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Why I Voted Yes in the Poll

WooDoggiesWooDoggies Posts: 2,390
edited 3:10AM in EggHead Forum
I understand why forum members have voted no when asked whether or not to allow guests to post. The chaos from the last couple weeks was enough to send anyone over the edge and I think the number of No votes reflects that.

However, for all the years this forum has been running, it has always been open to anyone who wanted to post... which is one of the reasons why I believe the Big Green Egg forum is one of the liveliest, friendliest, open, most active and sometimes most raucous boards on the net.
The history of positive contributions by guests has far outweighed the negative. But as we've seen many times over the years, it only takes 1 negative out of a 100 positive guests or a troll for this board to circle the wagons and bring up the issue of not allowing the unregistered to post.
I believe this forum should remain as accessible as possible.... especially to those folks who just heard about the egg or are thinking about buying an egg or just the plain curious.... I don't think they should have to register to ask a question.

I might be wrong but doesn't the new forum software enable WMK to ban problem posters? If so, when someone obviously trolls or becomes a problem, couldn't they simply be given the boot?


By the way, as one who resisted the switchover more than most, I really like it here.... Just click on classic wideview, make a couple adjustments and it feels just like home...... Thanks for all of WMK's and WPB's hard work!


  • fishlessmanfishlessman Posts: 23,020
    i couldnt agree more. one thing ive seen over the years is conversations get out of control and some guy gets labeled as a troll. it could be that someone just took something wrong that was said, maybe had too much to drink, a bad day. i cant see having them blocked out for just a few off posts, most of us can handle it.
  • I voted yes for the same reason as Woo. I think the forum should be easy for new people to access to just ask questions. I know I resist registering on some sites because I do not trust others to safegard my personal information when they make it mandatory and I don't think they should have it just because I want to see what they are about. By all means weed out the spammers and rowdies and otherwise disruptive posters. Or ban their ISP address for a while before letting them back on probation.
  • AZRPAZRP Posts: 10,116
    I voted yes for the same reasons John stated, after all, that's how I found this forum, as a guest that was treated very well. -RP
  • You two make really good points. I voted "No" primarily because of my concern about guests apparently being able to "Hijack" someone's handle. Like I did on my handle before I recovered my login.

    Also, nearly every time I've looked here over the last few months, it seemed like things were moving towards a "flame fest" board and it looked like "guests" who were doing the instigation. I just stayed away until it seemed to settled down.

    As long as the board survives, I'll be happy with what ever is decided. :)
  • PopsiclePopsicle Posts: 520
    Woodoggies, I couldn’t agree more and thanks for saying it. Lots of great folks out there with a lot to contribute to the forum. Popsicle
    Willis Tx.
  • I agree. How many would be here today if they had to register before saying hello or asking a question (perhaps testing the water, so to speak). I tend to stay away from such places.

  • KeithKeith Posts: 6
    As a new egg owner (got mine for Xmas 2007) and a new forum member (this is my first post) I can't speak to whatever recent chaos happened here; however, I have moderated other forums (e.g. and participated as a member of many others. Wide open guest posting and/or unverified regisistration seldom are able to go on forever. The trolls or the spammers find you as a target and start wreaking havack on the day to day business of the forum, leading the administrators and moderators to seek ways to prevent the evil doers from bringing the forum to its knees. I've seen it over and over again.

    A lot of the forum software available does allow you to do various things such as block a single user's IP address, or block an entire domain. One of the problems is that many of these trolls and spammers use software that spoofs the IP address so the moderator ends up blocking an address that didn't actually make the post. The spammer or troll is right back with an automatically generated spoofed IP to keep on posting. Usually the only way to slow them down is through a mandatory registration with a verified email address.

    I personally didn't find the registration process a deterent to getting to a place where I could post. It took a few seconds to put in my information in, and another minute or so to sign in to my email account and click on the confirmation URL and I was ready to go.

    I tend to think if a question is important enough to ask or a comment important enough to make, folks will take the minute or so it takes to register. Sometime you have to do what you have to do to cut out the noise so a forum can survive.
  • I also voted to keep the forum open to visitors. The forum and its open nature and friendliness were a very large part reason I bought a large at the Eggtoberfest in Atlanta in 2001. I don't post very often, but have been a loyal follower of the forum since about 2000. I have seen some of the more interesting characters from the old days choose not to post here because of the egos and infighting that happens here on occasion, but more often good things happen. I have been a part of thermometer deals that a forum member put together out of the kindness of her heart (Thanks Mollyshark!) and not once have I posted a request for information that has not been anwered. Having to provide all the information required to register is an inconvenience to casual viewers, I for one will not provide that info until I see it's something I am really interested in continuing. We are all adult enough to ignore the ignorant posts meant to cause strife. Before replying such a post consider: By replying, we are validating them and encouraging the sad souls who post them to continue. Also consider when posting: Would I say this if we were in the same room? Is this an opinion that really needs to be on the board or should I keep it to myself? Let's all play nice boys and girls or it's to bed with no supper!
  • FlaPoolmanFlaPoolman Posts: 11,675
    I voted no but you bring up some very good points. Maybe I pulled the trigger a little to quick. As one who lurked without registering or posting for a couple of years I've had most of my questions answered by scrolling the forum. I have gathered alot of good information from those in this forum with much more experience than me. With guests posted in black and the ability to ban problem posters I may have been wrong.

