another dry aging wantabee thread

RRP · September 2008

First of all let me say I am a firm believer that the only difference between the absolutely best/expensive steaks from the best steakhouse and your BGE at home has to do with dry aging the meat. After wondering for many years I watched a TV clip tonight filmed at our favorite place called "Jim's" in Peoria, IL where two New York strip meals run us $100 and we still go there a couple times a year for the food and ambiance. That may not sound high to some of you, but any egger knows it is over priced in our minds! Just the same I can buy aged NY strips from a local high profile butcher/speciality shop for $20 a pound so I get close to the same as "Jim's", but still $20 a pound sounds inflated. Now...back to the clip that was featured tonight at "Jim's"...their reputation secret was they dry age all of their meat for 4 weeks, before trimming it into steaks. That sounds like to me they kept the chunk-o-cow in tact for 4 weeks in a refrigerated mode and then cut, trim and cook. Does that make sense? And MOST importantly, could a guy start a chunk-o-cow and keep cutting a couple pieces off say every week? And if that scenario makes sense what wrap/seal/paper should a guy keep it at?

Little Steven · September 2008

RRP
I'm prety much a newb with dry aging but I think that cutting hunks off might lead to bacteria growth. I did a prime rib for about 16 days a couple of weeks ago and it was very good. Stike was kind enough to give me some advice and I felt quite comfortable serving it to guests. IMHO the way to do it would be to age the whole strip, cut steaks and freeze.

Steve

civil eggineer · September 2008

The meat needs to stay at a specific temp and humidity while aging. Unless you have the proper equipment and control I don't think I would recommend trying it. Dry aging causes the meat to loose moisture making the beef flavor more concentrated. Most butchered meat is aged 10 to 14 days.

emilluca · September 2008

It is all about buying good choice beef. Aging is more because of the weight loss from dehydration and trimming off the mold that may appear. Steaks are sold as strips [bnls] because the bone can sour and the muscle is still acceptable. The butcher has to make up the weight loss. He buys the hind 1/4 at 2.00 a lb for 165-185 lbs. 2 weeks of hanging will bring the weight down to 140 150 lbs so it would cost more per lb to get back just the cost they have in it.

You can buy a whole strip or rib from a box store [Sams Costco] take it out of the bag place it in the fridge at 38 degrees for 14 days or more and it is aged. There is no difference in a meat cooler at 38 degrees or a fridge at 38 degrees. After it has aged then cut it into steaks and trim.

stike · September 2008

i have posted my nine page thesis on this so many times over the years that if you haven't ever read it, you don't deserve me posting it again. :(

one of the reasons i have to laugh at people that throw out meat that isn't bright red is that you can leave the damn primal in a fridge to dry age for four weeks. although, four weeks is only really a good start. 28 days is for pvssies.

got a place near me does prime for 45 days, unwrapped, in a fridge, no magic.

sure, there are MINOR considerations, but it is not rocket science.

email me off line and i'll send you some info. i don't feel like posting it a 30th time.

in my own not-so-humble opinion, though, the steak which benefits most from dry aging is the rib eye. we egg owners can cook a strip steak better than literally any steak house. the bump in flavor for dry-aged strip steak is good, but not nearly as good as from the rib eye.
gene simmons has a photo album of all the chicks he's ever had. here are some of my past loves (i'm married, so i have to stick with steak as my vice):

a little cowboy ribeye, 45 days. you could drive a nail with it before it's cooked. after it's cooked, you could cut it with your thumb

another rib eye. only two pounds. this is about right for my eight year old, or for my lunch

(nah, it was for the wife and I)

some steaks for the patriots game. since i took this pic, by the way, they have lost one regular season game. (and just one farking stupor bowl) i took this in 2006

here's a strip steak...
i honestly enjoy a 'regular' strip steak so much, that i don't get dry aged strips anymore

my personal record for oldest chunk of beef ever eaten was something like 6 days (hanging side of beef plus shipping) plus 45 days (dry aging at the butchers) plus 14 days (in my fridge as leftovers before i remembered it was in there). that makes for a steak lunch roughly 65 days after that cow was dispatched.

next time your mother in law tells you the hamburger is one day past the sell by date, just put her on the phone with me.

stike · September 2008

not so fast!!!

the difference in the cooler versus fridge is generally much better air circulation in the cooler (which forms the pellicle much more quickly) and higher humidity which (counter intuitively) slows the drying out.

prime beef (versus choice) benefits most, because fat is what we are after. beef fat will lose 25-30% of it's weight (water). water, being flavorless, is useless as far as we are concerned. prime beef is also much preferred because the outer fat layer on the primal is generally thicker and complete all the way around. this is ALSO a protective layer if anything gets too funky. and it allows you to trim the mold (which rarely occurs these days) or any dessicated freezer-burnt kinda stuff, while still leaving fat.

butchers regret trimming all the fat off beef not because it adds weight and profit, but because it is where most of the flavor is. they cut it off because housewives make them cut it off.

the drying will literally condense the beef fat (i.e. condense the flavor), as well as allow the enzymes in the beef to break down the proteins (tenderizing it). the enzymes also produce some interesting esters that flavor the beef with a little more complexity than you get from bright red stuff from the case (which i unfortunately eat 95% of the time, for budgetary reasons).

i'm a bit of a freak for the dry-aged stuff.

but there are worse vices.

