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It’s time to kick back, relax and enjoy the aromas of fresh smoked meat as we sail towards summer. Not sure what to smoke? Try Down & Dizzy Pork Shoulder or Smoked Spanish Chicken. Now that Spring is in the air, it's time to think about getting out to one of the many #EGGfests around the country - see a list here

Cold smoke vs. hot smoked belly

billyraybillyray Posts: 1,097
edited December 2012 in EggHead Forum
What's the difference in taste and texture of bacon cold smoked @ 65 degrees vs. hot smoked @ 200 degrees?
Felton, Ca. 2-LBGE, 1-Small and waiting on a mini
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Comments

  • nolaeggheadnolaegghead Posts: 9,002
    I'm curious too. 
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    This is my signature line just so you're not confused.
    Large and Medium BGE, two turntables and a microphone
    New Orleans

  • Hot smoked bacon is much more firm. I'm going cold smoked on the batch I have coming out of the cure tomorrow. There is a huge difference.

  • nolaeggheadnolaegghead Posts: 9,002
    That makes sense.  Is there a difference after you, say..., slice it and cook the bejesus out of it in a frying pan or is it mostly in the pre-cooked texture?
    ______________________________________________
    This is my signature line just so you're not confused.
    Large and Medium BGE, two turntables and a microphone
    New Orleans

  • FockerFocker Posts: 1,124
    edited December 2012

    Cannot offer any personal experiences yet.  Two bellies will be cold and hot smoked this weekend for comparison.  Here is what I have learned thus far...

    Cold smoke allows for total smoke penetration.  Hot smoke dries the surface creating a barrier for smoke penetration. 

    If you want thin slices of bacon, cold smoked bacon is easier to slice.

    A longer, lighter cold smoke may be more beneficial at creating depth than a shorter, hot smoke.

    Smoke preference is personal.  I prefer a blue, almost invisible, lighter smoke that doesn't overpower.

    Brandon
    Quad Cities
    "The most important ingredient in cooking is restraint."--Chris Bianco

  • nolaeggheadnolaegghead Posts: 9,002
    As soon as I get a hold of some decent belly, I'm going to throw my hat in the ring and do a cold and hot smoked batch.  Looking forward to it.  Thanks for the info, Focker.
    ______________________________________________
    This is my signature line just so you're not confused.
    Large and Medium BGE, two turntables and a microphone
    New Orleans

  • FockerFocker Posts: 1,124
    edited December 2012
    No prob, it isn't much.  I will be requesting your help soon on proper cajun cracklins. ;)
    Brandon
    Quad Cities
    "The most important ingredient in cooking is restraint."--Chris Bianco

  • billyraybillyray Posts: 1,097
    I'm going to try cold smoking bacon this week. The hot smoke, I did last week was at 200 for 2 to 3 hours to an IT of 150. Since cold smoke is not cooking it, the IT shouldn't be a factor. I'm going for a smoke temp. of 65 degrees, but for how long?
    Felton, Ca. 2-LBGE, 1-Small and waiting on a mini
  • nolaeggheadnolaegghead Posts: 9,002
    You can go by the way it looks.  It's not uncommon for cold smoking to last for days.  In the case of Schwarzwälder Schinken (black forest ham), it can be cold smoked for several weeks.  I'd say at a minimum, go for 4-6 hours.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Black_Forest_ham
    ______________________________________________
    This is my signature line just so you're not confused.
    Large and Medium BGE, two turntables and a microphone
    New Orleans

  • FockerFocker Posts: 1,124
    edited December 2012

    Back in the day with brick smokehouses, a fire would be lit in the corner and burn out.  The next day another fire would be started and burn out.  This on/off smoke was repeated. 

     bigreenmatt cold smoked his bacon for 11hrs with good results.  I plan to smoke mine for about the same.

    Like nola said, you can go by the golden color change for an indicator.  Eggsperiment and adjust if needed.

     http://www.wedlinydomowe.com/meat-smoking/cold-smoking

    Brandon
    Quad Cities
    "The most important ingredient in cooking is restraint."--Chris Bianco

  • billyraybillyray Posts: 1,097

    Thanks guys. I'll be starting some in a few days and will post pics. It looks like cold smoking requires your vents to be open for good air flow, for the drying process. Whereas hot smoking you would shut down your vents to keep moisture in the smoker. Is this correct?

     

    Thanks again, Bill

    Felton, Ca. 2-LBGE, 1-Small and waiting on a mini
  • What kind of cooker are you cold smoking on?  You can't do this on an egg can you?
  • FockerFocker Posts: 1,124
    edited December 2012

    Bill, you are correct.  Backing down the airflow for hot smoke doesn't help with moisture as much as it helps with temperature control.  A 200 degree fire in an egg and the bottom vent is barely cracked.

