Pizza Yeast Important?

Bill0021 · April 2009

I have a few pizzas made under my belt now, all were good and some were better.

In the quest for even better, I have been reading about the importance of yeast for increased flavor and better crust especially for a New York or Naples Style. I have ordered some "starter yeast" on line and will post on how it goes when it comes in.

Anyone use the none grocery store yeast, starter yeasts or even wild yeasts? Did you notice a big difference?

EmandM'sDad · April 2009

I use instant yeast for almost everything now. It doesn't require any proofing. i think you use about a third less than Active for a given recipe. i've found that with pizza dough the most important things are the rest stage to let the flour hydrate before the the knead, And a long slow rise in the fridge. the rest stage gives the dough better texture (crisper crust, chewier inside, while the long slow rise developes flavor.

AZRP · April 2009

I know that in brewing beer the yeast makes a big difference, don't know why dough wouldn't be the same. Have you tried the hi gluten flour, that made a major difference in my pizzas. -RP

Gator Bait · April 2009

Hi Bill

When you say starter and wild yeast are you referring to sourdough?

Gator

Bill0021 · April 2009

The only flour I have tried so far is the regular stuff at the grocery store. I will be heading over to a speciality shop to try some different ones including hi-gluten.

Yes, I think the proper term is sourdough yeast.

I will try the resting and slow rise as well in the fridge. Do you let it sit right after mixing it altogether? Is that that resting stage?

There are so many variables, which I guess is a good thing if you like to play and experiment.

gdenby · April 2009

A few months ago, I had my first taste of sourdough pizza, which was also the first time I had a true Neapolitan wood fired style pizza. It was a revelation! The fellow who made the pie has been working with his culture for 10 years, and confesses that he is still learning thing (such as adjusting the amount of salt for different levels of ambient humidity.)

So I've switched to yeast dough for pizza. A huge improvement.

And, I've obtained several sourdough cultures from Sourdough International. I've got an Italian strain growing. I'm a novice baker, and sourdough culture is quite different to use from store-bought instant. I haven't gotten to a pizza dough yet, although have had several pretty good breads. I look forward to the day when I put my first pie on the Egg.

From what I understand, retarding the dough in the fridge will up the sourness. With the breads I have done, starter that was in the fridge was noticeably tarter than that which had just been growing at room temperature.

Good luck. Seems like pizza making requires as much attention as doing a good brisket, maybe more. :laugh:

EmandM'sDad · April 2009

In answer to your 2nd question.... i lmix just long enough to make a lumpy, gloppy mess. Then let it sit for about 20 minutes. The real bakers callthis the autolyse, I think. then I machine knead for about 15-20 minutes, portion into gladwear, then onto the bottom shelf of the frdge for 48-72 hours. When your ready to have pizza, let it come to room temp, shape into disk with your fingers, then stretch to final size.

Buxwheat · April 2009

Care to share your dough recipe, now that you have told us a little about your technique? Also, I'm still experimenting with bread dough. Haven't gotten something I really like yet, nor anything repeatable. Anything you can share about making a good Italian loaf? I like a hard, leathery crust and a tough (to the tooth) crumb.

EmandM'sDad · April 2009

I been using Zippylip's recipe just changing the technique a bit. i don't have it here, but maybe Marc will jump in.

EmandM'sDad · April 2009

Here's a link to Marc's recipe and method. I just add the rest stage and slow done the ferment.
http://www.eggheadforum.com/index.php?option=com_simpleboard&func=view&id=547684&catid=1

Buxwheat · April 2009

But I think I will add your resting stage and refrigeration to the technique. Thanks again. Now, how about bread? Any ideas?

Gator Bait · April 2009

Hi Bill

I have just started researching sourdough so I am no help. Yet.
What I did find interesting is a sourdough starter by King Arthur Flour Company that they been perpetuating for over 250 years. Sounds like they are doing something right. At least three generations of my family have been using their flours and they are very good.

Good luck,

Gator

Willie Lump Lump · April 2009

Hers a basic recipe that works for me.

