Fires and the BGE Table

Sonny3

I have been posting the past week or so about my table build to prepare for the delivery of an XL and Med BGE.  I had researched tables plans and pics for the last month and found most to be very similar in concept.  They were built from wood with a top and a shelf for the egg to rest on.  I quickly learned that you do not set the egg on the wood shelf, that much is a given.  So I purchased table rests for both eggs and a 24" x 24" granite tile to lay under each table rest.

Now I have seen a couple of conversations in the last couple of days saying that this setup may not be good enough.  Other than completely starting over on the tables, what else can I do.

My table is planned as part of an outdoor kitchen that is under roof (11 feet) and is part of my open yet screened lanai and pool deck area.  I figure that there is plenty of height from the egg top to the aluminum roof and the egg table will be located at the very edge of the lanai deck so the smoke will flow out.  I plan to use a fan to assist in having the smoke flow in the right direction away from covered area.

The only other thing I can see to do is sandwich a heat insulating material ( hi temp like used in race cars) between two tiles below my table rest.

I am open to any suggestions.  Am I overthinking this?  Are table fires that common? I plan to do a lot of egg cooking, but I don't want to burn the house down. 

Little Steven

What do you mean by table rests? What you need is something to interrupt the thermal conductivity from the egg to the wood. Air is best.

Sonny3

I am referring to the table nest/rest that are sold by BGE.  I may have used the wrong word in "rests" I think they are called "nests".

HoustonEgger

@Sonny3 I have that same setup - granite tile with a table nest. Never had any fires and never even had the tile get remotely warm - and that's with 16+ hour cooks.

Chubby

Maybe take a three-quarter inch piece of concrete backer board and put it underneath your piece of tile,  that would give you some added strength and fire retardant also.
Just another thought would be to go to a stone yard or counter top fabricator and find some granite remnants and have a 24 by 24 inch piece of granite cut. I would much rather have it on something much thicker than on a thin piece of title no matter what's underneath it.

While I am NOT using a table , the above is exactly what I did in my recent outdoor kitchen build. There are 2 three-quarter inch pieces of concrete backer board underneath an inch and a quarter inch piece of granite.

I made my own table nests by cutting the legs off of what were my original nests!
You won't go wrong "overbuilding" it and you'll have more safety and its not a big expense!

Good luck!!

Sonny3

HoustonEgger said:

@Sonny3 I have that same setup - granite tile with a table nest. Never had any fires and never even had the tile get remotely warm - and that's with 16+ hour cooks.

Thank you for responding.  I saw a conversation about this today and they had suggested searching BGE table fires.  I guess I just saw too much with pics of cracked granite/tile, scorched wood and so on.  I am really looking forward to a new beginning in cooking and want to do it right to begin with.  At 67 years old, it feels good to find something new to be excited about again.

Sonny3

Chubby, thanks for the suggestion.  I think that the tile was in consideration of weight. I had a 24" x 24" piece of 1.25" granite cut for the top as a hot spot catcher and the dang thing weighs 74 pounds.  I will check into the backer board though.

BigWader

don't mean to derail this question - although I think concrete backer board might be the best thing I've heard for under the table nest/tile combo - but @chubby did you make your outdoor kitchen with steel studs and backer board?  Are those cabinets black (more affordable than stainless) and where did you get them?  Very nice!!!

Chubby

Sonny3 said:

Chubby, thanks for the suggestion.  I think that the tile was in consideration of weight. I had a 24" x 24" piece of 1.25" granite cut for the top as a hot spot catcher and the dang thing weighs 74 pounds.  I will check into the backer board though.

If you're concerned about the weight then backer board would certainly be a lighter option and then you could go with a three-quarter inch piece of granite and have it bullnosed on the edges to cover the backer board it was sitting on.  this would give you the appearance of a much bigger piece of granite...at a reduced weight.

