New Pizza Stone is sticking

Hoffrock · October 10

I just bought a new pizza stone for my XL BGE - the 21". I've read you don't need to season it but my pizza dough stuck to the stone and turned black. I was cooking at 575 which is what my specific dough recipe is designed for. I've done it on a steel stone in my convection oven inside and it works great. It appears the stone was too hot and scorch the crust. Even pulling it at 5 minutes (typically 6-7) if was completely black on the bottom and I had to chisel the pizza off the stone with the peel. Between cooks I used a spatula to scrape off the charred crust stuck to the stone which was substantial. Any thoughts would be greatly appreciated.

Botch · October 20

zaphod said:

There is a great video from meat-smoke-fire (who used to be on this forum) where he describes using the top and bottom vent in conjunction.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MpOlOMx6weQ

Thanks for posting that, he had a few details that I hadn’t considered.

fishlessman · October 10

Hoffrock said:

I just bought a new pizza stone for my XL BGE - the 21". I've read you don't need to season it but my pizza dough stuck to the stone and turned black. I was cooking at 575 which is what my specific dough recipe is designed for. I've done it on a steel stone in my convection oven inside and it works great. It appears the stone was too hot and scorch the crust. Even pulling it at 5 minutes (typically 6-7) if was completely black on the bottom and I had to chisel the pizza off the stone with the peel. Between cooks I used a spatula to scrape off the charred crust stuck to the stone which was substantial. Any thoughts would be greatly appreciated.

are you putting a gap between the stone and platesetter so the stone doesnt get hotter than the dome temp. i dont have a platesetter nor do i have pizza cooks anymore but someone will chime in on there exact setup

zaphod · October 10

I put my stone on the SS grill which is set on the [legs up] platesetter. So there is a 4 inch gap between the platesetter and the stone.

works great/grate for me.

Canugghead · October 10

575 dome temp or stone temp?

fishlessman · October 10

as cannughead mentioned theres people here measuring stone temps. another trick is wiping the stone with a slightly damp towel before and between pies.

Hoffrock · October 10

I have the stone on top of the stainless grate with the deflector legs up so there is a gap. I used the temp gauge on the egg as I calibrated it with a Thermoworks grill thermometer so that should be roughly the temp at the grill (in this case the stone).

Next time I will measure the stone temp and try the damp towel trick. On my other egg with the same stone I did pizza at 475 and it worked fine (that dough was store bought made for kitchen ovens so a little higher hydration).

Thanks for the feedback.

Haley · October 10

Cornmeal will help from sticking but defiantly too much heat is turning it black.

zaphod · October 10

i did pizzas in the oven for years and always used cornmeal. nothing as fun as pulling out a hot stone from the oven so that you can get flipper under the pie that has locked itself to the stone...

I still use cornmeal on the split, but never on the egg. I also stopped using the split for removal and now just use tongs. it just works.

ColbyLang · October 10

Parchment paper for 2 minutes works wonders. It’s heat safe to 450. Lets the crust set. Open the dome and slip it out, let the pizza finish on the stone.

How much sugar is in your dough @Hoffrock? 575 is relatively low for neopolitan

RRP · October 11

ColbyLang said:

Parchment paper for 2 minutes works wonders. It’s heat safe to 450. Lets the crust set. Open the dome and slip it out, let the pizza finish on the stone.

I'm not ashamed to admit that I'm a parchment paper advocate as well, but I leave my pizzas on it for the full cook! The brown scorching shows on the paper for sure but not my pizzas!

Botch · October 11

Provided your stone was properly preheated, no dough, no matter the hydration, should ever stick; I'm surprised a few above have seen this.

MaskedMarvel · October 11

RRP said:

ColbyLang said:

Parchment paper for 2 minutes works wonders. It’s heat safe to 450. Lets the crust set. Open the dome and slip it out, let the pizza finish on the stone.

I'm not ashamed to admit that I'm a parchment paper advocate as well, but I leave my pizzas on it for the full cook! The brown scorching shows on the paper for sure but not my pizzas!