Mike in Abita · September 2008

I'd love some info on this. Any chance you could send it my way too. I'm wondering if it would work better with whole primals or individual steaks?

stike · September 2008

cutting steaks off it and then letting it go for another week would create an 'end' on the meat which was exposed muscle, the side of the next steak, as it were.

the exposed sides of an aging primal should really be just the fat layer. you don't want to expose broad areas of muscle. for one, you'd have to trim it off the next steak.

you have the right idea. age the whole thing, then cut it into steaks all at once and freeze.

stike · September 2008

you can wet age an idividual steak maybe a couple days. my favorite way is to let the butcher do it, and then buy his "manager's special".

you can't really dry age a steak for a couple weeks. you'd be missing the whole idea...

age the primal. it is (if prime especially) generally covered in a mostly contiguous layer of fat. that is good protection, and allows the muscle to stay relatively moist. you don't want exposed muscle.

send me an email via the forum's email thingy, and i'll send you some thoughts on it. i hesitate to send actual 'instructions', because this isn't like making pancakes. you can screw this up and get sick. die? not frigging likely. you'd have to be an idiot to die (incorrectly handled beef generally is something not easily eaten accidentally).

do you want suggestion #1 for free? first thing you do is go down and spend as much as it costs for a real, 21-day (minimum) dry aged steak. if you don't notice a difference, you won't have wasted your time. and you also will know what a dry aged steak smells like. i don't want a fone call from someone who aged their own, just as they are about to cook a 21 day roast for their mother in law, where they try to describe the smell to me and get me to "ok" it and tell'em it's good to eat. max may give out his number on turkey day, but i have other things to do...

hahaha

Mike in Abita · September 2008

No need to worry about me calling. I'll never feed my M-I-L and good steak. email coming.

stike · September 2008

give me time in the a.m. to send you the blahblahblah.

i have a dude coming to set up my new compu-tato and network, i'll be offline for a bit

Charleston Dave · September 2008

Oddly, this very question came up tonight at a sold-out tasting menu prepared at a high-end butcher shop here in Charleston, Ted's Butcher Block. Ted's a 3rd-generation butcher, national reputation, and huge BGE fan (his 3-course tasting dinner tonight for 30 people was prepared on an XL BGE).

When asked, Ted said he would like to do dry-aging but did not plan to do so anytime soon, as it required careful control of humidity and temperature. He said he had a corner of the shop he'd like to have a second walk-in to do it, but it was a long-term project. He said the flavors of wet and dry-aged were quite different, and wet was more common in the industry because it was more easily controlled. He described dry aging as "controlled rotting of meat" with a characteristic flavor that appeals to some folks.

You do have a walk-in refrigerator at home, don't you?

Big'un · September 2008

Just a line to let you know that if it weren't for these kinds of posts, I would've thought dry-aged beef was about the equivalent of my dry roasted instant rank coffee. :laugh: You have put out some great info about this subject, and I wish you could get it posted on one of the websites that most of us visit. It would save you a lot time, and from redistributing info. Then the questions might be more of the "fine tune" nature, rather than "where do I begin". As much as I try to pay attention, I know that when I attempt this at home, I'll be asking the same questions again too. You have really been great with knowlege and your willingness to share it, even if you won't open a "dry-aged sniffing hotline". :blink: Anyway Thanks for your efforts. BTW, I have a whole ribeye that I want to...

BobS · September 2008

For what it's worth, there was an article in Fine Coooking or Cooks Illustrated, within the last year that tried to answer the question about he value of dry aged meat for a roast prime.

They really liked prime beef and also prime, dry aged, but the concensus was that the dry aged was really not worth the money "when grilling", because you were adding so many pronunced flavors from the cooking and seasoning, that it was hard to tell the difference.

I do not have the room or patience to do it myself. I generally like to go to the store, look for the better quality choice cuts (there is a pretty big range of quality - marbling). I when I go for prime, aged, I never use more than S&P on the cook.

