Royal Oak - change in quality?

pgprescott · March 2017

xfire_ATX said:

Not trying to Hijack but since I was loading up the grill today- and I rotate with this and RO and an occasional Rockwood. I was surprised at the size of chunks coming out.

Yeah, but it's mesquite. Not a fan of mesquite. Must be a Texas thing

Botch · March 2017

RRP said:

I use a simple set of tools for my lump selection process...my eyes, hands and ears! Before I pick up a bag I look it over for apparent abuse in handling. Then I pick it up in the middle and make sure it feels solid and full, not at all bottom half heavy. Then I give it a gentle shake. A good bag will emit a crisp "clink clink" sound as the lump shifts - but only slightly in the bag.

I used to do this when buying Doritos, but they won't let me into Kroger's anymore.

stlcharcoal · March 2017

bhedges1987 said:

SBGonzo said:

My last bag of Rockwood was the same way...all little pieces at the bottom.

Every bag of rock wood is like that for me. I see no difference in the pieces, only in the initial start up to burn off the bad smells.

Any bag of [true] charcoal should be like this, if it hasn't been delivered to the store on a pillow by cherubs. Charcoal, that is properly kilned, is very brittle and is going to break down by merely moving it around. I would wager that any bag that does not have fines in the bottom is "charred wood", not "charcoal". If it's not breaking down from bagging, pillarization, shipping, handling, etc, then it's still wood.

I don't get how people have been buying chips, cereals, crackers, etc for decades and no one says a word about the little broken pieces or dust......they throw it away because it's the norm. But how did lump charcoal ever get elevated to the expectation that is NOT the norm. My only guess is briquettes--you don't really see that much damage in a briquette bag since they're pressed together. Or course, there's very little charcoal in "charcoal briquettes" anymore......not good marketing to call them "coal fly ash & limestone briquettes" I suppose.

Jclayto · March 2017

Good info everyone. I attempted an all nighter last weekend with the RO small pieces and had temp issues all night long. It eventually ran out of coal at the 9-10 hour mark after starting with a full load and trying to keep it around 250. I did some standard grilling Saturday and it also burned up much quicker than I am used to. I don't get too hung up on large vs small pieces except the past two bags cooked much differently for me. I am happy to hear that it was just my bad luck and I should be good for the future.

stlcharcoal · March 2017

Jclayto said:

Good info everyone. I attempted an all nighter last weekend with the RO small pieces and had temp issues all night long. It eventually ran out of coal at the 9-10 hour mark after starting with a full load and trying to keep it around 250. I did some standard grilling Saturday and it also burned up much quicker than I am used to. I don't get too hung up on large vs small pieces except the past two bags cooked much differently for me. I am happy to hear that it was just my bad luck and I should be good for the future.

The size of the chunks have no effect on how fast they burn if you're metering the air going to them (via draft door and daisy wheel.) 10# of charcoal has the same amount of BTUs regardless if it the size of pea gravel or one giant block. If it's at 250F constant, it's going to burn BTUs at a constant rate. The only way it can burn faster is to go through BTUs faster, thus higher temp.

lousubcap · March 2017

@jclayto - Welcome aboard and enjoy the journey.
When you say full load-are you talking all the way to the top of the fire ring or fire box? If you load to the top of the ring (allowing for the placement of your heat deflector) you about double the lump load from the top of the fire box. That's how you get the long duration tun times on L&S cooks. FWIW-

jtcBoynton · March 2017

I recently measured it in my large egg. The fire box was about a 1/3 load. Of course measuring lump by volume varies a lot.

Jeepster47 · March 2017

@Jclayto ... last winter I was bored, so measured (by weight) the fill levels for Rockwood in a large egg. To the top of the KAB was 3 lbs; to the top of the fire bowl took a total of 5 lbs; and a fill to the bottom of the notches in the fire ring took a total of 10 lbs.

It takes about 1/3 of a lb to bring the egg up to 250 degrees ... and the fire will go out with about 1-1/3 lbs of unburned lump left in the egg. The egg burns about 1/3 lb per hour to keep the egg at 250 degrees. Thus, to achieve a 10 hour cook, you must have had about 5 lbs (1/3 lb start up + 10/3 lb maintaining 250 degrees for ten hours + 1-1/3 lb when the fire went out) of lump in the egg. That's a fill to the top of the fire bowl ... you need more lump.

RRP · March 2017

Jeepster47 said:

@Jclayto ... last winter I was bored, so measured (by weight) the fill levels for Rockwood in a large egg. To the top of the KAB was 3 lbs; to the top of the fire bowl took a total of 5 lbs; and a fill to the bottom of the notches in the fire ring took a total of 10 lbs.

It takes about 1/3 of a lb to bring the egg up to 250 degrees ... and the fire will go out with about 1-1/3 lbs of unburned lump left in the egg. The egg burns about 1/3 lb per hour to keep the egg at 250 degrees. Thus, to achieve a 10 hour cook, you must have had about 5 lbs (1/3 lb start up + 10/3 lb maintaining 250 degrees for ten hours + 1-1/3 lb when the fire went out) of lump in the egg. That's a fill to the top of the fire bowl ... you need more lump.