    Pat (Not to proud to admit it) Poolman
  • BigTBigT Posts: 385
    I voted 'No' because of the drama.

    However, if the new software allows moderation of posts / threads, I'm ok with guests posting, for the reasons you stated.

    Big T
  • WooDoggiesWooDoggies Posts: 2,390
    I think it's plain good marketing for BGE to leave this an easy and open place for potential buyers to post. Just look at the Primo forum.... a few weeks ago I went over there to see what was going on and found I had to register just to read! Now, what's the harm in simply reading? Needless to say, I didn't register and probably other people were turned off by it, too..... as well as potential customers.

    I've always liked the free flow of all kinds of info on this site.... I can understand the folks voting no wanting to make this place safer but I also realize we might be giving up a little of this forum's open character in return.

  • I am still overwhelmed when I see how well the people in this forum treat a new egger or a prospective new egg owner! Has anyone noticed all the new green names we now have participating in this forum?

    It seem like it never fails...a guest (first time forum poster) asks a few simple questions (usually the same ones we see over and over again), and before a couple hours has passed, there's a long string of helpful answers, good wishes and "welcome-aboards" following his first post. Then in a couple days, we start seeing that new egg owner more often. Soon he's taking pictures and sharing them with us.

    The trouble that a few trolls have caused lately, is nowhere near negative enough (at least in my mind) to cause me to want to risk making anyone feel unwelcome, or to restrict or discourage them from finding out how much we love to promote our hobby of cooking on the BGE.

    The welcome I received when I was new to this forum is what made me want to be a part of it all.

    I vote we not require anyone to register in order to post...they'll join soon enough, just like most of us did.

    Now, will someone please give me back my Karma!
  • BigTBigT Posts: 385
    Part of my 'no' vote was based on the reasoning that guests were free to read msgs...I myself don't like registering just to read, but understand regging to post.
  • WMKWMK Posts: 1,747

    The forum does indeed permit the banning of *profiles*; however, like the old forum, the only way to ban a guest, if I add such a feature as I did for the old one, would be to ban their ip address. And, just as with the old forum, it is very easy for most people to obtain a new address.

    Of course, obtaining a new profile is also possible, but the requirement of confirmation of a *unique* email address raises the bar slightly higher than merely power cycling your modem or router to get a new ip address.

    I do, however, understand the resistance to requiring registration. Some folks lurk a while, then begin posting, then finally create a profile to become one of the gang. Requiring registration before posting might indeed discourage a few folks from taking that second step and beginning to post.

    Please understand that, as our volume has steadily increased over the years, the effort required to keep our community clean has increased with it. We will be investigating all of the new options available to us once we complete the switch to the new forum (because the old forum severely limits our options).
  • And dont overlook "flat view" when you view a message... it allows you to see all message in the thread at once... very nice.
  • FidelFidel Posts: 10,172
    I have managed boards in the past and it was possible to allow guest users to post in some areas, and members only in other areas. That would effectively be the best of both worlds. We could have guests able to post their questions, but only in limited areas. Once they have become a full and verified member they would have access to all the areas.

    I don't know if that is possible with this software, but should be an option if it is possible.
  • WooDoggiesWooDoggies Posts: 2,390
    I know you, WPB and Brenda will figure out the best course for this forum.... you always have.
    I don't envy all the work you've put in every day on our behalf.... it's, well, kinda humbling.

    To quote Heinlein, "I am only an egg."

  • There you go "thinking" again. But you make good points in your thinking process.

    My first post many years ago did not require my being registered but I don't think having to register would have stopped me. I had already read enough posts that I really wanted to be part of this group. I also wanted this group to know who I was and where I was coming from.

    I've always thought it was great when Newbies would be asking questions one day and a few days later be answering questions. But I found it odd that while they were willing to share their cooking experiences they were not willing to share a single bit of registration information about themselves, even the state in which they live.

    Yet, as they gained a foothold as a regular poster on the Forum, they frequently posted more and more personal information and photos that was far more revealing than what is asked in the registration.

    I also agree that "policing" the Forum is not the issue. An open Forum, even with its flaws, makes it convenient and appealing to anyone who may simply be "curious" and prefer not to be "involved." However, as they lurk from the shadows most will eventually feel comfortable enough to come into the light and post some comment or question. That may be what encourages them to take that next step by saying they really want to be a part of this group.

    We all have it in ourselves to be nice, and most of the time we are, even to those who wish to exploit and tease us with their antics. They must be very lonely people if their only recourse to happiness is to seek out forums who will interact with them, no matter that such interaction is in the negative. Personally, I would not trade any part of my life for theirs, even if they be rich or famous or healthy or any of the things I am not. And it goes without saying that I should not encourage their warped life by doing exactly what they want me to do: lose my cool. Then they are controlling me and I haven't a clue as to who they are.

