Brisket Woes

JM

I have read that brisket is a difficult meat to master. I have also read many on this forum have excellent results cooking this meat. The egg is very forgiving and most of the time things come out pretty darn good even if you,ve messed up.[p]I must admit that this has not been the case for me with brisket. I have tried 3 different cooks and 3 types of brisket with good fat caps(full, flat cut, point cut - choice and angus grades) all with the same result - TOUGH & DRY. I have also done a overnight marinate (hoping this would help tenderize) and dry rub only. Out of the 3 types of brisket, the full brisket was the best but the flat part was tough and dry. I have had success on other long slow and low cooks (i.e. Pork Butt) but I have reached the point of giving up on this cook. [p]My general setup is indirect with temp as low as I can (usually 225*) until the last hour or so (usually when the temp hits 175-180*) and I kick it up to 275 - 300* until reaching internal temp anywhere from 185 - 205* (I have tried taking off at 3 different temperatures within this range to test). The only recommendations that I have NOT tried is to wrap in foil during a portion of the cook and I have also read that some will cook only to internal temps of 165*-170*.[p]I am willing to give this one more try this weekend - but I need some help (coaching). [p]JM

RhumAndJerk

JM,
Check your Email.
RhumAndJerk

DavidR

JM,[p]Don't feel like the Lone Ranger. Although my briskets are turning out edible, I have found them to be a little tough in the flat. Si I will be following this thread closely. Thanks for bringing it up.

RhumAndJerk

JM,
Here are excerpts of an old post that I have saved. NatureBoy is an expert on Brisket as I am not. It is not a post that I made, just one that I have kept

This recipe is for a choice cut or better flat cut brisket of about 11 pounds.
…
Put a fist sized chunk of Red Oak bark side down on the center fire and lay an equal size piece of hickory next to it. Place your grill on. Close the lid and let the dome get to 275. Get an adjustable v-rack and lay it flat. ...
Insert a polder in the largest part of the meat half way in and place on the grill close the lid and stabilize the heat at 275 +/- 10. [p]Set the Polder for 202. It should take about 6-7 hours. [p]Let the brisket rest under foil for about 15 minutes. Slice at a 30-degree angle across the grain.[p]Hope this helps,
RhumAndJerk

Nature Boy

JM,
Why not an expert as my friend RhumAndJerk claims (thanks R&J) I have done quite a few. Your method sounds solid. Only a few things to consider....you probably already have, but I will throw them out.[p]Measure the internal temp in the flat. If not, you could be overcooking the flat. Cat recommended this to me, and I have been doing it since. The point, for me, has always been done perfectly if I judge the cook by the flat.[p]Make sure your polder AND dome thermometer are accurate (you have probaly done this).[p]Try doing your entire cook at 250 and see how you like the results. This is my favorite temp range for briskets.[p]Try resting the brisket on foil for an hour after removing from the cooker. This seems to make a huge difference.[p]Only other thing I can figure is the meat you are getting. Sounds like it should be good from what you describe. Choose the most flexible brisket with the most marbling. Ask to see a selection.[p]That is all I can figure. Like I said, your technique sounds right on. You will be able to obtain killer results without using foil during the cook. Keep at it!![p]beers
NB

DavidR

Nature Boy,[p]How long does it generally take at 250*? Do you go for a Polder temp in the flat, or do just go by the fork test?
The reason why I'm asking is because I've been doing my briskets at 250*, and the the flat is turning out tough.[p]Or, is it that I'm just misunderstanding what the definition is of "tough" or "tender". When I say "tender", I'm talking pulled pork "tender".[p]I'm doing something wrong here, and I'll be damned if I can figure out what it is.

Nature Boy

JM,
Why not an expert as my friend RhumAndJerk claims (thanks R&J) I have done quite a few. Your method sounds solid. Only a few things to consider....you probably already have, but I will throw them out.[p]Measure the internal temp in the flat. If not, you could be overcooking the flat. Cat recommended this to me, and

Nature Boy

DavidR,
Beef brisket is not, and should not be tender like pulled pork. It has much less fat, and will be more firm. If you want pulled beef, then foil or steaming or liquid will get you there. I guess a lot of it does depend on what folks expect from good brisket. I like a firm, but tender and moist meat that is slicable without falling apart. Loaded...just LOADED with beef flavor, and a magic crust.[p]Cheers!
NB

JM

Nature Boy,
Sounds like DavidR and I are having the same problem with the flat portion. I guess I never considered asking the question what is tender and not tough. I know that it is not going to fall apart like pork butt but its got to be better than using as shoe leather.[p]I appreciate your suggestions and I have everything you have suggested except for trying the whole cook at 250*. I buy my meat from a great butcher whom I've gotten to know pretty well. When I come in - he knows that I am very picky on the type of meat I want and always has lots to show me. [p]The only thing I did not understand from your suggestion is to choose the most "flexible" brisket. I guess I've never heard that before. What does this mean?[p]What temp in the flat do you shoot for?

Nature Boy

jm,
The one that is easiest to bend or drape over your arm is gonna be the most tender. [p]When you get it right, tough will not be a word that comes to mind. Even when it comes out moist, it will definitely seem drier than pulled pork. It should still be tender, and not overly dry. You will not get that same warm mouth coating feeling as you get from pork fat![p]I usually don't go over 190 in the flat. It has always been fork tender for me between 185 and 190. Hope that helps a tad. You'll know when you get there! [p]Cheeers, and a great weekend atcha!
NB

JM

Nature Boy,
Thanks for that tip on choosing a flexible brisket.[p]I think I might be overcooking this meat.[p]Thanks.[p]JM

DavidR

Nature Boy,[p]I hope that you will forgive me for being such a pain in the butt. But I've got to ask you one more question. From reading this forum, it seems that you have cooked more briskets than anyone else. So I imagine that there has been a time or two, early on, that you've "overcooked" it.[p]So tell me. Explain exactly what the meat was like when you overcooked it. I'd like to see if it matches what mine is turning out like. Then I'll know for sure.

Nature Boy

DavidR,
First, I will say that many others have cooked more briskets than I. This Qing stuff is only about 3 years old for me, and I have probably logged 30-40 brisket cooks (childs play for many Qers). It is my favorite cook though, so I have a load of enthusiasm about the subject![p]The failures have definitely been on the tough side to the point that you thought "jee. This is a bit chewy and dry." Though flavorful, it just doesn't seem like something you wanna mess with. Fortunately, this has only been for about 4 or 5 of them, and usually was confined to the flat. 3 of those times, temps got away from me into the 300s, and the chunk-o-chest blasted right through the plaetau. The other couple times I am not sure what happened.[p]Like I said, you should know when you get it right! [p]Hope that helps. We will be awaiting news from you on your future successes![p]NB

mike

JM,[p] I am sorry to hear you are having problems with brisket. They can be difficult to prepare but once you figure it out they are wonderful. If you go to www.outdoorhome.com and click on the recipe/tip of the month and then view past articles you will find a brisket recipe. You will most likely think it sounds awful, but try it. Best of luck with future cooking.