    For cold smoking, both vent and DFMT are wide open.  Seems to be good smoke circulation without choking out the fire.

    Brandon
    Quad Cities
    "The most important ingredient in cooking is restraint."--Chris Bianco

  • FockerFocker Posts: 1,124
    edited December 2012

    @rustypotts,

    Just about any grill or smoker can be converted to a cold smoker with an accessory like the ProQ or A-Maze-n smoker products.  A cardboard box could even be used in a pinch.

    You can see the spiral shaped ProQ at the bottom of the egg in this pic from earlier this morning.  The sawdust is lit with a tea candle, maximum smoke time per load is around 10 hours.

    002.JPG
    3648 x 2736 - 2M
    Brandon
    Quad Cities
    "The most important ingredient in cooking is restraint."--Chris Bianco

  • billyraybillyray Posts: 1,097
    Did a dry run with the A-Maze-n smoker 12"tube in LBGE. Fill it half full and followed the directions for lighting. Closed the top vent down to 1/4" and bottom to about 1/2" because the temp. was rising. I got a 3 hour burn. Measured the temp. with the thermapen through the temp. gauge hole and it was 130 degrees. I was shooting for 65 but it was 75 outside today. I think the ceramics hold heat so well that I won't be able to keep it under 90. I'm trying it in my Master Built smoker now and will see how that goes.
    Felton, Ca. 2-LBGE, 1-Small and waiting on a mini
  • FockerFocker Posts: 1,124
    The tubes must burn hot?  I've seen a video of the A-Mazen product that is similar to the ProQ, and they produce little heat, if any.  Switching it over to the MB may help.
    Brandon
    Quad Cities
    "The most important ingredient in cooking is restraint."--Chris Bianco

  • nolaeggheadnolaegghead Posts: 9,002
    edited December 2012
    what makes the egg efficient - the ability to hold heat and insulate, is hurting you in this case.   A primitive metal cave-man cooker will actually work better. :D
    ______________________________________________
    This is my signature line just so you're not confused.
    Large and Medium BGE, two turntables and a microphone
    New Orleans

  • what makes the egg efficient - the ability to hold heat and insulate, is hurting you in this case.   A primitive metal cave-man cooker will actually work better. :D
    Yep.....I use my Big Chief smoker for cold smoking this time of year.....no problem keeping the temps low.
  • FockerFocker Posts: 1,124
    edited December 2012

    Here, dude only increased temp 13 degrees in two hours on the Yoder, which is no tin can.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DrsdPz1rEpI

    And with this product lit in three places, he went up 13 on the Traeger

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EWmVcyWYXnI

    And lastly, a video showing how small the fire is on a ProQ

    I did a two hour smoke with this earlier.  Didn't put the therm in the hole, but there was still frost on the egg when I was done.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T7j11-buJ8E

    Would ceramic be that efficient to cause an increase of 55 degrees in 3 hours?

     

    Brandon
    Quad Cities
    "The most important ingredient in cooking is restraint."--Chris Bianco

  • nolaeggheadnolaegghead Posts: 9,002
    I'm not surprised.  Metal is a great conductor of heat.  Finally, something an egg isn't good for.  I think if you added a big metal pan of ice over the smoke it might help, but you'd have to change it out when it melts.  Or wait for the cold weather.  55F rise - subtract that from your maximum allowable temp and wait until ambient is at least that low.
    ______________________________________________
    This is my signature line just so you're not confused.
    Large and Medium BGE, two turntables and a microphone
    New Orleans

  • stike used his small as the wood chamber and ran a flexible aluminum dryer tube to the bottom of his large for the smoking. No noticeable heat in the large but he is from a northern clime.

    Steve 

    Caledon, ON

     

  • nolaeggheadnolaegghead Posts: 9,002
    I've rigged up the redneck dryer hose thang and my problem is I'm losing too much heat - I need a load on my trailer-park window unit.
    ______________________________________________
    This is my signature line just so you're not confused.
    Large and Medium BGE, two turntables and a microphone
    New Orleans