    With all this, I still voted FOR registration in order to post.

    Spring "Bird Brains Have Opinions Too" Chicken
    Spring Texas USA
  • FidelFidel Posts: 10,172
    Another thought I had (too quick on the submit trigger today) is that once the dust has settled there should be a few select individuals, or maybe even a rotating group, with moderator rights on this board. They would have the ability to move or delete posts and would be a little more omni-present than WMK and WPB have the ability to be. You guys do a terrific job, but you have other things in life and can't possibly have the ability or desire to monitor this board 24/7. A small group of moderators could quickly douse any fire that would ignite in a matter of moments.

    Just a thought. Obviously the potential for abuse, misuse, and power struggles is born from such a suggestions, so careful consideration needs to be given when selecting the moderators.
  • I think that most newbies lurk before posting, so the forum will still be plenty open to newbies. I think if newbies see less stuff like what just went on, they will be more likely to want to register and participate.

    Maybe posting by unregistered guests should be moderated. Of course, that is a pain in the patoot for the webmasters.
    The Naked Whiz
  • Car Wash MikeCar Wash Mike Posts: 11,244
    It shuts my puter down. :angry: Now, I'm going to go cry with Stevie. :laugh:
    I really don't care either way, as long as the 1 bad seed is disabled from posting.

  • I don't really like the idea of multiple areas, though. That's why I hate phpBB. It's so much work to go view all the posts. Here, we just pop up the wide view and we see everything. If we want to see what's new, we pop up the Last 25 screen.
    The Naked Whiz
  • Unfortunately, as the most recent episode demonstrated so well, we are all NOT grownup enough to ignore problems posters. And in this case, the problem poster was going to keep at it until he provoked people into posting. "Don't feed the trolls" just simply doesn't work in a large population of posters, many of whom are not terribly internet-savvy.
    The Naked Whiz
  • I only belong to a few forums, all of which allowed me to read and post without regestering first before I registered. This is the only BBQ one I subscribe to. 3 years ago I felt welcome here as I lurked before I purchased mine. I realize thare are some real flammers out there, but I don't have to read their posts or participate in their flame wars. The great majority of contributers to this forum treat newcomers withh respect and curtiously answer their questions. I reiterate, I would like others to feel as welcome as I feel and to contribute as they are able. On the other hand, some of the features could be disabled for nonmembers, such as the ability to search receipes, etc.
  • I think searching recipes and reading forums should be open to all since that is precisely what would make someone feel welcome initially. I think the only thing that should be restricted, if it is decided to have registration, would be posting.
    The Naked Whiz
  • FidelFidel Posts: 10,172
    I agree, but the Last25 shows the last 25 from ALL areas, not just the Egghead Forum.

    I just think a middle ground makes sense. I would hate to alienate any new visitors, but even more I hate to see what the typical trolls can do to disrupt the group.
  • HammerHammer Posts: 1,001
    That's exactly the reason I voted NO. A guest/lurker has access to the forum without registering. They can find any information in the various egg forums; can click on to the various links for additional information; so if it's information they seek; they can find it.
    If they want to be part of the forum and have the ability to post; then register. I don't know of many clubs/forums/businesses/drivers license/bank accounts/etc; that don't require registering.

    There is a case before the US Supreme Court as we speak, that will require showing proof of idenity before being able to vote. Most states require some proof; some do not; and in those states that do not; there is a large percentage of voter fraud.

    So, I differ with my friend Woo; but I respect his opinions.
  • I think a visitor should be able to post. All I wanted to do was cook some food on a grill that was edible, and during a search found this site. After reading the forum for a few days I was convinced the BGE was the way to go: this after the way I was treated online by complete strangers, who even offered to get together and show me how to cook on the egg. I reasoned that any such diverse group of people so eager to help others to cook, and to share tips, had to be on to to something.I'm sure many egg owners start out the same a little...then post a question(s) that would never be asked if one were required to register first. Just my $1.47
  • YYZashYYZash Posts: 44
    I put in some thought before voting "no". I am not a long time member and tend to be more lurker than contributor but, my interest in this forum has been dulled by the conflicts of late. It is just recently I logged back on to see what was going on to find the move to the new forum.

    I belong to several forums and registration requirements for posting are pretty standard. I guess it is to prevent the problems that have been seen here. I don’t believe it is much to ask of new members to provide some accountability of who they are before being allowed to post. Once trolls find a board they will keep at it for they really do have to much time on their hands.
  • WessBWessB Posts: 6,937
    The registration does not require anyone to divulge any personal information about themselves, and merely confirms an e mail address to a username...therefore insuring some accountability for those who just care to spam or start wars...we can longer see IP's to know if a "guest" is or is not who they are claiming to be, which happens quite often...I really don't see where the registration will sway anyone, who wants to post, into not posting....
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