Smokey taste to my Christmas Beef Tenderloin

run53 · December 2017

OK, I thought it actually came out pretty good, but it did have somewhat smokey flavor to it that I think some of the guests did not care for. Seems like everything I cook on the LBGE has this flavor. I use Royal Oak, mostly because it's all I can get in my area. I have never added wood to anything. I have not done any low and slows yet (only owned the BGE for a month now). Mostly Pizza at 550 and some chicken wings at 425). Really nothing below 350. So, I don't think my BGE needs a burn off.

I dunno...maybe that's just the flavor of the BGE cooks. I have never used a smoker before, so maybe we are just not used to that flavor.

Is is the Royal Oak? How long should I be waiting for the fire to hold until I put meat on it? I can barely ever tell the difference in smoke color when lighting it. Even after waiting an hour when I do Pizza at 550 -600. I must say that I never get a smokey flavor when doing Pizza. Everyone loves it.

I am planning to do a Prime Rib roast for NYE and really want to reduce the smoke flavor if possible but I may need to just use the oven to do that. Unless I can figure out the BGE.

Any things I should try besides changing lump(I don't think I can get new lump before NYE)?

StillH2OEgger · December 2017

I think you can get a clean burn even with Royal Oak, but I would definitely let it go longer than normal before throwing the meat on.

lousubcap · December 2017

Different brands of lump have different flavor profiles. You have options besides RO.
You can visit a local Ace hardware store and order or pick-up Rockwood or get Rockwood shipped direct. Give the search function here a look, many posts about excessive smoke flavor from lump and options to correct.
Edit: Have you ever cooked with charcoal including briquettes before or all gas?? There is a difference in the flavor profile with that change in fuel. Bottom line regarding when to load the protein-trust the nose, if the smoke smells good, it is good.

SmokingPiney · December 2017

The BGE is a lump fired cooker. You are going to pick up some smoke taste, even with very clean burning lump. And before the Rockwood mafia chimes in here, I've tried it - great lump, comes to a clean burn quickly, but not completely neutral tasting as some say it is. I can still taste a hint of smoke, which is why I cook on a grill to start with.

@run53, I use RO more than any other brand now due to availability. Some bags take longer to get the thin blue than others, but it gets there. With all the different lumps I've tried, I still get a hint of the smoke - you are cooking over wood.

Woodchunk · December 2017

If I am cooking for people who don't like smoke flavor, even a mild one, we will cook in the kitchen oven or the gasser

DoubleEgger · December 2017

Yes it’s the lump. Smell your clothes the next day burning Royal Oak vs Rockwood. Royal Oak smells like you’ve been at a cigar bar.

Sherryjames · December 2017

If the above people honestly think that royal oak is the problem.... we’ll then we have bigger problems in this forum.

20stone · December 2017

If you get it up to temp in advance, generally the sooty crud will burn off. I tend to light my fire well in advance (~45 min) before I roast something, and get it to where it is holding stable temp.

The culprit in your case may be (as it was for me previously) that you launch the egg to get to temp, choke it down when you get there, and throw the meat on right away. The "choke it down" step leads to a smokier fire that if you either sneak up to temp (instead of raging fire then choke it down), or just let it stabilize for a bit.

I had good enough luck with RO, and think you should be able to get what you and your family are shooting for with it...with a little more of a head start.

(PS - That being said, I am also a member of the RW mafia)

run53 · December 2017

well....it's certainly not a bad taste, it's just that most of the people I cook for are not used to it. Before I got the Egg, I cooked all my roasts in the oven and all steaks, etc on my Weber gas grills. I've never cooked on anything fired with wood before.

So, other than letting the coals burn longer or maybe trying a different lump.......sounds like there is not much else I can do. Just gonna have to get the folks up here in New England used to that flavor

dmourati · December 2017

Here's one tip I picked up and employed for my Christmas beef tenderloin.

Use exclusively previously burned charcoal. The recommendation had to do more with VOCs than with smoke flavor but I believe it would help. I also did a long 600F burn for the forward sear and used Rockwood lump.

