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We hope everyone enjoyed their Fourth of July weekend and is excited for more warm weather grilling! This week, we’ll be making these two burgers: Stuffed Portobello Mushroom and Caribbean Chicken, and also eating lots of these Ice Cream Sandwiches in honor of National Ice Cream Month! It's time to think about getting out to one of the many #EGGfests around the country - see a list here

My butt will be coming off the BGE soon........I hope.

mudpuppy45mudpuppy45 Posts: 21
edited April 2012 in EggHead Forum
My 8# butt is at 190 and I plan to take it off the BGE at 200.  My question, is what to do with the butt after I take it off......I'm wanting to go to bed.  Does it need to cool down before it goes in the friege?  Not going to serve it till about 5:00 p.m. tomorrow.
Mudpuppy45
(Ten Miles North of the Gulf in Alabama)
Large BGE

Comments

  • gerhardkgerhardk Posts: 764
    I think you should shred it before it cools and firms up again.

    Gerhard
  • ChokeOnSmokeChokeOnSmoke Posts: 1,673
    I think you should shred it before it cools and firms up again.

    Gerhard
    I agree, I'd take it off and pull it and reheat tomorrow night.
    Packerland, Wisconsin

  • BYS1981BYS1981 Posts: 1,483
    You should not put hot food into a fridge it can grow bacteria.
  • Thanks, after I pull it, it will be O.K. to put it up still warm?

     

    Mudpuppy45
    (Ten Miles North of the Gulf in Alabama)
    Large BGE
  • gerhardkgerhardk Posts: 764
    You should not put hot food into a fridge it can grow bacteria.
    I don't think that is true, always thought the reason not to put it in the fridge hot was for the benefit of the other food in the fridge and that it makes the compressor work harder than necessary.

    Gerhard
  • Thanks all, I think I'll shred and cover it.  Set the clock for a couple of hours, get back up and put it in the fridge.  Thanks again, all of you.
    Mudpuppy45
    (Ten Miles North of the Gulf in Alabama)
    Large BGE
  • BYS1981BYS1981 Posts: 1,483
    Gerhard,

    I was watching a "Kitchen Nightmares" with Chef Gordon Ramsay and he said food can't go into the fridge hot or else it grows bacteria. I am on my phone or else I would search for an article.
  • mikey5874mikey5874 Posts: 86
    I dont want to step on any toes here or make anyone mad, but just to add my two cents, I would rather take advice from my dog than anything "Chef" Gordon Ramsey would ever say. He has to be the worlds biggest ass. ( He is a nightmare himself) But on the pork, I would think the best time to eat the pulled pork is at least two hours after it done. 
  • stikestike Posts: 15,597
    edited April 2012
    why doesn't it grow bacteria if you sit it out at room temp where it grows cooler at an even slower rate? well. it would.  far more dangerous to sit it on the counter to cool.

    in general, you want to cool it quickly. a giant chunk of meat doesn't cool quickly in the fridge, but you need to refrigerate it to cool it quickly.  so break it down. ramsey's critical missing difference

    either he is wrong, or you are remembering it incorrectly, or they edited out the real info. the answer is, he's sorta correct, and unclear enough to be wrong. thank the editor for making it unclear, since they don't have time to explain on a tv show

    you need to cool it quickly.  and that means a large amount of hot food should be  stored in smaller batchs, or a shallow pan, so that it quickly moves through  the oft-quoted (and rarely understood ) "four hours between 40-140"

    the idea is that as a general rule (which means it doesn't always apply, but you can't go wrong following it) is that the hot food in a large mass (say, your pork butt) can stay between 40-140 for more than four hours in the fridge, because it takes so long to cool.  but it sure as hell will stay beyween 40-140 if you leave it OUT of the fridge.  so, it's pretty dangerous if your take-wawy from ramsey is "don't put hot food in a fridge".  because it's wrong. 

    don't put a LOT of hot food in a fridge.

    pull the pork, store it in a foil tray, put it in the oven, and then it will quickly move through 'danger zone' of four hours//40-140.

    to screw things up a bit...  you have to ask yourself why you aren't freaking out that your butt has already (likely) been between 40-140 for four hours as the thing was coming UP to temp.