This is my method as well!

Canugghead · October 14

bump

Mark_B_Good · October 14

It shouldn't take 5 minutes to cook a pizza at 575 either ... try not to load the toppings to thick, and it'll be done in 2 minutes or less at 575F to 600F.

lousubcap · October 14

Way to surface @Mark_B_Good. Presume you are still enjoying that MC-20.

Mark_B_Good · October 16

lousubcap said:

Way to surface @Mark_B_Good. Presume you are still enjoying that MC-20.

Hahaha, yeah, life's been crazy busy. I haven't got the MC20 out enough ... but I've taken it for a few drives. It's almost time to put her away for winter hibernation.

Ozzie_Isaac · October 16

Mark_B_Good said:

lousubcap said:

Way to surface @Mark_B_Good. Presume you are still enjoying that MC-20.

Hahaha, yeah, life's been crazy busy. I haven't got the MC20 out enough ... but I've taken it for a few drives. It's almost time to put her away for winter hibernation.

Arizona is nice in the winter - ship it here and I’ll take good care of it for you. Save you the hardship of winterizing it.

janewhite · October 16

It sounds like your pizza stone on the XL BGE got too hot compared to the dome temperature, causing the crust to burn and stick, try lowering the stone temperature to around 500–525°F and using semolina on the peel to prevent sticking.

Hoffrock · October 18

I tried again and here is the data (I bought a infrared temp gun to measure stone temp). Also preheated the egg to 550 then put the deflector and stone in and let it come back up to temp.

First cook, 525 temp on the gauge, 550 stone temp - crust slightly undercooked. Second cook 5 minutes later, 550 temp, 560 stone temp, pizza came out perfect. Third cook 5 minutes later, 525 temp, 600 stone temp and it started to char and stick to the stone but only on the rear side of the pizza (see stone temp variations below). All stone temps were taken dead center just prior to cooking each pizza.

Couple other things - I use a dough hydration designed for home ovens that can reach a 550-575 temp and it cooks for 6 minutes on a steel stone. Lower hydration doughs cook faster at higher temps. For a 12 inch pizza I use about 2 tbsp of sauce and enough cheese where you can still see the sauce so it's not oveloaded with anything. I use a 50/50 mix of corn meal and flour on the peel and the charred remains are left behind so that's not the issue either. I also noted the rear of the stone was substantially hotter than the front of the stone as it came up to temp, in one case 100 degrees, which may explain the charring on the back portion, but not the front, on that third cook.

I'm going to try again but I suspect it's very hard to control the stone temp so it compliments the dome temp unless I use a very low hydration dough and cook it faster and hotter, use parchment paper as a shield or try that wet rag trick to cool the stone off slightly.

Thanks again for all the comments and I'll keep experimenting. And as I tell my friend who has the same issues with his BGE, I could think of worse things to do with my time.

Hoffrock · October 18

One more thing - bottom vent is wide open and I use the top vent to control the temp.

zaphod · October 18

I would be using the bottom vent for control as well as the top vent. You are likely raging a Hell of a lump burner there.

Hoffrock · October 19

My understanding of the thermo dynamics of the egg is you use the bottom vent wide open and control with the top vent for a higher done temp and the opposite for less dome heat. But I can always try that to see if it moderates the stone temp. But even in the Youtube videos I've watched they suggest opening the bottom vent all the way

Hoffrock · October 19

However, that might make sense since every video I've watched they are only cooking one pizza. But when I do roasted vegies of chickens I typically have the bottom vent wide open and it works very well controlling the temp with the top vent only. However, I will give that a try next time.

zaphod · October 19

There is a great video from meat-smoke-fire (who used to be on this forum) where he describes using the top and bottom vent in conjunction.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MpOlOMx6weQ

There are some people here who keep their daisy wheel or reggulator in a box on the shelf (ie: top wide open) and do everything with the bottom vent.

