and speakers in the room.  I am looking into a mini zone HVAC system, but won't do anything till the insulation is up and see how warm or cool it is.  

I have attached a plan of my theater and a 3D view.

 

vb4677

@Ladeback69
I've got a nice approx. 100" diagonal home theatre screen, wall mountable, if you're interested.  KC area, too!  I went through 3 projectors and converted to a flat screen - lost some diagonal, but pleased.  So, that's why I have a screen...

Hans61

Wait 6 months and 4K will become affordable 

Toxarch

I put rope lighting around the risers and along the top of the walls. I NEVER use the rope lights at the top of the walls. I only use the ones on the risers when there are guests so they can walk out if needed.

Ladeback69

vb4677 said:

@Ladeback69
I've got a nice approx. 100" diagonal home theatre screen, wall mountable, if you're interested.  KC area, too!  I went through 3 projectors and converted to a flat screen - lost some diagonal, but pleased.  So, that's why I have a screen...

Thanks @vb4677, but I am happy with my Elite 120" for now. 

Hans61 said:

Wait 6 months and 4K will become affordable 

How affordable are you talking?  $3,000 an under?  I was thinking of doing the Epson 6040, but now I am thinking of doing the Sony 45es and save about $2000 grand.  I have Google Fiber, but am thinking of going back to Dish Network and looks like they have 4K coming.  There isn't enough content out there to justify it to me yet.  I need to get the room mostly done first before buying a projector. 

I think I have a plan for soundproofing now and will do it in stages to handle the cost.  My father in law and I added two new walls to close in area where the sump pump is and our dog does not like.  My wife wants her to be in the basement with us so this put my theater back for a week.  Hope to have it closed in next week, then continue with the HT.