michael jackson hysteria put in perspective

Fidel

There is quite a distance between innocent and not guilty. Juries don't find people 'innocent', they find them 'not guilty'.

stike

the presumption is innocence. the finding is "not guilty".

Fidel

I challenge you to show me where in the U.S. Constitution the presumption of innocence exists.

stike

it's not in the Constitution. but it has been interpreted to derive from it by SCOTUS decisions which address it explicitly.

there's a lot of stuff that isn't "in" the Constitution, but which arose from an interpretation of it. i think we went around on this a while back. some other topic. Constitution sets up some concepts, then folks appeal, and the Scotus lets us know what their (current) interpretation is.

anyway. you could say the Constitution doesn't protect you any more than if you held it in front of you as a shield. it's its the interpretation by the court which either protects you or doesn't.

a person walks into court not necessarily innocent (he may have committed the crime, and a reasonable person might even assume there's a fair chance he did), but he is afforded the presumption of innocence until his guilt is proved beyond a reasonable doubt. whether a juror is capable of suspending judgement and acting with that presumption, is anyone's guess. jurors are human.

Coffin v. U.S (where's our google master when you need him?).

FSUScotsman

No matter what, all I know is what MJ himself admitted to...going to bed with kids. He was an adult, they weren't his kids. I think we can make up our own minds.

FSUScotsman

Probably, but if the feds bail out California a lot of us aren't going to forget that it was OUR tax dollars that paid for MJ's funeral because LA just wouldn't say "no".

ranchonodinero

Didn't realize the users of the big green had so much of a left lean on their views and social mores.

Semolina Pilchard

This story is not going away for a long time. There is so much more to it than just the death of a famous person. At least a few people will end up with a minimum of lost medical licenses, and some will most likely go to prison, who will control untold millions of dollars, who gets custody of the kids (and control of millions of dollars).
Granted, none of this has any real affect on any of us, unlike all the stories being ignored, such as the second round of these bailouts being discussed, cap and trade that will triple your electric bill in about 10 years, and on and on. But the public prefers gossip than substance, so that is what we will be fed.

bitslammer

ranchonodinero wrote:

Didn't realize the users of the big green had so much of a left lean on their views and social mores.

I'd say your making some pretty huge assumptions basing your opinion of people based on a few posts in a single thread, or are you one of those that just like to throw "labels" on anyone who is not 100% in agreement with you on every view.

I'd say the Egg forum members are pretty diverse. I myself am all over the map and don't consider myself "left", "right", or even "in the middle." I don't tend to give much credit to anything I see on TV or read on a website when it comes to issues where people have an agenda because it seems clear these days that our country has become filled with people wanting to bash "the other side" and assign labels to them.

I suppose much of it comes from our screwed up 2 party system. It's like having 2 restaurants that have each gone on serving sh!t sandwiches for decades. One serves them on bread and one serves them on buns. Each has their own rabid group of followers that scream about how bad the other place is. They both spend millions on attack ads stating how bad the other is while doing little to improve their own offering. All this, and still many people continue to go to "their side." Me...I'll happily go eat somewhere else.

stike

don't worry bitslammer. he's not nuts or anything. some folks can't handle nuance. they need to be on one side of a fence or another.

if your mind isn't very complex, you need to reduce the noise and turn up the filter. when you heighten contrast, you lose the shades of grey.

it's all about resolution, and lots of folks would rather think things are all black or all white.

more intelligent folks seem to be able to handle contradiction and conflicting concepts, accepting them and deciding where among them their understanding lies.

simpletons need to be all one way or the other. tht's all. not their fault.

hahahaha

(tongue firmly in cheek. see what it's like to be on the other end of a generalization?)

c'mon, can't take him seriously. the guy is making a sweeping assumption literally across the board. does anyone ever remember this guy actually contributing of being involved on the forum? why get upset if he were to label us (or me) a pinko, commie, lefty or uptight conservative bible banger for that matter. who cares?

i've voted republican, democrat... i vote the man, not the party.

Rascal

Right on! The issues go far beyond what many imagine! Thank you for your post!

Semolina Pilchard

Right on???? I haven't heard that since the mid 70's :woohoo: :woohoo:

Fidel

sexist!

stike

you mean i'm handsome?

thank you.

you can be sexist too, when the light hits you just right

Panhandle Smoker

Your odometer didn't reset. :laugh:

AnnaG

nuff said...

NoVA Bill

FYI: FOXNews had covered this a few days ago and might I say appropriately so.

May God Bless America and our men and women in uniform.

YB

Thanks for sharing Max....This is good.
Larry
What a Great Tribute to one of our fallen soldiers! It makes me proud to live in Georgia. It’s a little long, but certainly worth watching and listening.



Subject: Honoring one of our fallen

AMERICA.....Your Heart and Spirit is Alive and Warm......Nothing in this
world can say "Freedom" any better that this tribute to one of our
fallen heros...America, God Bless You....

This was sent to me from another of America's heros, USN LT CMDR Robert
"Bob" Nash, Thanks Bob for allowing all us of us pay a final tribute to
one of America's finest...Our Finest Salute and best Tip of Our Hats....


The following link hopefully works for you. It follows the vehicle
escort of this SFC home, from town to town, county to county.

Honors rendered by his fellow citizens along the way, will leave you
speechless.

Takes about 15 minutes to get through the songs, like Proud to be an
American, and finishing with the tear jerker...Taps.

A great reminder for the 4th of July.

Bob

**************************************
For your viewing.......

Remember to turn on your speakers and or headphones.

Killed in action the week before, the body of Sergeant First Class
John C Beale was returned to Falcon Field in Peachtree City, Georgia ,
just south of Atlanta, on June 11, 2009. The Henry County Police
Department escorted the procession to the funeral home in McDonough,
Georgia. A simple notice in local papers indicated the road route to
be taken and the approximate time.

Nowadays one can be led to believe that America no longer respects
honor and no longer honors sacrifice outside the military. Be it known
that there are many places in this land where people still recognize
the courage and impact of total self-sacrifice. Georgia remains one of
those graceful, grateful places. The link below is a short travelogue
of that day's remarkable and painful journey.

But only watch this if you wish to have some of your faith in people
restored. Please share widely.
http://e.blip.tv/scripts/flash/showplayer.swf?file=http%3A%2F%2Fblip.tv/
rss/flash/2257594&showplayerpath=http%3A%2F%2Fblip.tv/scripts/flash/show
player.swf&feedurl=http://repdavis.blip.tv/rss/flash&brandname=blip.tv&b
randlink=http://blip.tv/?utm_source=brandlink&enablejs=true

stike

hey weird. i didn't even notice.
hahaha

where's my refrigerator magnet/prize?

rsmdale

Thank you for posting that,I have a 17 year old son that is waying his options on entering the military.O f course Mom is against it,I want him to do what makes him happy.Everyday I sit fishing on the lake I have to remember that their are young men and women fighting aad dying so that I can have my freedom to fish.Thank you to all in our armed services.

GOOD EATS AND GOOD FRIENDS

DALE