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Homemade / Cured Bacon - advice on tweeking, too salty after smoke (pics attached)

nutshellml
nutshellml Posts: 167
in EggHead Forum
 Morning all happy 4th of July weekend.  

So this is my second go around with home cured bacon.  I followed the Ruhlman method the first time and stuck with that.  I had about 20lbs of bacon (planning on giving some to the family).

After the 7 day cure, I soaked the bacon in water bath for 8 HRS.  (Because last time I did about 4-5hrs and still was little salty).  Smoked on BGE at 225* with Sugar Maple & Apple chunks, took about 2hrs.  Took it off cut two slices, the end and one more.  I know the end will always be more "spiced" so the next one was very salty too.

Here are my questions:
1) Since I plan on giving some away, I don't want to say "give it a water bath for a little while before you grill each slice".  Is there anything I can do to desalinate?  I still have it in full 5lb slabs.
2) In the future, can I reduce the kosher salt?  Or is the Kosher Salt portion necessary for part of the curing?
3) Any other thoughts based on the look from my pics and/or general advice?

Thanks All!

Stay safe..
Northern Jersey
XL BGE  |  MiniMax
XL Adjustable Rig Combo  |  CyberQ  |  Thermoworks Singal/Billows |  Maverick 733
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Comments

  • Wolfpack
    Wolfpack Posts: 3,552
    I've had this happen to me before too. Won't help on this run but better to test fry a piece prior to smoking- then if needed you can soak longer. 

    Not sure if it will work after smoking but i would probably soak for several more hours in water (change the water every hour). Then you can resmoke to get texture back. 

    Try with a smaller amount to see if it comes out okay. 
    Greensboro, NC
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  • nutshellml
    nutshellml Posts: 167
    Wolfpack said:
    I've had this happen to me before too. Won't help on this run but better to test fry a piece prior to smoking- then if needed you can soak longer. 

    Not sure if it will work after smoking but i would probably soak for several more hours in water (change the water every hour). Then you can resmoke to get texture back. 

    Try with a smaller amount to see if it comes out okay. 
    Thanks, maybe the initial soak wasn't done "correctly". I should say that I put all 4 slabs into a chaffing dish filled with water, I didn't change it during the 8hr period.  Think that was an issue? A lot of meat in water that while they were submerged wasn't a lot ? 
    Northern Jersey
    XL BGE  |  MiniMax
    XL Adjustable Rig Combo  |  CyberQ  |  Thermoworks Singal/Billows |  Maverick 733
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  • Wolfpack
    Wolfpack Posts: 3,552
    Likely contributed- two full bellies in a chafing dish is a lot of meat in a small amount of water. The salt that was "washed" off never had the chance to go away. They just kept sitting in a brine. 
    Greensboro, NC
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  • nutshellml
    nutshellml Posts: 167
    Wolfpack said:
    Likely contributed- two full bellies in a chafing dish is a lot of meat in a small amount of water. The salt that was "washed" off never had the chance to go away. They just kept sitting in a brine. 
    Makes sense... 

    So generally speaking how do you all do it?  2gallon ziploc per 5lb belly?

    If I were to resoak it, how long of a resmoke?
    Northern Jersey
    XL BGE  |  MiniMax
    XL Adjustable Rig Combo  |  CyberQ  |  Thermoworks Singal/Billows |  Maverick 733
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  • Focker
    Focker Posts: 8,364
    edited July 2017
    I know it's the thang here, but by taste, and math, Ruhlman's recipe is too salty IMO.

    I would change the recipe, or better yet, move on to a different one.

    Salt and sweet are a balancing act.

    Brandon
    Quad Cities
    "If yer gonna denigrate, familiarity with the subject is helpful."

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  • blind99
    blind99 Posts: 4,974
    A pound of meat needs roughly 1/2 tbs of kosher salt. The saltbox method applies a lot more than that. 

    What do you mean by decrease the salt?

    the salt/sugar/nitrite ratios are set by the recipe. You could increase the sugar if you want. But if you decrease salt I would decrease nitrite proportionally. (You're not using the nitrite to preserve the meat. But it is necessary to achieve the flavor, color, and texture.)

    The easier thing would be to stick with your cure recipe and apply less of it next time. 
    Chicago, IL - Large and Small BGE - Weber Gasser and Kettle
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  • Focker
    Focker Posts: 8,364
    blind99 said:
    A pound of meat needs roughly 1/2 tbs of kosher salt. The saltbox method applies a lot more than that. 