Tim (Watkinsville)

I have my XL and Medium in wood cabinets. They sit in table nests and I have firebricks under the nests. For low and slows, I also have a small fan. Once the cook is over, I close the vents and turn on the fan for several hours. Its probably overkill but I feel better about things with the fan. From what I understand, the mothership says the table nests alone are sufficient to prevent fires. 
My cabinets are all wood with granite tops FWIW. 
The one thing I have not done yet, but will, is to buy a good fire extinguisher for out there. The entire cabinet system sits under a pergola that has lexan sheeting. The project has really changed (for the better) how I egg in the heat and rain. I'll post some pictures one of these days..

Chubby

BigWader said:

don't mean to derail this question - although I think concrete backer board might be the best thing I've heard for under the table nest/tile combo - but @chubby did you make your outdoor kitchen with steel studs and backer board?  Are those cabinets black (more affordable than stainless) and where did you get them?  Very nice!!!

Yes ...do to the climate I live in where moisture is a concern I built them from metal studs, concrete backer board and brick surround. Not having something around my Eggs  that is flammable ...was also another major consideration.

The black drawers are kind of a long story... but the gist of it is when Barbeques Galore went out of business here in Houston a few years ago I bought them for pennies on the dollar. I had been looking at them anyway (because they were very wide and very deep and  heavy duty full extension drawers). So the idea was was to buy them cheap... when I could, and store them till l could get the kitchen built.

So... flash ahead 5 years or so and when I went to find drawers and cabinets openings to match them... they are no longer available in powder coated steel... go figure lol!!

Grrrrrr!!

Little Steven

Sonny3 said:

I am referring to the table nest/rest that are sold by BGE.  I may have used the wrong word in "rests" I think they are called "nests".

You should be fine then. The most important part is not having the egg solidly up against anything so the heat doesn't transfer..

jtcBoynton

You may want to consider using fire brick instead of the granite. Greater thermal resistance and lighter weight.

The most important thing is to get that air gap with the table nest. Anything after that is added insurance. There are no formal standards so we all need to make our own decisions on how much risk to take and how to lessen that risk. I have not seen anything that actually provides a good assessment of how common table fires actually are.  We do know they happen and can be destructive. If I had my egg on a wooden deck next to a wood sided home under a wooden structure, I would spend the money to get a metal table. On the other hand, an egg on a cement pad 50 feet from anything flammable doesn't pose quite the same risk.

Carolina Q

Little Steven said:

Sonny3 said:

I am referring to the table nest/rest that are sold by BGE.  I may have used the wrong word in "rests" I think they are called "nests".

You should be fine then. The most important part is not having the egg solidly up against anything so the heat doesn't transfer..

Is that why you put that 12' stainless table on a concrete slab with no roof out in your back yard?  

Lit

My fire did not start from the bottom the heat from the side of the egg caught my table on fire. Make sure you have at a minumum a half inch plus space between the table and the egg. I would go mor elike 3/4" plus.

Spaightlabs

I had a table fire last year.  That quickly turned into a house fire, and home and contents were a total loss except for what was in the gun safe.  Only about 20% of the structure burned, but between smoke and asbestos, it was pretty much all shot.  People and animals all got out safely, so all is well.

I had a one inch air gap over a thick garden paver stone, over wood framing. At some point the paver stone cracked and even with the air gap allowed enough heat to transfer to the framing that it caught fire and roughly 13 hours after I was done with a cook, my house was in trouble.

Still having a little PTSD about getting another egg, but imagine I will in the future.  Next go around I will have a metal table, no ifs, ands or buts about it.

milesvdustin

Im thinking of a concrere table

Carolina Q

I really don't understand why people continue to put eggs in wooden tables, then set them on wooden decks attached to wooden houses. And then there are the ones under a roof...


Pic from Hotrodden

I know tables look nice and decks are convenient, but burned-to-the-ground houses do not look nice and they are most definitely not convenient. Not to mention the possibility of injury (or worse) to loved ones. 

Sweet100s

Spaightlabs said:

 At some point the paver stone cracked and even with the air gap allowed enough heat to transfer to the framing that it caught fire and roughly 13 hours after I was done with a cook, my house was in trouble.

