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Clean Burn - Lid Stuck/w Rutland?

corey24
corey24 Posts: 386
in EggHead Forum
So after about a year of cooking and smoking on the egg I had a lot of buildup and it was time for a clean burn.  After cooking the other night I let it rip....the temp got up to around 1200 degrees which i figured no big deal because I don't have the factory gasket anymore I have the upgraded Rutland. In the cooldown process once it was down to around 400-500 I was going to open the lid to see how clean it was....lid stuck.  I pulled harder....like really stuck....like lifting egg from table stuck.  I went to bed and said I'll try it in the am.....next morning...same thing.  I got a puddy knife wedged in there and worked it around till I was able to pry it open.  Opens and closes good now, gasket seems fine (other than hard and crunchy).....I'm just not sure what made it stick?  Think it was excess Permatex that got hot and bonded to upper lid?  Just thought I would let you know Rutland can stick....

XL Egg Owner Since Dec 2013 - Louisiana

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Comments

  • TEXASBGE2018
    TEXASBGE2018 Posts: 3,831
    I think we may have just found our Friday Night Thread....


    Rockwall, Tx    LBGE, Minimax, 22" Blackstone, Pizza Party Bollore. Cast Iron Hoarder.

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  • milesvdustin
    milesvdustin Posts: 2,882
    edited June 2018
    I was hoping the one about smash burgers would be the friday thread

    i think it got buffaloed

    2 LBGE, Blackstone 36, Jumbo Joe

    Egging in Southern Illinois (Marion)

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  • cookingdude555
    cookingdude555 Posts: 3,196
    Not sure it was the rutland, my vote goes to the permatex.  I dont wrap the therm anymore.  I did a few times because I thought it was pretty awesome, but I believe you can clean all the crud you need from the egg going about 700 dome temp for 2 hours.  I think the lump runs out at that point anyway.
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  • RRP
    RRP Posts: 26,455
    It is probable that some Permatex that oozed out on top of your Rutland during your application became pliable causing the sticking. And when you say the gasket seems hard and crusty then that confirms my suspicion as the Rutland withstands 2,200º so a simple 1,200º at gasket level didn't cause it to be hard and crusty.
    Re-gasketing the USA one yard at a time 
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  • TEXASBGE2018
    TEXASBGE2018 Posts: 3,831
    @RRP, maybe this guy is Wes Johnson.....


    Rockwall, Tx    LBGE, Minimax, 22" Blackstone, Pizza Party Bollore. Cast Iron Hoarder.

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  • Carolina Q
    Carolina Q Posts: 14,831
    UltraCopper max 700°

    https://www.permatex.com/products/gasketing/ultra-series-gasket-makers/permatex-ultra-copper-maximum-temperature-rtv-silicone-gasket-maker/

    I hate it when I go to the kitchen for food and all I find are ingredients!                                                                                                                                                                                                                           

    Michael 
    Central Connecticut 

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  • RRP
    RRP Posts: 26,455
    TEXASBGE2018 said:
    @RRP, maybe this guy is Wes Johnson.....
    :) If it really was that scum ball then I would have told him to take a sledge hammer and whack the dome just as hard as he could swing it! :o
    Re-gasketing the USA one yard at a time 
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  • corey24
    corey24 Posts: 386
    My only guess would be the Permatex....just didn't know if this had ever happened to anyone before.

    XL Egg Owner Since Dec 2013 - Louisiana

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  • corey24
    corey24 Posts: 386
    RRP said:
    It is probable that some Permatex that oozed out on top of your Rutland during your application became pliable causing the sticking. And when you say the gasket seems hard and crusty then that confirms my suspicion as the Rutland withstands 2,200º so a simple 1,200º at gasket level didn't cause it to be hard and crusty.
    What would cause it do by harder than when I first purchased.  Just time....elements....? 

    XL Egg Owner Since Dec 2013 - Louisiana

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  • jtcBoynton
    jtcBoynton Posts: 2,814
    How was the 1200º determined?  Its hard to estimate high temps without a measuring device. Once you take a thermometer out of range its really not very useful.
    Southeast Florida - LBGE
    In cooking, often we implement steps for which we have no explanations other than ‘that’s what everybody else does’ or ‘that’s what I have been told.’  Dare to think for yourself.
     
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  • corey24
    corey24 Posts: 386
    jtcBoynton said:
    How was the 1200º determined?  Its hard to estimate high temps without a measuring device. Once you take a thermometer out of range its really not very useful.

