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Pizza dough notes from my Italian cook neighbor

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3Pedals6Speeds
3Pedals6Speeds Posts: 439
edited November -1 in EggHead Forum
Okay, I related last week how lucky I am to have a fabulous Italian cook who lives next door, and who happens to blog about her recipes here

Well, I tried her pizza dough recipe with poor results, so bad that my 15 year old didn't even like it, and we all know 15 year old's will eat any pizza. So, I mentioned to her that I'd failed miserably, and she offered to let me sit in on her weekly dough making event today. So, I went, learned a few things, and thought I should share!

Her recipe talks about adding the water (warm, not hot) yeast (she uses Instant/Bread yeast) and olive oil initially, then the flour (unbleached non-bread flour) and the salt after about 2/3 of the flour goes in. BTW - the Kitchen Aid mixer was between 2 and 3 (setting) the whole time. One interesting thing is that she recommends not making the dough to a measured recipe (mainly the flour) other than a 1/3C of water per person, then add flour until the dough is 'right'. Well, that was my problem I see now, knowing when 'right' is. I imagine it's like Carwash Mike's ribs, you do it enough, you'll know. Anyway, I took a picture of the dough shortly before it was 'right':

PizzaDough.jpg

Notice how the dough at the bottom of the hook is still 'connected' to the bottom of the bowl? This is when she cautioned you have to progress carefully and add the smallest amounts of flour until it releases from the bowl and forms a tacky ball. At this point we started adding probably 1/2 - 1 tsp of flour at a time, giving up to a minute or more to fully incorporate the flour (*important*). It was weird, it would grab the flour up, look drier initially, then a minute later it would look wet again as the flour was pulled into the dough.

Anyway, we went like this, adding a little bit at a time, until it just got to the point of forming a stretched out 'ball' and detaching from the bottom of the bowl fully after the flour was incorporated, but the thing I noticed most was that when you had it 'right', the dough was tacky, but not sticky. It was kind of like handling an industrial strength 'Post-It' note (if that makes any sense). I also noticed that it left the merest amounts of dough on my hands:

PizzaHand.jpg

Anyway, I followed the recipe from there (interesting to note that the amount of yeast she recommends using is more a function of how soon you need the dough than anything else), let it rise in an oiled bowl on the counter-top for 2 hrs, punched down and divided (1/3 in my case) and formed balls that I left to rise another hour.

Here's the blasphemous part. My son was hungry, and I didn't have time to fire up the Egg, so I set the oven to 550 degree's and cooked it inside (the snowstorm going on here in Michigan may have had something else to do with it). The boy knows what side his bread is buttered on though. he said it was great (woo hoo, a compliment from a teenager!), but that he thought it would have been even better on the Egg ( He makes me so proud).

Here is the result. The best home made pizza I've ever pulled off in the past. Next time I'll leave it on for 30-45 more seconds and crisp the crust up just a touch more.

Pizza.jpg

Comments

  • rsmdale
    rsmdale Posts: 2,472
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    I also have an Italian neighbor that has helped me tremendously with my pie making.I am very happy with my dough,next I learn to make Buffalo Mozz.He makes a really tasty,smooth cheese.
    Nice Pie!!


    GOOD EATS AND GOOD FRIENDS


    DALE
  • KMO_Q
    KMO_Q Posts: 150
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    Great info...thanks for taking the time...Is the Kitchen Aid mixer important?
  • 3Pedals6Speeds
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    I don't think the mixer matters. If you're using a mixer, I think that a dough hook is a must, but she mentioned this can be done by hand, in which case my observation on consistency (tackiness) is probably more relevant than the sticking to the bowl observation I made when she was making it.