Hope that helps.

run53 · December 2017

20stone said:

The culprit in your case may be (as it was for me previously) that you launch the egg to get to temp, choke it down when you get there, and throw the meat on right away. The "choke it down" step leads to a smokier fire that if you either sneak up to temp (instead of raging fire then choke it down), or just let it stabilize for a bit.

yes...this.....I recall when cooking the tenderloin, I had a pretty good fire going, and had to choke it down and probably didn't wait long enough. Seems like perhaps I need a lesson in "sneaking up on the cook temp"

Do you folks light it then set your vents right away for the desired temps? Seemed like if I did this, it would take foever to get to 300 degrees. So, I was leaving it open till almost there then choking it down. How long do you keep it wide open before setting for desired cook temp?

g37 · December 2017

I totally agree Rockwood and various other brands of charcoal are very neutral in flavor/smoke profile. But the key is to light the charcoal let it hit your desired temperature then let it go for a while then start to smell the smoke coming out the top vent. If that smoke coming out the top vent smells nasty so will your food. Be patient and plan ahead sometimes this process takes a while. Like many others I bought a BGE to get some smoke flavor. I love the idea of cooking over wood or lump charcoal. I also love lighting and watching the egg while I drink few beers and watch my kids play in the yard.

20stone · December 2017

run53 said:

So, other than letting the coals burn longer or maybe trying a different lump.......sounds like there is not much else I can do. Just gonna have to get the folks up here in New England used to that flavor

That is true, but both of those things will make a huge difference.

dmourati said:

...
Use exclusively previously burned charcoal. The recommendation had to do more with VOCs than with smoke flavor ...

This addresses the same issue that letting the fire settle in before cooking does. The VOCs are what give you "bad smoke", and letting the fire settle or using old lump both address that issue. You can also get a crappy flavor from crappy lump, but RO isn't in that category (IMO).

Let us know how it goes, and take some pics

DoubleEgger · December 2017

Sherryjames said:

If the above people honestly think that royal oak is the problem.... we’ll then we have bigger problems in this forum.

Why not use your regular account @Focker?

johnnyp · December 2017

I didn’t read 100% of everything above. So sorry for any repeats.

Use your nose. If the lump is burning clean, it’ll smell deliscious. Otherwise, it’ll smell like a campfire. Wait until it smells good to start cooking. This takes longer at lower temps. Light it early and give it plenty of time to burn off the nastys.

also, look for wood that is only partially carbonized. It’ll still be...well...wood. Normally black-ish, with brown or tan streaks shining through cracks. Pretty visually obvious. Those guys are pretty stinky, just throw them away.

run53 · December 2017

20stone said:

The VOCs are what give you "bad smoke", and letting the fire settle or using old lump both address that issue. You can also get a crappy flavor from crappy lump, but RO isn't in that category (IMO).

Let us know how it goes, and take some pics

I'm not sure I'm getting a "bad smoke" flavor......I would just call it a "smoke flavor". So, I'm starting to think that's to be expected with BGE cooks. Afterall, I am cooking with wood.

I just bought my Boneless Rib Roast from BJs (AAA Canadian) and I will try the cook on the BGE on NYE. I will give the BGE at least an hour to get up to 300 and then put the roast on. I will pull at 128 and let it rest for 20-30 min. I expect a final IT of around 135+ before slicing.

johnnyp · December 2017

run53 said:
I'm not sure I'm getting a "bad smoke" flavor......I would just call it a "smoke flavor". So, I'm starting to think that's to be expected with BGE cooks. Afterall, I am cooking with wood.

What may not be clear in the above comments is that there is a spectrum.

the there’s a “this was grilled” taste and there’s a “geez, how many chucks of hickory do you think you need”.

what folks are trying to say is that grilled food should taste grilled. It shouldn’t taste like smoke. Heck, even smoked food shouldn’t taste like smoke. The smokeyness (if you desire any) should be a complimentary flavor, not the dominant one.

All of the advice above, from brands of charcoal to the waiting period is to get you into the right region of the “smoke sprectrum”

personally, I wouldn’t settle for a flavor profile I wasn’t happy with. What kind of grill did you own before the egg? We’re you happy with the flavor your food had?

20stone · December 2017

run53 said:
I'm not sure I'm getting a "bad smoke" flavor......I would just call it a "smoke flavor". So, I'm starting to think that's to be expected with BGE cooks. Afterall, I am cooking with wood.