BobS · September 2008

stike wrote:

do you want suggestion #1 for free? first thing you do is go down and spend as much as it costs for a real, 21-day (minimum) dry aged steak. if you don't notice a difference, you won't have wasted your time. and you also will know what a dry aged steak smells like. i don't want a fone call from someone who aged their own, just as they are about to cook a 21 day roast for their mother in law, where they try to describe the smell to me and get me to "ok" it and tell'em it's good to eat. max may give out his number on turkey day, but i have other things to do...

hahaha

Best advice I ever saw on one of these threads!!!

fishlessman · September 2008

i sometimes buy the 45 day dry aged stuff where stike gets his, its a great butcher shop. i probably wont dry age at home anymore, its too convienient. ive also done some dry aging at home and its pretty easy, but i only go the 11 to 14 day route. somethings that have helped me or would help as ive learned a few things researching dry curing beef in a cellar. when ive done it in a fridge, sometimes it gets wet and sticky, what you really need is a small fan in there to help dry it out quicker in the beginning, something like a small computer fan to move the air. to get around this, stike wont like this idea, i do the towell trick for the first couple days wrapping it to help wick away moisture, then i just let it age on its own. there isnt enough moisture in a fridge to reach 85 percent humidity, adding a small pan of water in the fridge will get it up there. if you have one of those indoor/outdoor gages to monitor outside temps from indoors it wouldnt hurt to use it. top choice or better is what you want. stick with the ribeye primal and get the one thats got the most outside fat aroung it. i find with the 45 day dry aged stuff that its so dense and packed with flavor, that i only eat about half as much compared to a regular nondryaged steak, its filling and satisfying, 20 dollars just doesnt seem so bad a price per pound. now going out and paying 100 dollars a meal is insane, even when i go to a place like the outback i just get the hamburger, why would i eat a steak out in resteraunt

stike · September 2008

like you, i just buy it when i want it now that the meat store (yes folks, that's the real name!) sells it. it's only 3 bucks more than top-choice is down here. not that i eat top-choice regualry, just saying.

i'm not a fan of doing the towel thing for the whole time. a few days up front is fine like you said. you just don't want wet towels on it at day 21.

i think it's 55% humidity, but still, hard to achieve in a home fridge, which is essentially a cold dehydrator. better too dry than too wet, though.

so anyway... did you dry cure any of your own sausage yet?

stike · September 2008

thanks Big'Un.

to be frank, there are some folks here who do not like old stike taking up real estate as much as i do, so it's cool to hear that you think it's (occasionally!) helpful

Gunnar · September 2008

Take up the real estate...if it's not helpful, it's entertaining!

fishlessman · September 2008

that 85 percent might be from something ive read lately about dry curing, different meats different authors, they seem to have different ideas about it. this is the last weekend for salmon fishing, then onto some dry curing. found some dry cured stuff over at demoulas, across from the deli/ lobster counter. they have sweet and hot coppa, the sweet stuff has more flavor, and fully dry cured chorizzo. been slicing it thin on the slicer, drizzling with olive oil and fresh lemon. been eating it for dinner on fresh warm bread from the same store about 3 times a week for dinner. good stuff, but you need a slicer to get it thin enough. im thinking my attic is about right for the dry cure right now, tape some black plastic on the windows, turn the grow light on down stairs and really make the neighbors (my neighbors are all retired policeman) wonder whats he growing. i get a humid foggy breeze off the lake every morning thru the attic, maybe next weekend

fishlessman · September 2008

14 days there is a good difference, but 45 days its night and day different. still im reluctant to go that long on my own.

Big'un · September 2008

I think "some folks" can bite a ....bullet. If you don't interact,then this isn't a "forum" is it. No, you've been a lot of good help through the years. Tell the Nay-sayers to get a life, or read a book, so they can help instead. Just keep doin' what your doin' bro.

stike · September 2008

me too. all this talk about aging at home, plus my mention of 45 day stuff, seems to imply i advocate aging 45 days at home. uh uh.

i'd go 21 max i think

RRP · September 2008

wouldn't you know it...today I went to the local butcher shop in town where I've been buying dry aged steaks for several years and was told they no longer are offering them! Butcher said the steady demand just wasn't there and people refused to pay $20.99 a pound for them, when they think they can buy similiar meat from grocery stores for less than 1/2 of that. We have 4 "good" butcher shops in our nearby town of Peoria and none of them are dry aging any anymore. One owner at another told me he would dry age a whole piece for me for up to 6 days if I wanted it and I asked only 6 and not say 21 days? He laughed and said the meat would spoil in 21 days. Yo, stike, you want to call him for me? Just the same I bought a couple nice strips from him at $14.99 a pound and he says they were wet aged and I'd like them just the same yadda yadda yadda

stike · September 2008

well. i looked for three or four years around boston and found one shop that went 21 days, and charged about 30 a pound.

so you can understand why i am ecstatic that the place happened to open in my (former) home town that handles 45 day.

send him the link to the Meat Store. they advertise 45 days.

if it is kept at safe temperatures, it will become unpalatable long before it goes bad. i know that i am going to hear it from the certified chefs.... but there is no reason to think it will spoil at 21 days if it won't spoil in 6 or 14. unless he sells everything he gets within 24 hours, i bet he has "aged" (i.e. six day old) meat in the case all the time.

another dry aging wantabee thread

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