    Agree, it was a rough guess based on dome thermometer.  I got caught up with supper and forgot to take it out for clean burn.  It wrapped around to 300-400 so that was a rough guess.

    XL Egg Owner Since Dec 2013 - Louisiana

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  • RRP
    RRP Posts: 26,455
    corey24 said:
    RRP said:
    It is probable that some Permatex that oozed out on top of your Rutland during your application became pliable causing the sticking. And when you say the gasket seems hard and crusty then that confirms my suspicion as the Rutland withstands 2,200º so a simple 1,200º at gasket level didn't cause it to be hard and crusty.
    What would cause it do by harder than when I first purchased.  Just time....elements....? 
    I just had another thought. Besides the Permatex the culprit may have also been the creosote that was the build up inside your dome. As it got hotter some of it may have melted and leeched on the gasket before the rest of it burnt off. 
    Re-gasketing the USA one yard at a time 
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  • RRP
    RRP Posts: 26,455
    edited June 2018
    jtcBoynton said:
    How was the 1200º determined?  Its hard to estimate high temps without a measuring device. Once you take a thermometer out of range its really not very useful.
    Good point, but I know I've hit 1,200º before using my 200-1,000º  Tel-Trus.

    Re-gasketing the USA one yard at a time 
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  • jtcBoynton
    jtcBoynton Posts: 2,814
     Important to note that the scale on the Tel-Tru high temp is not linear.
    Southeast Florida - LBGE
    In cooking, often we implement steps for which we have no explanations other than ‘that’s what everybody else does’ or ‘that’s what I have been told.’  Dare to think for yourself.
     
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  • Teefus
    Teefus Posts: 1,259
    A clean burn is a waste. Scrub the inside with a ball of foil or a brush. Smelting iron is better accomplished on other apparatus. 
    Michiana, South of the border.
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  • td66snrf
    td66snrf Posts: 1,838
    RRP said:
    TEXASBGE2018 said:
    @RRP, maybe this guy is Wes Johnson.....
    :) If it really was that scum ball then I would have told him to take a sledge hammer and whack the dome just as hard as he could swing it! :o
    @RRP Tell him to hit the base. It cost more. 
    XLBGE, LBGE, MBGE, SMALL, MINI, 2 Kubs, Fire Magic Gasser
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  • Mattman3969
    Mattman3969 Posts: 10,458
    RRP said:
    It is probable that some Permatex that oozed out on top of your Rutland during your application became pliable causing the sticking. And when you say the gasket seems hard and crusty then that confirms my suspicion as the Rutland withstands 2,200º so a simple 1,200º at gasket level didn't cause it to be hard and crusty.
    Can you document the 2200°?   I’ve seen the highest of 1100°. 

    -----------------------------------------

    analyze adapt overcome

    2008 -Large BGE. 2013- Small BGE and 2015 - Mini. Henderson, Ky.
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  • RRP
    RRP Posts: 26,455
    Mattman3969 said:

    Can you document the 2200°?   I’ve seen the highest of 1100°. 
    Can I document the @2200º ?

    Well Rutland corporate technical folks told me that many years ago, but let me find it somewhere and I will post the link.
    Re-gasketing the USA one yard at a time 
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  • Carolina Q
    Carolina Q Posts: 14,831
    What difference does it make? What are you cooking that needs 2200°??!!! My Rutland as been on my egg since 2009. I have baked pizzas at 900°. It's just as good as it was when I installed it. Ron's has been on his egg for several years longer than mine!

    I hate it when I go to the kitchen for food and all I find are ingredients!                                                                                                                                                                                                                           

    Michael 
    Central Connecticut 

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  • kaybee
    kaybee Posts: 120
    RRP said:
    It is probable that some Permatex that oozed out on top of your Rutland during your application became pliable causing the sticking. And when you say the gasket seems hard and crusty then that confirms my suspicion as the Rutland withstands 2,200º so a simple 1,200º at gasket level didn't cause it to be hard and crusty.
    I just checked my tube of PermaTex and it states max continuous temp of 600 degrees and intermittent of 700. There's likely a bit of wiggle room there but likely not more than 100 degrees. This leads me to believe that it was the PermaTex 'melting', then oozing through the gasket and bonding to the top dome when the Egg cooled.