    but here's the thing.  what bacteria are we talking about?  fecal bacteria.  ON (not in) the meat.  it's toast after a short time in the cooker. 

    and AFTER it's cooked? well, what bacteria are we talking about?  certainly not magic NEW fecal bacteria (unless some crazy stuff happens at your house. )  the only thing that infects the meat after it is cooked is YOU opening the dome and handling it, and serving it.

    cross contamination. 

    it's why a prosciutto can hang at room temp for years and be safe, but the minute you cut it, it needs to be refrigerated.  because you, the knife, the plate, etc. may contaminate it.

    anyway.

    sorry to blather on about it, but this question never goees away.  any person here wanting to cook food at these temps, in large amounts, and serve it to people should NOT just follow my advice, or chef ramsey's edited-for-tv advice, or 'some guy i know said' advice.

    look into it yourself, and stop guessing.

    i would have pulled the pork, stored it in a pan with foil on top, and tossed it into the fridge.  not because of some nagging fear of bacteria, but because that is easier to reheat.

    and heating the PP whole again in order to pull it later would require a lot more heat, and risk drying what little moisture was left in the meat

    ed egli avea del cul fatto trombetta -Dante
  • BrewnChewBrewnChew Posts: 10
    Actually the chef is right on this one.  The center of the product, the butt in this instance, will stay in the bacteria growing range long enough to make nasties.  I had to take servsafe classes in Michigan back in my teens.  Gravy was crazy, a five gallon pot of gravy can stay in the danger zone, above 40 below 140, in a 33F fridge over 24 hours.  So you have to use shallow containers to get your food to refrigerator temperatures within two hours.

    So with that pulling it gives you more surface area and should allow it to drop to the fridge zone within two hours.  I would pull it and get it straight into the fridge.  If you don't think you can drop it fast enough pull it put it in the freezer for 30 minutes, and then transfer to the fridge.  You can Google the USDA guidelines or your local state guidelines for more information.
  • stikestike Posts: 15,597
    he's right, except for the fact that he didn't explain it, and led everyone to infer that what he meant was not to put hot food in the fridge.  don't put a LOT of hot mass into the frdige, but DO get it into the fridge quickly.

    and do that by breaking it down.

    still, i have to ask where the bacteria is in that 200 degree pork (unpulled).  it's actually the act of pulling it that can re-introduce bacteria
    ed egli avea del cul fatto trombetta -Dante
  • R2Egg2QR2Egg2Q Posts: 1,476

    From the USDAs site on Refrigeration and Food Safety :

    Safe Handling of Foods for Refrigerating
    Hot food can be placed directly in the refrigerator or it can be rapidly chilled in an ice or cold water bath before refrigerating. Cover foods to retain moisture and prevent them from picking up odors from other foods.

    A large pot of food like soup or stew should be divided into small portions and put in shallow containers before being refrigerated. A large cut of meat or whole poultry should be divided into smaller pieces or placed in shallow containers before refrigerating.

    XL, Large, Small, Mini Eggs
    Bay Area, CA
  • MaskedMarvelMaskedMarvel Posts: 1,045
    Hey Stike- that was your best post so far from an informative and factual entertainment perspective.


    I refrigerate my butts unpulled, but cut so they can be sliced thin, reheated (EASILY - always amazed at how fast pork reheats), and served.  It's just usually for one to four people though.  For more I might pull it first...  I'd just be afraid it'd dry out.
    Large BGE -- Greensboro!


  • stikestike Posts: 15,597
    some prefer sliced PP.  i have a small family, so my PP comes when we have a cookout, and it all gets (mostly) wped out.  so i rarely have to reheat it.  the small amount that is left over is used in ABTs for example.

    reheating is ok, not ideal. it IS better the first day.  because all the water in the stuff is fleeting at 200 degrees. and the only real thing that makes it 'moist' is gelatin and fat.  next day, the gelatin needs some heat to melt (not be reconverted from collagen, but just melt).  that further drives off what water is left from the first cook.

    i try it in foil, and add some type of juice, coke, whatever.  not so much to flavor it, but enough to slippery-fy it
    ed egli avea del cul fatto trombetta -Dante
  • GaryLangeGaryLange Posts: 194
    Just looked it up and food that is left on the counter to cool collects bacteria. Placing it in the fridge will cool in down and prevent this. I would pull the Pork Butt and separate it into meal portions and then place it in the fridge.
  • GaryLangeGaryLange Posts: 194
    Here is a great answer to this question from someone who seems to have a few years of experience.