If you are cooking open dome (ie: for a wok) your bottom vent is fully closed otherwise all that air will create a bonfire in the egg. This is per the mothership's wok instructions for care and use document for their carbon steel wok:

Make sure to close the bottom draft door anytime you are cooking with the EGG dome open for an extended time. This will reduce the possibility of flare-ups and help prevent the charcoal from getting too much oxygen. If the charcoal gets too hot, close the dome and slightly open the bottom draft door and rEGGulator cap to keep some air flowing.so cooking with the top vent closed and the bottom vent open is not a hard and fast rule

In any case, what you are doing is not quite working for you, so trying something different may make the difference you need.

zaphod · October 19

ColbyLang said:

Parchment paper for 2 minutes works wonders. It’s heat safe to 450. Lets the crust set. Open the dome and slip it out, let the pizza finish on the stone.

I recently did a sloppy foccacia bread and used your parchment paper suggestion. really helped. Thank you @ColbyLang

Botch · October 20

I’ve always had the suspicion that, say during a lo-und-slo, if you left the top wide-open that there could be some fresh air flowing into the Egg, from the top (think, you just closed down the lower vent a bit, the coals are too hot, and the air overheats and rushes out the top; the lower vent can’t let in enough air to equalize the air pressure, and so some colder, heavier air makes it’s way into the Egg from above). Always thought that’d be a possibility, and if there’s anyone here with two Eggs the same size, they could test this: load each cleaned-out Egg with a weighed amount of lump, light them similarly, let them reach the same temp, and then shut one down with both the lower and upper vent, and the other just by the lower vent. Track how long it takes each Egg to hit ambient temp; I’d really like to know what happens. This could also probably be tested with an IR video camera setup, but I don’t have anything like that.
Because of my suspicion, I’ve always set my daisy wheel closed with just the eyelets open (or Smokeware cap just with the triangle portion of the vent open) and then controlled the actual temp with the bottom vent; cooking anything at 300º or higher, I just leave the top open.
I’ve also noticed that the lower vent is not a very “constant” regulator. If I just cleaned out the bowl with the ash tool, the bottom groove is full of ash, hard to slide the door, and probably seals a lot better; if I use my vacuum that door is easy to slide and rattles back-n-forth, hard to keep the actual airflow constant just by measuring the door opening.

fishlessman · October 20

ive always spun the pie 180 halfway thru the cook because of the hotspot on the hinge side. i do that on rib low and slows, turkey roasting temps, high heat cooks etc. never found a way to get around the hot spot hinge side. no cornmeal here, i rub the flour into the wooden peel. cornmeal burns but i use to cook pizza at crazy high temps

Begger · October 23

I haven't read entire thread, but my cure was to toss a handful of corn meal on the plate.......
Gives a small air space and 'lubes' the surface.
Get yourself a nice pizza peel and some open-oven gear......

fishlessman · October 24

Botch said:

Provided your stone was properly preheated, no dough, no matter the hydration, should ever stick; I'm surprised a few above have seen this.

ive only seen the dough stick when the sauce was able to leach thru. ive used plain store bought dough in a 1200 f egg and no sticking. burning is different, it will burn if the stone gets hotter than dome temps and thats usually from cooking without a platesetter or other type heat barrier

Hoffrock · October 25

I stumbled across this in "Mastering Pizza by Marc Vetri" - a recipe for Kamado-Grilled Neopolitan Pizza (pg 101). In the pictures he is using the EGGspander with no convEGGtor so the grill base is slightly above the bottom lip of the Egg. The pizza stone is on the top smaller grill and he claims to leave both vents open for 50-60 minutes until the grill's thermometer reaches 650-750 and claims this gives him a 600 degree stone!! I was getting 600 degree stone temps at 525-550 temp gauge readings. He also recommends a 70% hydration Naples dough which is typically for home ovens in that 500-550 range with a metal peel.

I am going down a rat hole on this **** but given all the different techniques, tips and results it's hard not to. Monday is experiment day (again) but not sure which direction to go given all the different options. Stay tuned.

PS Again, appreciate the feedback. While I may appear frusterated, I'm still having a good time.

New Pizza Stone is sticking

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