    What do you mean by decrease the salt?

    the salt/sugar/nitrite ratios are set by the recipe. You could increase the sugar if you want. But if you decrease salt I would decrease nitrite proportionally. (You're not using the nitrite to preserve the meat. But it is necessary to achieve the flavor, color, and texture.)

    The easier thing would be to stick with your cure recipe and apply less of it next time. 
    Bud, nitrites do preserve.
    Brandon
    Quad Cities
    "If yer gonna denigrate, familiarity with the subject is helpful."

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  • Nsdexter
    Nsdexter Posts: 195
    did you thouroughly rinse it?

    HFX NS
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  • Lit
    Lit Posts: 9,053
    You can rinse it more after you smoke it. I had this happen once and I sliced it then soaked the slices and it helped a lot. 
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  • blind99
    blind99 Posts: 4,974
    Focker said:
    blind99 said:
    A pound of meat needs roughly 1/2 tbs of kosher salt. The saltbox method applies a lot more than that. 

    What do you mean by decrease the salt?

    the salt/sugar/nitrite ratios are set by the recipe. You could increase the sugar if you want. But if you decrease salt I would decrease nitrite proportionally. (You're not using the nitrite to preserve the meat. But it is necessary to achieve the flavor, color, and texture.)

    The easier thing would be to stick with your cure recipe and apply less of it next time. 
    Bud, nitrites do preserve.
    Of course they do. But for the home bacon maker it's all done in the fridge, and hot smoking is recommended. You could leave out the nitrite and there wouldn't be a food safety issue, but it wouldn't taste like bacon. 

    Chicago, IL - Large and Small BGE - Weber Gasser and Kettle
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  • Focker
    Focker Posts: 8,364
    blind99 said:
    Focker said:
    blind99 said:
    A pound of meat needs roughly 1/2 tbs of kosher salt. The saltbox method applies a lot more than that. 

    What do you mean by decrease the salt?

    the salt/sugar/nitrite ratios are set by the recipe. You could increase the sugar if you want. But if you decrease salt I would decrease nitrite proportionally. (You're not using the nitrite to preserve the meat. But it is necessary to achieve the flavor, color, and texture.)

    The easier thing would be to stick with your cure recipe and apply less of it next time. 
    Bud, nitrites do preserve.
    Of course they do. But for the home bacon maker it's all done in the fridge, and hot smoking is recommended. You could leave out the nitrite and there wouldn't be a food safety issue, but it wouldn't taste like bacon. 

    It doesn't matter where it's stored, or whether it's recommended to be hot or cold smoked....without nitrites, it's not bacon.
    Brandon
    Quad Cities
    "If yer gonna denigrate, familiarity with the subject is helpful."

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  • The Cen-Tex Smoker
    The Cen-Tex Smoker Posts: 23,179
    The salt box method is way too salty when using the ruhlman recipe. We weigh the belly and the cure to get the exact ratio. Once we started doing that, we no longer needed to soak at all. He should leave the salt box recommendation out. It sucks. 
    Keepin' It Weird in The ATX FBTX
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  • MattBTI
    MattBTI Posts: 417

    My second go at bacon has been my best. I use Ruhlmans method. typically I cut the belly down into 3lb pieces. measure out the correct amount of cure and put it all in a 2 gallon zip-lock. I have been curing for 6 days, turning the bellies over to redistribute the brine every day. Those are my only tweaks. Turned out perfect.

    Pratt, KS
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  • nutshellml
    nutshellml Posts: 167
    MattBTI said:

    My second go at bacon has been my best. I use Ruhlmans method. typically I cut the belly down into 3lb pieces. measure out the correct amount of cure and put it all in a 2 gallon zip-lock. I have been curing for 6 days, turning the bellies over to redistribute the brine every day. Those are my only tweaks. Turned out perfect.