    Best Answer - Chosen by Asker

    As soon as you can. The enemy is pathogenic (disease causing) bacteria.

    This bacteria exists everywhere and in everything (including our food),
    but our digestive process kills it as long as there isn't too much of it
    so we don't get sick.

    These bacteria grow best between 40 and 140 degrees F. They do grow
    above or below those numbers as well, just not as fast. The magic
    number taught in food handling courses
    is 4 hours. Food can not spend more than 4 hours in that 40-140
    temperature range and still be considered safe. This is a general, and
    very over-cautious standard that accounts for the worst possible case,
    but better safe than sorry. It is cumulative as well. 4 hours between
    40 and 140 over the lifetime of the food, not 4 hours, then boil it or
    freeze and re-set the clock to 4 hours. 4 hours in that temperature
    range, since it was first prepared until it hits your belly. A number
    of factors affect this- the pH and salt level of the food, presence of
    preservatives, etc, but stick with the 4 hour rule to be safe.

    For example, if you take left-overs home from a restaurant, count how
    much time your food spent in that danger range while it was sitting on
    your plate uneaten, how long it was in the take out container on the way
    home, etc, until you got it below 40, or re-heated and ate it.

    If you have a lot of something (i.e. a large batch of soup, or a large
    roast, etc), then you should force cool it by putting it in a clean
    container, in an ice and water bath to drop below 40 ASAP, then get it
    into the fridge.

    If it's a smaller piece of something, them just get it into the fridge, as close to the blower as possible.

    As was stated above, do not completely cover hot or warm foods when they
    go into the fridge. This produces warm steam inside the container that
    bacteria LOVE to grow in, very rapidly. Once that bacteria-laden steam
    cools and condenses into liquid, it drips into the food and contaminates
    it (ditto, that take-out container that you brought your food home in).
    Just loosely cover warm or hot foods so they can breathe (enough that
    nothing falls in, and the food doesn't dry out or form a crust, but
    steam can still escape), put them in the fridge and when they're cold,
    close the cover completely.

    A good general rule is to just use your nose. MOST (not all) pathogenic bacteria that will spoil food in your kitchen smells bad when it grows, so if it smells funky, it's probably bad.

    One thing to keep in mind, is that hands, cutting boards and sponges are
    the worst sources for bacterial contamination in food. The less
    bacteria the food has in it to begin with, the longer it'll last.
    Sanitize anything that touches the food in a weak bleach and water
    solution (Google for more info), change your sponge for a new one all
    the time, and wash your hands like a maniac when you cook.

    Source(s):

    I'm a restaurant executive with 35 years professional Chef experience, certified food handler, and trainer/ teacher of Chefs.

  • stikestike Posts: 15,597
    why is it ok to leave your toothbrush out all the time? 

    i bet this expert changes his toothbrush once a year. all the while freaking out about soup spending four hours at room temp
    :))
    ed egli avea del cul fatto trombetta -Dante
  • gerhardkgerhardk Posts: 764
    edited April 2012


    One thing to keep in mind, is that hands, cutting boards and sponges are
    the worst sources for bacterial contamination in food. The less
    bacteria the food has in it to begin with, the longer it'll last.
    Sanitize anything that touches the food in a weak bleach and water
    solution (Google for more info), change your sponge for a new one all
    the time, and wash your hands like a maniac when you cook.


    One thing that I would add to that list is gloves, you see a lot of food handlers use the gloves for the protection of their hands rather than the food.  For what it's worth when we wash utensils we use a bleach solution of 100 ppm and for sanitizing work surfaces and equipment we use a solution of 200 ppm.