My wife has a very sensitive palate and HATED a lot of my early work. Getting the fire going right was the winning plan. With lump, you really shouldn't get punched in the face with the smoke taste on the food unless you add wood chunks, and only then if you plan it that way.

run53 said:
...I will give the BGE at least an hour to get up to 300 and then put the roast on. I will pull at 128 and let it rest for 20-30 min. I expect a final IT of around 135+ before slicing.

That plan will work, but I think you will find the vaunted "Reverse Sear" to be a better plan. Give this a read:
https://amazingribs.com/tested-recipes/beef-and-bison-recipes/science-cooking-prime-rib-tenderloin-and-other-beef-roasts

I have had great results with this approach. Roast low until about 10F below target and then pull it off. Pull your drip pan and crank up the egg to blast furnace levels (or use your broiler) and give it a quick sear all around. That will give you "bumper-to-bumper" mid rare

PS - Make your own horseradish sauce (http://www.seriouseats.com/recipes/2011/04/sauced-horseradish-cream-sauce.html). Easy and better than in a jar.

run53 · December 2017

johnnyp said:

run53 said:
I'm not sure I'm getting a "bad smoke" flavor......I would just call it a "smoke flavor". So, I'm starting to think that's to be expected with BGE cooks. Afterall, I am cooking with wood.

What may not be clear in the above comments is that there is a spectrum.

the there’s a “this was grilled” taste and there’s a “geez, how many chucks of hickory do you think you need”.

what folks are trying to say is that grilled food should taste grilled. It shouldn’t taste like smoke. Heck, even smoked food shouldn’t taste like smoke. The smokeyness (if you desire any) should be a complimentary flavor, not the dominant one.

All of the advice above, from brands of charcoal to the waiting period is to get you into the right region of the “smoke sprectrum”

personally, I wouldn’t settle for a flavor profile I wasn’t happy with. What kind of grill did you own before the egg? We’re you happy with the flavor your food had?

This sounds like pretty good advice. I have exclusively used Weber Gas grills (still have 2 of them) and was very happy with the flavor. Never got a smoked flavor. I just never used them for roasts because it was hard for me to keep a steady lower temp and they seemed uneven in their cooking. Harder to control the temps. Hence the Egg. I certainly prefer a less smokey flavor on the "spectrum".

20stone · December 2017

johnnyp said:
personally, I wouldn’t settle for a flavor profile I wasn’t happy with.

+1

run53 said:
I certainly prefer a less smokey flavor on the "spectrum".

You should certainly be able to achieve exactly what you want on the egg for this.

run53 · December 2017

Seems to me after reading through all this great advice is to "get the fire going properly" (and maybe secondarily, switching from RO).

So. How to get the fire going properly...................

Here is what I do...please comment.

There are (2) ceramic pieces to the firebox.
I fill the lump up to the level of where the platesetter notches are. So, only up to the top of first ceramic piece. Not the piece that holds the platesetter legs. Is that high enough?

Then I light it using an oil soaked paper towel in 3 places. Lid open and Both vents wide open. Let the fire burn for about 15 minutes.

Then I close the lid but keep both vents open until the temps start rising. If the temps gets within 50 degrees of my cook temp I shut down the vents to where I think they need to be and try to stabilize. Usually cooking by 30-40 minutes. But sometimes I am still chasing temps. I think this is where I go wrong. I probably should let it come to temp more slowly with pre-set vent settings that I know will get me to say 300.

Since I think this is where I'm going wrong, I would appreciate any comments about my fire starting process.

run53 · December 2017

20stone said:
You should certainly be able to achieve exactly what you want on the egg for this.

That would be great......however being new, I need to learn how to achieve this. Probably more practice and trials.

20stone · December 2017

run53 said:

...
Then I close the lid but keep both vents open until the temps start rising. If the temps gets within 50 degrees of my cook temp I shut down the vents to where I think they need to be and try to stabilize. .
... But sometimes I am still chasing temps. I think this is where I go wrong. I probably should let it come to temp more slowly with pre-set vent settings that I know will get me to say 300.

The fire building and lighting looks fine (provided you are not using Castrol for your oil).