    Thanks, yea i've found both times with Ruhlmans method it becomes too salty.   The only difference, which I forgot to mention in my original post, is that I get the belly's w/ no skin.  Maybe that is part of issue too, salt penetrates better w/o skin vs. Ruhlmans w/ skin.
    Northern Jersey
    XL BGE  |  MiniMax
    XL Adjustable Rig Combo  |  CyberQ  |  Thermoworks Singal/Billows |  Maverick 733
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  • nutshellml
    nutshellml Posts: 167
    edited July 2017
    The Cen-Tex Smoker said:
    The salt box method is way too salty when using the ruhlman recipe. We weigh the belly and the cure to get the exact ratio. Once we started doing that, we no longer needed to soak at all. He should leave the salt box recommendation out. It sucks. 
    @The Cen-Tex Smoker
    When you say 'salt box method' that refers to Ruhlman's method?
    Also do you do the skin on or off?  I get my belly's at Costco and skin off, which I find easier after everything is said an done.
    Northern Jersey
    XL BGE  |  MiniMax
    XL Adjustable Rig Combo  |  CyberQ  |  Thermoworks Singal/Billows |  Maverick 733
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  • The Cen-Tex Smoker
    The Cen-Tex Smoker Posts: 23,179
    nutshellml said:
    The Cen-Tex Smoker said:
    The salt box method is way too salty when using the ruhlman recipe. We weigh the belly and the cure to get the exact ratio. Once we started doing that, we no longer needed to soak at all. He should leave the salt box recommendation out. It sucks. 
    @The Cen-Tex Smoker
    When you say 'salt box method' that refers to Ruhlman's method?
    Also do you do the skin on or off?  I get my belly's at Costco and skin off, which I find easier after everything is said an done.
    Yes-Ruhlman's recipe is for a 5lb piece if I remember right. he gives the exact weights then says you can just make a large batch of the cure and dredge any size cut of belly a pan of the cure if you prefer. We always found that to be too salty. Now we scale up and down the weights of the cure to the exact amount of belly we have and add that exact weight to it. I think we still actually cut down on the salt front he original Ruhlman recipe but no matter what, having the exact weight of cure for the right weight of belly makes a big difference. 

    I buy whole bellies with the skin on. I trim it off before curing and smoking. 
    Keepin' It Weird in The ATX FBTX
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  • Focker
    Focker Posts: 8,364
    FWIW,
    Ruhlman's recipe using kosher comes out to 3.6%.
    2.5% is where I like to be for bacon.
    Salt taste/preference is all subjective, but 3.6% is again, way too high. 

    Brandon
    Quad Cities
    "If yer gonna denigrate, familiarity with the subject is helpful."

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  • cazzy
    cazzy Posts: 9,136
    Just throw your salty bacon in a taco and you're good to go!   B)



    Just a hack that makes some $hitty BBQ....
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  • Focker
    Focker Posts: 8,364
    Mmmmmmmmmmm, overpowering burnt, salty, bacon.
    Brandon
    Quad Cities
    "If yer gonna denigrate, familiarity with the subject is helpful."

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  • cazzy
    cazzy Posts: 9,136

    :rofl:
    Just a hack that makes some $hitty BBQ....
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  • Focker
    Focker Posts: 8,364
    edited July 2017
    At least the tortillas look real, are round, and aren't glowing. 
    Brandon
    Quad Cities
    "If yer gonna denigrate, familiarity with the subject is helpful."

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  • The Cen-Tex Smoker
    The Cen-Tex Smoker Posts: 23,179
    edited July 2017
    Focker said:
    FWIW,
    Ruhlman's recipe using kosher comes out to 3.6%.
    2.5% is where I like to be for bacon.
    Salt taste/preference is all subjective, but 3.6% is again, way too high. 

    We are closer to 2.5-3% as well. I agree. 

    Ruhlmans recipes are salty. And I love salt. Janell does all the cures and brines at home. She has it dialed in way better than me. 
    Keepin' It Weird in The ATX FBTX
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  • blind99
    blind99 Posts: 4,974
    The Cen-Tex Smoker said:
    Focker said:
    FWIW,
    Ruhlman's recipe using kosher comes out to 3.6%.
    2.5% is where I like to be for bacon.
    Salt taste/preference is all subjective, but 3.6% is again, way too high. 

    We are closer to 2.5-3% as well. I agree. 

    Ruhlmans recipes are salty. And I love salt. Janell does all the cures and brines at home. She has it dialed in way better than me. 

    I do 2% salt, 1% sugar and it's still plenty salty for me.  I need to make some bacon now.
    Chicago, IL - Large and Small BGE - Weber Gasser and Kettle
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  • onedbguru
    onedbguru Posts: 1,648
    After the cure (2-4 wks with kosher salt, br sugar and pepper), I will rinse off a lot of the salt and then add back a reduced salt/br sgr/ppr rub and air dry (in the fridge) for 2 days before smoking.  Not too salt and comes out like candy. Dang good!!!
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  • hondabbq
    hondabbq Posts: 1,986
    Make sure you are using Diamond kosher salt. That is what he uses for his recipes. Not all salts are created equal. 
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  • J-dubya
    J-dubya Posts: 173
           Are most people doing 7 day cures? I typically only do 5.  I use 1/2 cup of kosher per 4lbs (plus pink salt obviously).  I do a couple hour rinse and it's not to salty for me. I believe I use some version of salt box (basicly just use what sticks to the belly after being pressed in the cure mix) 
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