    If you've got a mixer with a dough hook, there's no way I'd suggest doing it by hand.
  • Hoss
    Hoss Posts: 14,600
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    Great post.Pizza dough DRIVES ME CRAZY...er!!! Your pie looks great! :)
  • 3Pedals6Speeds
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    double post - oops.
  • gsgentry
    gsgentry Posts: 128
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    Pizza dough is my current nemesis. I will perfect it and have had some good help and direction along the way. This helps even more. Thanks for the post and information.
  • ThunderBunny
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    Your neighbor's blog is fabulous! Very pleasing to the eyes and stomach...
  • cookn biker
    cookn biker Posts: 13,407
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    Good post Gary. Thanks for sharing your experience. I need more practice!
    Molly
    Colorado Springs
    "Loney Queen"
    "Respect your fellow human being, treat them fairly, disagree with them honestly, enjoy their friendship, explore your thoughts about one another candidly, work together for a common goal and help one another achieve it."
    Bill Bradley; American hall of fame basketball player, Rhodes scholar, former U.S. Senator from New Jersey
    LBGE, MBGE, SBGE , MiniBGE and a Mini Mini BGE
  • eenie meenie
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    Your pizza looks great. You must be having fun learning from your neighbor. I've enjoyed her blog.
    I look forward to more Italian cuisine from your egg! :)
  • WokOnMedium
    WokOnMedium Posts: 1,376
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    You are sooooo lucky! My neighbors call each other Ole and Leena...no help with pizza, maybe lutefisk :sick: , but no pizza.

    Take that neighbor woman and lock her up in your basem....er uh I mean...never ever move away from her.

    Those pies look awesome!

    Gonna have to revisit the instructions. I'm afraid my neurosis will get in the way of knowing when its "right". It looks right, but is it right? or almost right, or did I go past right, and if I missed right will I be able to get right back again, or if I add more flour, maybe it'll be right....I need more practice.

    Got two more dough balls in the freezer from Molly's recipe. Gonna try them at a lower temp and see if its better...don't tell the Italian lady I froze my dough. Somehow I think she wouldn't approve. Thanks for the info!
  • 3Pedals6Speeds
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    wokonmedium - Interesting that you mention freezing. She doesn't do it, but she told me there's no reason you can't, but then she wasn't encouraging it necessarily. She did say that making it up and putting it straight into the fridge and letting it rise more slowly over night does improve the flavor, but then that's not original, I think we've all heard that before. After I made the batch at her house under her direction, (what I cooked) I made a batch "on my home turf" and she said to just let it go through the 1st rise (2hrs), punch it down and divide, and wrap those puppies and pop them in the freezer. I'm going to try them next week, and see how the freezer treated them.

    With regard to a specific recipe or another (Molly or others), I think her advice is fairly universal to any dough recipe. She mentioned adding honey to the recipe if you like, adjusting the flour types to meet tastes (00 Italian flour in a ratio of 1:1 with unbleached non-bread flour was a strong recommendation) she even mentioned she sometimes slips some whole wheat into the mix when her kids aren't looking. What I found most helpful was the process I guess, more than the specific ingredients.
  • uglydog
    uglydog Posts: 256
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    Fabulous post, and a great help for the many people who are looking to perfect their pizza making skills. Thanks so much for the info and the pics. Please pass this gratitude on to your Italian neighbor. How about sending some completed za samples out to forum members?
    (Me first, please).
    Uglydog
  • Boilermaker Ben
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    You are so blessed to have a neighbor who will teach you. Nothing like hands-on experience, when it comes to learning about baking. Keep these stories and tips coming.

    The post-it note comparison when describing the tackiness of dough is genius.

    I also like the 1/3 Cup water per person recommendation. I'll have to try that some time.
  • 3Pedals6Speeds
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    I am lucky, no doubt.

    Yeah, on the dough tackiness, I almost didn't make the analogy out of fear with this group I'd hear all kinds of "it's like paper?" ribbing, but am glad I did because it really does capture it. Especially since if you don't use the exact same mixer, you wouldn't have a point of reference.

    Can't wait to see what she educates me on next!
  • Boilermaker Ben
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    That "does it look right" thing trips me up, too. But I think it's a matter of not doing it often enough to get a feel for "right". That's why it's hard to learn from a book, or TV. Gotta just get in there and get your hands dirty several days in a row to start to get a feel for it.