At the bottom you describe two approaches, both of which work:

Get the fire rocking and then choke it down as it approaches target temp and then wait for it to stabilize, or
Come to temp more slowly

The first option (which is what I do) is faster and give a good result if you let the fire settle in a bit. Not ideal for a 5AM cook, as it is always tempting to rush.

The second options gets you the same result over more time, but makes you wait for it.

In either case, if you light the fire BEFORE you go prep the meat, work on other stuff, you don't need to rush, and will have better results.

Last, if you are grilling and just want you can load the egg with a bit more lump and just let 'er rip.

Markarm4119 · December 2017

Are you sure you are not also getting a little left over chicken grease flavor from your wings, particularly using a plasterer ?

Markarm4119 · December 2017

Platesetter

run53 · December 2017

Markarm4119 said:

Are you sure you are not also getting a little left over chicken grease flavor from your wings, particularly using a plasterer ?

It's possible. But when I made the wings, I wrapped the platesetter with foil and put a drip pan on top of the foil.

run53 · December 2017

Just saw that it will be about 8 degrees F on NYE for my Rib Roast cook. How will the LGBE perform in those temps? Should I just use the oven?

20stone · December 2017

run53 said:

Just saw that it will be about 8 degrees F on NYE for my Rib Roast cook. How will the LGBE perform in those temps? Should I just use the oven?

Just dandy.

I bought mine when we lived in Chicago, and saw those temps often enough. However, be mindful of wind speed/direction. If the wind is blasting right in the bottom vent, it will throw your temps around.

Cmyachtie · December 2017

20stone said:

run53 said:
I'm not sure I'm getting a "bad smoke" flavor......I would just call it a "smoke flavor". So, I'm starting to think that's to be expected with BGE cooks. Afterall, I am cooking with wood.

My wife has a very sensitive palate and HATED a lot of my early work. Getting the fire going right was the winning plan. With lump, you really shouldn't get punched in the face with the smoke taste on the food unless you add wood chunks, and only then if you plan it that way.

run53 said:
...I will give the BGE at least an hour to get up to 300 and then put the roast on. I will pull at 128 and let it rest for 20-30 min. I expect a final IT of around 135+ before slicing.

That plan will work, but I think you will find the vaunted "Reverse Sear" to be a better plan. Give this a read:
https://amazingribs.com/tested-recipes/beef-and-bison-recipes/science-cooking-prime-rib-tenderloin-and-other-beef-roasts

I have had great results with this approach. Roast low until about 10F below target and then pull it off. Pull your drip pan and crank up the egg to blast furnace levels (or use your broiler) and give it a quick sear all around. That will give you "bumper-to-bumper" mid rare

PS - Make your own horseradish sauce (http://www.seriouseats.com/recipes/2011/04/sauced-horseradish-cream-sauce.html). Easy and better than in a jar.

Glad to hear someone else’s wife hates the smokey flavours mine is sorry she bought me this egg for Xmas last year......nevertheless am really enjoying this thread, picking up a few hints to minimize the smoke.
i have also stopped using the BGE starters and just use my little handheld gastorch like I used to make cream brûlée with to lite the lump, those staters snake like crazy and costco’s lump smokes less than the one from the mothership I found. Am gonna be
trying Maple Leaf next.
Am also wondering if the size of the BGE has an influence as my MiniMax has such a small area for the lump, less mass to go nuclear and by the time you’re cooled off to cooking temp am running out of lump and need to replenish during the low and slow.

StillH2OEgger · December 2017

run53 said:

Just saw that it will be about 8 degrees F on NYE for my Rib Roast cook. How will the LGBE perform in those temps? Should I just use the oven?

I've run cooks, including at least one over-nighter, at below zero temps and never had any issues. It was below zero while smoking this year's Christmas ham and actually shot past my target temp a tad because it heated up more quickly than I anticipated. The great thing about grilling in sub-zero temps is the notch on your man card with certain guests who have no idea how easy it is with a BGE.

SmokeyPitt · December 2017

Just my $.02, but if you are shooting for 300 degrees I would light the fire in just one place in the middle. I think you will have a cleaner burning fire this way. With multiple small fires they will be competing for oxygen and cause more smoldering. A single fire will burn cleaner.

Smokey taste to my Christmas Beef Tenderloin

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