More brisket: re: Jim Minion, Stogie, Nature Boy, Spin

DavidR

First of all, a heart-felt thanks to you guys for the great advice and patience during my infatuation with brisket.[p]The one that I took off the egg this morning turned out to be the best yet. Using the fork test, I got the 'tenderness' that you described. Going into the point, the fork slid in and out like butter, and going into the flat, there was only the slightest tug on removal, but since it was a SELECT grade brisket,and the internal was at 190*, I didn't want to dry it out. But when I sliced the flat, the "thumb/forefinger" test was perfect. [p]BTW, Jim, I threw away that brisket that had the tenderizer on it. Since I can get untrimmed packers for 79 cents a pound, it didn't bother me to go spend another 5 bucks. This time I used a rub consisting of Hungarian paprika, garlic powder, and black pepper.[p]But the thing that I did differently this time was that I kept a solid 220* grate temp throughout the cook. Since I was using an inverted plate setter with a water-filled drip pan, that required a dome temp of around 325 degrees!!!!![p]I think the next time I do a brisket, I'm doing without the setter and the pan. I'm going to hang a foiled pizza stone underneath the main grid, and then see what the difference is between grid temp and dome temp. I also want to get a more smokier crust, and I think the water is preventing that.[p]Thoughts?

Painter

DavidR, I've got a 6 lb one on now at 220 to 225° grate temp and dome of 235°. I'm using a 14 inch aluminum pizza pan that has 1/4 in sides setting on the main grate for my indirect barrier. Two firebricks on edge and second grid with brisket on it. I think you need a less aggressive fire to stabilize the temp and keep dome and grid variance closer together without water in pan. More energy to keep the water hot. The drippings aren't burning so I have no off flavor smoke going on. Also cooking on the upper grid your thermometers {dome and grid} are in closer proximity to each other, hence the less variance in the two temps. Now saying this I'm in the plateau stage of 165° and holding. I'm going do the fork test at 175° or so and see where I end up. This is my first brisket, other than a corned beef brisket so I'm eggsperimenting here also. My brisket is from a meat locker I by quarters of beef from. Hoping for the "good one" Wish me luck.
Painter

DavidR

Painter,[p]Good luck on your cook. Let me know how it turns out.

Stogie

DavidR,[p]Great job David![p]The water will in no way affect the smokiness of your meat. I use my WSM and have the water pan filled every cook. It acts as a heat baffle and helps to keep a little moisture in the air. Darn near every cooker on the MIM circuit is a water cooker and they turn out a very smokey product. Perhaps more wood is a better way to go.[p]I continue to be a big advocate of cooking butts and briskets at temps around 225º and I think you have seen the results of keeping those temps. I am quite anal about stabilizing my temps at 225º. Why? The only ribbons I have won have been because of holding 225º for the entire cook.[p]Dome temps, in my mind, are meaningless...especially with your Eggs. There are so many different indirect set-ups that a dome temp can be very misleading. You obviously have the means to be measuring temps at the grate level, so just continue to do that. [p]I see no need to try and decrease the difference between the dome and the grate. What will that accomnplish? You had a very successful cook! Why change to search for something that really doesn't matter? [p]Stogie

Painter

Stogie, What does decreasing the temp difference between the grid and dome do? Nothing I'm sure. The reason I'm doing it the way I'm doing it, is to see how this works out. I'm checking to see if all this moisture retaining capability of the ceramic is really is a proven fact.LOL [p]By the way I want to thank you for the Yum-Yum seasoning recipe you posted back in Feb. Also did your pre-rub fatcap removal thingy you suggested and it looks like a winner. [p]One thing about brisket beingabout the most (beefy) tasting cut there is, so a not so perfect brisket cook won't go to waste with all the alternatives to do with the meat. Chili, enchiladas etc. Thanks for your input and sharing here in the green room.[p]I'll report back to let everyone know how this cook went.[p]Good Q'n to ya
Painter

DavidR

Thank you Stogie,[p]Your right! After eating some this brisket, why should I mess with it. It's so tender, I'm having a tough time believing it, and neither can my wife. I flat out couldn't believe you could get brisket to be pork butt tender.[p]And after all this time, it boiled down to one thing. Temperature at the cooking level.[p]One thing I've discovered with having a grate probe, versus trying to cook using the dome probe, is that over the length of the cook, the grate temp varies if you try to maintain the dome temp.[p]Using an inverted plate setter with a water filled drip pan, a dome temp of 325* is required for a grate temp of 225*. But gradually over the length of the cook, as the ceramics continue to heat up, it takes less of a dome temp to maintain the 225* grate. In the post-plateau region of the cook, only 270* dome was required to keep a 225* grate. A change of over 50 DEGREES over the length of the cook.
So you're right, Stogie, and it took me forever to figure it out.[p]DOME TEMPS ARE FRICKEN MEANINGLESS!

Stogie

I'm with ya Painter! Totally understand about experimenting and finding your own personal "groove".[p]Glad you enjoyed the recipes! All have been pretty well tested and have passed my stringent tests.[p]Stogie

Spin

DavidR,[p]Congratulations on a very rewarding cook.[p]I would suggest that you use the same setup with no water in the drip pan. No sense completely changing the setup as doing so will only complicate the comparison of the two cooks.[p]I agree with Stogie, the water had little to do with limiting the smoke flavor in the meal. You can add a lot of smoke to the cool meat early in the cook and/or disperse more smoking wood throughout the lump to add more flavor as the meal is cooked.[p]Spin