  • billyraybillyray Posts: 1,097
    billyray said:
    Did a dry run with the A-Maze-n smoker 12"tube in LBGE. Fill it half full and followed the directions for lighting. Closed the top vent down to 1/4" and bottom to about 1/2" because the temp. was rising. I got a 3 hour burn. Measured the temp. with the thermapen through the temp. gauge hole and it was 130 degrees. I was shooting for 65 but it was 75 outside today. I think the ceramics hold heat so well that I won't be able to keep it under 90. I'm trying it in my Master Built smoker now and will see how that goes.
    The MB didn't do any better, it was 130 also. I think I got it figured out, I need a separate box for the fire or smoke generator, like others have suggested. So today I got the bright idea of instead of trying to build something, why not buy a small egg for the smoke source and hook it up to my LBGE. Then I'd also have another egg. The logic seemed solid to me, but the wife wasn't buying it. I'll take pics and post in the next couple of days, my wife should be speaking to me by then.
    :))
    Felton, Ca. 2-LBGE, 1-Small and waiting on a mini
  • stike used his small as the wood chamber and ran a flexible aluminum dryer tube to the bottom of his large for the smoking. No noticeable heat in the large but he is from a northern clime.

    Who?

  • nolaeggheadnolaegghead Posts: 9,002

    stike used his small as the wood chamber and ran a flexible aluminum dryer tube to the bottom of his large for the smoking. No noticeable heat in the large but he is from a northern clime.

    Who?
    Remember?  He's that pumpkin carvin' reclusive guy that once pretended he was John Stryker - philanthropist, monkey fanatic, gay rights supporting billionaire, - but that likes to eat rotten meat, make delicious charcuterie and flame-war (suicidally, I might add) with forum trolls sportin' steroid problems.
    ______________________________________________
    This is my signature line just so you're not confused.
    Large and Medium BGE, two turntables and a microphone
    New Orleans

  • Oh yeah. Whatever happened to him? He was kind of funny if I remeber right.

  • billyraybillyray Posts: 1,097

    stike used his small as the wood chamber and ran a flexible aluminum dryer tube to the bottom of his large for the smoking. No noticeable heat in the large but he is from a northern clime.


    I knew I saw that somewhere, short term memory loss. :)) I should have mine up today and will post pics.
    Felton, Ca. 2-LBGE, 1-Small and waiting on a mini
  • FockerFocker Posts: 1,124

    Good try on the small addition.  Nola's suggestion using ice in a drip pan below the bellies would help.  Change as needed. 

    Looking forward to pics.

    Are you using pellets or dust in the tube?  Again that is quite a swing.  There is no way my little whisp of smoke on the ProQ would heat up anything like that. Same goes for the Amazen product that is similar using one fire.  Temps here have been in the 40s.  I've done cheese and its starting to mellow and smell great.  Not much color with these temps, but I really don't care.  Flavor is all that matters. 

    For the bacon, I will just throw it on the egg with the ProQ and wait for the golden color whether it takes 10 hours or 20.  Two separate smokes. 

    After this week when my bacon is done, I could ship the ProQ to you for a trial? 

    Brandon
    Quad Cities
    "The most important ingredient in cooking is restraint."--Chris Bianco

  • billyraybillyray Posts: 1,097
    Here's the set up. Temp. in the LBGE is basically the same as outside today low 40's. Will this temp. be okay to do salmon?image
    smoke.jpg
    640 x 480 - 89K
    Felton, Ca. 2-LBGE, 1-Small and waiting on a mini
  • billyraybillyray Posts: 1,097
    Focker said:

    Good try on the small addition.  Nola's suggestion using ice in a drip pan below the bellies would help.  Change as needed. 

    Looking forward to pics.

    Are you using pellets or dust in the tube?  Again that is quite a swing.  There is no way my little whisp of smoke on the ProQ would heat up anything like that. Same goes for the Amazen product that is similar using one fire.  Temps here have been in the 40s.  I've done cheese and its starting to mellow and smell great.  Not much color with these temps, but I really don't care.  Flavor is all that matters. 

    For the bacon, I will just throw it on the egg with the ProQ and wait for the golden color whether it takes 10 hours or 20.  Two separate smokes. 

    After this week when my bacon is done, I could ship the ProQ to you for a trial? 

    I'm using pellets in the 12" tube. They burn hotter than the little box type container. Thanks for the offer, but I'll try to get this set up working first.

    Thanks again, Bill

    Felton, Ca. 2-LBGE, 1-Small and waiting on a mini
  • nolaeggheadnolaegghead Posts: 9,002
    @billyray  the 40s  - absolutely.

    One thing to know with cold smoking - any meat you smoke for a long period of time needs to be cured.  Anytime you smoke between 40 to 130F you need to be aware these are incubation temps, so the food needs preservation - nitrites, salt, etc.  Cheese is inherently resistant (that's one of the first reasons why we turn milk into cheese).  Nothing to worry about, but be aware.
    ______________________________________________
    This is my signature line just so you're not confused.
    Large and Medium BGE, two turntables and a microphone
    New Orleans

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