I am so sorry this happened to you and family.
The amazing (to me) thing about that is the ~ 13 hours.

My Large egg is in a factory nest.  
The nest wheels are on a square fire resistant mat.
The mat is on a Trex (composite) deck.

I worry about a single spark flying where I can't see it under the deck.
My favorite time to BBQ is right after a big rain.  Then I don't worry about that as much.

SwineBelly

Has anyone seen these tables/nest before? These were at a hardware store in Alexandria LA. The price in the second picture ($2045) is wrong according to the dude there. That price belongs on the table plus egg in the last picture.

HoustonEgger

SwineBelly said:

Has anyone seen these tables/nest before? These were at a hardware store in Alexandria LA. The price in the second picture ($2045) is wrong according to the dude there. That price belongs on the table plus egg in the last picture.

I actually just found this table on Craiglist in Dallas for $100 if anyone is looking for one - looks like you could easily replace the wood with the grated metal. Looks like the exact same style to me

Little Steven

Carolina Q said:

Little Steven said:

Sonny3 said:

I am referring to the table nest/rest that are sold by BGE.  I may have used the wrong word in "rests" I think they are called "nests".

You should be fine then. The most important part is not having the egg solidly up against anything so the heat doesn't transfer..

Is that why you put that 12' stainless table on a concrete slab with no roof out in your back yard?  

I still have the little green feet in there.

Sonny3

I really like the idea of my wood table and I want to keep it nice.  Spent way to much time darn varnishing to throw it out.  So I have been on a mission to see how I can protect it from fire.  Or at least more than the way it sets now.

Since the table is already built for the height of using the table nest, I am trying to not add to much else underneath it.  As a novice to the Egg world, I thought the table nest would be enough.  WRONG!!

I have found a radiant heat barrier that is rated for 400 degrees direct contact and 2000 degrees radiant heat.  It is only mils thick.

My thought is to put it between a concrete backer board and a ceramic tile underneath my egg.  The barrier is adhesive on one side and can be easily cut, so I am also thinking of putting a nice silver trim on the edge of the wood around the hole in the top.

I am waiting on a call now from the manufacturer to discuss this application with them.  I will let you know what they have to say.

If I purchase it (4ft x 6ft roll) about $60, the first thing I will do is a test.  I plan to put it between the two pieces, lay it on a piece of wood and test it with a Mapp Gas torch and a high output weed burner.  Either of these should be hotter than the radiant heat  projected by the sides or bottom of the egg.

With the conversation we have had about fire potential, it sure seems like there should be a product in development somewhere to address this.

Anybody have any thoughts on this?

Toxarch

The more solid stuff you have in there, the easier it is for heat to transfer. Just use tiny spacers under the tile and any heat should radiate out into the air. That's just my opinion.

luckyboy

What ever your decision maybe, just think safety first and enjoy yourself.

Sonny3

Just got off the phone with the manufacturer of the product.  There are mailing me a sample in the morning to conduct a field test.  I will try to film it and provide details.  They did suggest a different product for the application. This one takes direct heat up to 750 and indirect in excess of 2000.

We also talked about air space versus sandwiching the material.  This is what led him to suggest the other product.

We will give it a go and see what happens.

Chubby

Toxarch said:

The more solid stuff you have in there, the easier it is for heat to transfer. Just use tiny spacers under the tile and any heat should radiate out into the air. That's just my opinion.

You are correct!! Creating an additional airspace and thermal break between the backer board and ceramic tile or stone is simple and easy!

Little Steven

Sonny3 said:

I really like the idea of my wood table and I want to keep it nice.  Spent way to much time darn varnishing to throw it out.  So I have been on a mission to see how I can protect it from fire.  Or at least more than the way it sets now.

Since the table is already built for the height of using the table nest, I am trying to not add to much else underneath it.  As a novice to the Egg world, I thought the table nest would be enough.  WRONG!!