    I will be keeping my clean burns at 600 from now on. It's also easier on the firebox ceramics.
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  • HeavyG
    HeavyG Posts: 10,380
    Just a quick look on the Rutland website says this:


    “Reality is that which, when you stop believing in it, doesn't go away.” ― Philip K. Diçk




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  • RRP
    RRP Posts: 26,455
    Thanks @HeavyG for not calling me liar! But I still contend I was told 2,200 degrees by Rutland years ago. Just the same I plan to call Rutland technical support tomorrow and I will hence forth change my pat answer of 2,200 degrees to whatever they say. I will even try to receive an email.

    Meanwhile I just Googled "melting point of fiberglass" and the answer is 2,075 degrees so I wonder if the Rutland link you posted refers to the heat tolerance of any or all of their adhesives and not the gasket material itself.

    I think it is important to remember that only the tiny amount of the gasket is inside the BGE subject to the direct heat. And besides that I question if a BGE is even capable of reaching 2,075 degrees.
    Re-gasketing the USA one yard at a time 
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  • HeavyG
    HeavyG Posts: 10,380
    This is from a Rutland product catalog and the 1000°F pertains to the gasket material:



    From the same catalog, the info for the gasket cement they recommend which is rated for 2000°F:


    Makes sense that the adhesive would be rated for a higher temp than the gasket.
    “Reality is that which, when you stop believing in it, doesn't go away.” ― Philip K. Diçk




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  • caliking
    caliking Posts: 19,780
    Teefus said:
    A clean burn is a waste. Scrub the inside with a ball of foil or a brush. Smelting iron is better accomplished on other apparatus. 
    +1. What’s the point/need of all these clean burns?? I think I did it once too, but haven’t for years.  Grub still turns out well, despite that. 

    #1 LBGE December 2012 • #2 SBGE February  2013 • #3 Mini May 2013
    A happy BGE family in Houston, TX.
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  • Mattman3969
    Mattman3969 Posts: 10,458
    kaybee said:
    RRP said:
    It is probable that some Permatex that oozed out on top of your Rutland during your application became pliable causing the sticking. And when you say the gasket seems hard and crusty then that confirms my suspicion as the Rutland withstands 2,200º so a simple 1,200º at gasket level didn't cause it to be hard and crusty.
    I just checked my tube of PermaTex and it states max continuous temp of 600 degrees and intermittent of 700. There's likely a bit of wiggle room there but likely not more than 100 degrees. This leads me to believe that it was the PermaTex 'melting', then oozing through the gasket and bonding to the top dome when the Egg cooled.

    I will be keeping my clean burns at 600 from now on. It's also easier on the firebox ceramics.
    People made gaskets out of this permatex material and never had issues.  Don’t think it’s the permatex or the gasket but maybe a sloppy cook who’s gasket might be covered in sauce that caused the dome to adhere to the base.  

    -----------------------------------------

    analyze adapt overcome

    2008 -Large BGE. 2013- Small BGE and 2015 - Mini. Henderson, Ky.
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  • RRP
    RRP Posts: 26,455
    Mattman3969 said:
    kaybee said:
    RRP said:
    It is probable that some Permatex that oozed out on top of your Rutland during your application became pliable causing the sticking. And when you say the gasket seems hard and crusty then that confirms my suspicion as the Rutland withstands 2,200º so a simple 1,200º at gasket level didn't cause it to be hard and crusty.
    I just checked my tube of PermaTex and it states max continuous temp of 600 degrees and intermittent of 700. There's likely a bit of wiggle room there but likely not more than 100 degrees. This leads me to believe that it was the PermaTex 'melting', then oozing through the gasket and bonding to the top dome when the Egg cooled.

    I will be keeping my clean burns at 600 from now on. It's also easier on the firebox ceramics.
    People made gaskets out of this permatex material and never had issues.  Don’t think it’s the permatex or the gasket but maybe a sloppy cook who’s gasket might be covered in sauce that caused the dome to adhere to the base.  
    I believed that from the beginning but was trying to give the guy the benefit of the doubt! It just seems odd that in the 16 years I have been providing this service with at least 10 or 11 of those years suggesting the use of Permatex to adhere the Rutland that I have never heard the problem reported by the OP. 
    Re-gasketing the USA one yard at a time 
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  • Roadpuke0
    Roadpuke0 Posts: 531
    “Never” have had a issue with mine with your suggested install. Thanks RRP!
    Plumbers local 130 chicago.     Why do today what you can do tomorrow

    weapons: XL, Minie, old gasser, weber, v10 Bradley smoker and sometimes talent!

    Bristol, Wisconsin 
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