Ingredients are
1 LB bread flour (I use King Arthur)
2 tsp. salt (sea salt preferred)
½ tsp. Instant Dry Yeast (SAF)
11 fluid oz water from my refrigerator water dispenser (that’s right it’s a lot of water)

Process 12 oz/ of flour with all the water until it becomes a wet mass. (About 30 sec)
Let stand 20 minutes (Autolyse)
Add rest of flour yeast and salt and process until dough reaches 80 degrees (about a minute in a Cusinart)
Divide in two and put in Rubbermaid containers in the fridge from 48 to 72 hours.
Warm for 40 minutes and lightly flour before hand forming into pizza disks

This dough has a high hydration and is intended for a high temp cook with light toppings, go for 650 degrees and maybe 5 minutes for your initial try.

If your not happy with your pizza at least you’ll clean out the egg! :laugh:
WLL

Panhandle Smoker · April 2009

I am just learning the whole bread thing. The first pizza we made we used the garlic butter dough from the forum. It turned out amazing (same day recipe, I guess). This past weekend we did it again except this time after mixing the dough ball we let it rest in the fridge over night for about 36 hours. It did not fluff up and did not brown as much as the first time, while still very good it seemed as if the dough did not cook as well. I guess this recipe is somewhat of an instant recipe and some are meant to rest the 48 to 72 hours. Is this correct? The ingredients we used are similar to Willies.

icemncmth · April 2009

I use a starter most of the time...

My starter is close to 100 years old and has been in the family passed down from generation to generation.

Now it is called "sourdough" starter but that has very little to do with sourdough bread.

You make your dough "sour" by retarding the fermentation.

Most places that make pizza will add some of yesterdays uncooked dough to todays batch this is how they keep the flavor the same. They also mostly use cake yeast or fresh yeast.

I use to work in a bakery. All we had to do to make a stater was add flour and water and let it sit out for a few hours. Since we worked with flour and yeast everyday the air, fixtures..etc were loaded with yeast. It can take longer in your house so that is why some people will add grape or other things to their starter to "jump" start it..

When using a starter in your pizza dough all you have to do is make sure it is active and keep track of your water and flour in it so that you can adapt your recipe.

I found that it is easier to use a dense starter vs a wet starter. Also different strains will impart a different flavor. That is why pizza with the same toppings can taste different from one place to another..

Gator Bait · April 2009

Hi icemncmth,

Thanks for the interesting post. I found an interesting collection of starters at Sourdoughs International also.

I have baked regular breads many times with instant yeasts over the years. Where I live now I don't have a suitable oven so it has been a while. Now that I have a BGE my baking horizons are opening up again.

Gator

Bill0021 · April 2009

I agree there is a ton of interesting and useful information here. Thanks all!

I knew yeast was a lively organism but never understood how it worked or who "caught" the first yeasts. I had no idea it is all around us, and could just be grown or multiplied with the right conditions.

There is a good article on Wilkipedia
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sourdough

The history of San Fran. Sourdough is interesting and how the miners used to carry it around with them around their necks or clipped to their belts.

Willie Lump Lump · April 2009

I am interested in starters but haven’t used one. When I look at the sites that talk about them it seems as if there are two components to them. There is ”wild” yeast and symbiotic bacteria. The flavor is the way the yeast and bacteria react with the flour. (I'm guessing on this)
When I give my yeast only dough a long retardation it makes the finished product have a much different taste. I don’t know the food science and couldn’t tell you if it’s sour it’s just more flavorful.
I think that the high hydration high heat creates more dough steaming and you get a much lighter more pizza like then bread like effect.
WLL

Mr. & Mrs Potatohead · April 2009

Anybody out there know...Is there a way to start your own sourdough starter? That is tried and true?
If I remember correctly...I think I read in Joy of Cooking that it can be done.

Gator Bait · April 2009

Hi Mr. & Mrs. Potatohead

Try this site:

http://www.sourdoughhome.com/startingastarter.html

Gator

Pizza Yeast Important?

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