    Gerhard
  • why is it ok to leave your toothbrush out all the time? 

    i bet this expert changes his toothbrush once a year. all the while freaking out about soup spending four hours at room temp
    :))
    Ha! True

  • why is it ok to leave your toothbrush out all the time? 

    i bet this expert changes his toothbrush once a year. all the while freaking out about soup spending four hours at room temp
    :))


    Ha! True
    This is what I learned too when opening my money pit....er, I mean restaurant. I always strictly followed these rules at the shop but as we spoke about earlier this week with the "fires going out and what to do with the meat"  discussion, I'm a little more liberal with these "rules" at home. I'm always much more careful when feeding others, but it's obvious that this 4 hour rule is an Armageddon scenario that is really more for commercial enterprise than home use. There are many more agents of contamination in a commercial kitchen. Think 5-6 cooks + other staff coming in contact with your food or the prep area for your food. 200-300 customers a day coming in contact with every surface in the place. Faulty cooling equip or just something being left out too long and thrown in a fridge that has been opened 200 times that day and not as cold as it should be for a few hours. Not to mention all of those people have kids and significant others that they come in contact with before coming into your pristine kitchen or shop. Our kitchen was aces when it came to inspection time but it wasn't nearly as clean as my home kitchen is. There is no possible way it could be.

  • stikestike Posts: 15,597
    you are preachin to the choir, my friend. hahaha
    for years i would ask "but why?" whenever someone would mention the rule.  the answer was always 'because', or 'the USDA says so".  but there were just too many holes in it.

    i totally agree you want these rules in place, because i always say that they need to be something an apathetic 17 year old kid in a hair net can remember. 

    essentially had people saying that they would feel safe eating a butt that was in the danger zone for 3:59 , but that at 4:00 it turned into a pumpkin. 

    not one of them ever replied when i asked the rhetorical toothbrush question.
    :))
    ed egli avea del cul fatto trombetta -Dante
  • you are preachin to the choir, my friend. hahaha
    for years i would ask "but why?" whenever someone would mention the rule.  the answer was always 'because', or 'the USDA says so".  but there were just too many holes in it.

    i totally agree you want these rules in place, because i always say that they need to be something an apathetic 17 year old kid in a hair net can remember. 

    essentially had people saying that they would feel safe eating a butt that was in the danger zone for 3:59 , but that at 4:00 it turned into a pumpkin. 

    not one of them ever replied when i asked the rhetorical toothbrush question.
    :))
    And I busted out laughing when you asked it today.



  • gerhardkgerhardk Posts: 764
    edited April 2012
    Just a few words on my view on the difference between commercial kitchens and home kitchens. In general folks working in a commercial setting are supervised by someone educated in food handling and sanitation, simple things like bleaching the cloth used to wipe a counter, I have been too many homes were the sponge or cloth used for clean up had an off odor good sign that they are breeding bacteria. Then everything given a cleaning with it will be contaminated. Commercial kitchen generally don't have cats and dogs wandering about, I have seen people feed their cats on kitchen counters, did they sanitize their paws when they left the litter box? Commercial kitchen don't have kids touching and cross contaminating various ingredients and equipment. I am not saying that the average person is a dirty slob but I see how many people don't bother washing their hands when they leave a public toilet. In general I shy away from bake sales and pot luck dinners, but everyone has to make their own decision on what they are comfortable with.

    Gerhard
  • Just a few words on my view on the difference between commercial kitchens and home kitchens. In general folks working in a commercial setting are supervised by someone educated in food handling and sanitation, simple things like bleaching the cloth used to wipe a counter, I have been too many homes were the sponge or cloth used for clean up had an off odor good sign that they are breeding bacteria. Then everything given a cleaning with it will be contaminated. Commercial kitchen generally don't have cats and dogs wandering about, I have seen people feed their cats on kitchen counters, did they sanitize their paws when they left the litter box? Commercial kitchen don't have kids touching and cross contaminating various ingredients and equipment. I am not saying that the average person is a dirty slob but I see how many people don't bother washing their hands when they leave a public toilet. In general I shy away from bake sales and pot luck dinners, but everyone has to make their own decision on what they are comfortable with.

    Gerhard
    All great points. I know I am much cleaner at home learning what I learned through owning a commercial kitchen. I even buy commercial products and sanitizers to use at home.....and I don't have cats for the exact reason you stated (seriously).


  • pezking7ppezking7p Posts: 121
    The average american is way, way too concerned with coming in contact with or consuming bacteria. 
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