No wonder CAT misses you!

Just pulling your chain Mr CAT Engineer! I'll miss you living near here as well.

Jeepster47 · March 2017

@RRP ... 35 days until the moving van pulls away!

HeavyG · March 2017

WeberWho said:

RRP said:

"rebagged"? don't think so...it is made by RO for them. RO also produces private label bags for other companies, buy not a rebagging effort.

Your thinking to hard RRP. It's obviously not rebagged but I think you get my point

I dunno....I think i've seen 60 Minutes do an expose where they actually filmed people ripping open Royal Oak bags and pouring the contents into BGE bags.

HeavyG · March 2017

stlcharcoal said:

bhedges1987 said:

SBGonzo said:

My last bag of Rockwood was the same way...all little pieces at the bottom.

Every bag of rock wood is like that for me. I see no difference in the pieces, only in the initial start up to burn off the bad smells.

Any bag of [true] charcoal should be like this, if it hasn't been delivered to the store on a pillow by cherubs. Charcoal, that is properly kilned, is very brittle and is going to break down by merely moving it around. I would wager that any bag that does not have fines in the bottom is "charred wood", not "charcoal". If it's not breaking down from bagging, pillarization, shipping, handling, etc, then it's still wood.

I don't get how people have been buying chips, cereals, crackers, etc for decades and no one says a word about the little broken pieces or dust......they throw it away because it's the norm. But how did lump charcoal ever get elevated to the expectation that is NOT the norm. My only guess is briquettes--you don't really see that much damage in a briquette bag since they're pressed together. Or course, there's very little charcoal in "charcoal briquettes" anymore......not good marketing to call them "coal fly ash & limestone briquettes" I suppose.

If there are just some little pieces and dust in my cereals, chips, and crackers I don't get upset but if there are CLUMPS in them then whoa!...right into the trash!

RRP · March 2017

Jeepster47 said:

@RRP ... 35 days until the moving van pulls away!

I'd hope I'd at least get an invitation to your going away party! Bet anything that there are more of us non close "friends" out here than you might think who will miss you. Of course I never met the Mrs! Bet even the boys at Lindy's will wonder who will keep them current on BGE "things"! Remember - you introduced them to Red Mud BBQ sauce let alone making them a ROCKWOOD dealer! Take care Mr Tom!

da87 · March 2017

Filled the large to the bottom of the plate setter notches with Rockwood for brisket.

19 hours of cook time plus 1 hour warm up. Went to set up for tonight's lamb burgers and had this much (full KAB) left:

bgebrent · March 2017

Just in, RO is now sourced in Russia. Could RO mulberry be in question?

Jeepster47 · March 2017

da87 said:

Filled the large to the bottom of the plate setter notches with Rockwood for brisket.

19 hours of cook time plus 1 hour warm up. Went to set up for tonight's lamb burgers and had this much (full KAB) left:

1/3 pound to start, 19/3 pounds to cook, and a little bit to shut the egg down ... call it seven pounds for the cook from cold-to-cold.

Looks like you started with close to a ten pound fill. Ten pounds minus the seven pound cook leaves three pounds in the KAB ... exactly what it takes to fill the KAB. Damn, I love it when the ledgers balance!!!

PS ... you could have easily continued your low-n-slow for another five hours.

da87 · March 2017

@Jeepster47, been egging for almost a year after 30+ years of Weber kettles and gas grills - still amazed at the length of a cook the Egg delivers. As you said, could have easily gone to the 24 hour mark without any lump refill. Not as young as I once was; that would be a long time to maintain brown liquor consumption....

Jclayto · March 2017

da87 - the cook time is amazing. My record is 20 hours and still had some lump left when I shut it down.

Interesting info regarding BTU. Makes sense now that you mention it.

My non scientific observation is this -

I can routinely run an all night 10+ hour very stable smoke at 250 when using a good mix of lump sizes and filling to the top of the fire bowl, making sure that the holes are clear and all previous ash removed. At the end of the cook there is more than enough lump left and I always wish I had started with less but always worried about running out over night. As mentioned above, I once ran a 10 lb butt all night, pulled it mix next morning, ran 2 hours of chicken wings for lunch and then decided to smoke some additional food after lunch for lunches the coming week. Total time was about 20 hours with a little left when I shut down.

Last weekend using the busted up small pieces I lit the grill at 8 pm, let it stabilize hold for a while before I placed my butt on at 10pm. I had my wireless maverick set to alarm at a low grate temp of 200 and a high of 300 and went to bed. I woke up to the maverick alarming low temp at 4am. I went out side expecting that the lump was trying to burn out for some reason or another. I sat the grate and butt off and lifted the plate setter to find the grill all but empty of lump rather than mostly full of unlit coal as I expected. No idea what happened but I refilled half way and finished the smoke with good food so thats all that mattered. I suppose it's possible that the grill surged over night and burned off all the coal with me sleeping through the high temp alarm but the pork temp and condition did not indicate that to be the case.

Royal Oak - change in quality?

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