I have found a radiant heat barrier that is rated for 400 degrees direct contact and 2000 degrees radiant heat.  It is only mils thick.

My thought is to put it between a concrete backer board and a ceramic tile underneath my egg.  The barrier is adhesive on one side and can be easily cut, so I am also thinking of putting a nice silver trim on the edge of the wood around the hole in the top.

I am waiting on a call now from the manufacturer to discuss this application with them.  I will let you know what they have to say.

If I purchase it (4ft x 6ft roll) about $60, the first thing I will do is a test.  I plan to put it between the two pieces, lay it on a piece of wood and test it with a Mapp Gas torch and a high output weed burner.  Either of these should be hotter than the radiant heat  projected by the sides or bottom of the egg.

With the conversation we have had about fire potential, it sure seems like there should be a product in development somewhere to address this.

Anybody have any thoughts on this?

Sonny3 said:

I really like the idea of my wood table and I want to keep it nice.  Spent way to much time darn varnishing to throw it out.  So I have been on a mission to see how I can protect it from fire.  Or at least more than the way it sets now.

Since the table is already built for the height of using the table nest, I am trying to not add to much else underneath it.  As a novice to the Egg world, I thought the table nest would be enough.  WRONG!!

I have found a radiant heat barrier that is rated for 400 degrees direct contact and 2000 degrees radiant heat.  It is only mils thick.

My thought is to put it between a concrete backer board and a ceramic tile underneath my egg.  The barrier is adhesive on one side and can be easily cut, so I am also thinking of putting a nice silver trim on the edge of the wood around the hole in the top.

I am waiting on a call now from the manufacturer to discuss this application with them.  I will let you know what they have to say.

If I purchase it (4ft x 6ft roll) about $60, the first thing I will do is a test.  I plan to put it between the two pieces, lay it on a piece of wood and test it with a Mapp Gas torch and a high output weed burner.  Either of these should be hotter than the radiant heat  projected by the sides or bottom of the egg.

With the conversation we have had about fire potential, it sure seems like there should be a product in development somewhere to address this.

Anybody have any thoughts on this?

I have had a house fire that started as a result of a barbeque. I wouldn't wish that on my worst enemy. You say you have a granite tile and the egg nest. How thick is the tile? I believe most of the talk around here is based  on some pictures that have circulated around here with eggs sitting directly on pavers or somesuch and the wood below discolouring/smoldering. I haven't seen anything where a table actually ignited from the bottom (not that it hasn't happened). That is where the air gap becomes important. I have seen where someone cut out the base shelf to accommodate a paver and supported it from below to solve the height issue.

There have been a couple of guys that actually had combustion from proximity of the wood to the point that the top intersects the egg. Hole too small or a plastic handled grill brush too close to the egg. I have seen where someone cut out the base shelf to accommodate a paver and supported it from below to solve the height issue.

My two cents would be to look at any possibility of a fire and deal with it. Most importantly, if the egg and table are on a combustible surface that can transfer ignition to the house find a way to prevent it.

Sonny3

Steve, thanks for the input.  I am not OCD or anything, but I am trying to make sure I look at this from all of the angles as I get into Egging.  I definitely live by the ounce of prevention viewpoint in most everything I do.  My table is actually built so that both of my Eggs sit a little higher in the column that most.  I estimated that both Eggs will have about an inch of airspace between the walls and the top of the table.  That is one of the reasons that I don't want to make my Egg sit any higher.  Adding too much to the bottom would mean having to lower my bottom shelf, which means taking the whole thing apart.  Really don't want to go there if I can help it.

I have the combustible floor surface aspect covered, it sits on my lanai concrete slab and the egg will be about 20 feet from the concrete wall of the house.

Thanks again for the interest and input.

Ladeback69

My XL egg is in a nest with side tables on a concrete patio and SS prep table.  I am thinking of building a table or cabinet that I can slide in around the egg in its nest or just a large wooden prep table or cabinet.   Two reasons, one for fire reasons and two so I can move it around to clean the patio.