My Neighbor drives me crazy

No way. I personally cook to 195 minimum. The rest of the collagen doesn't break down until you get to the higher temps and that process is what makes it taste so good. Plus, it's impossible to pull at that internal temperature. Just keep doing what you're doing Crunk!

I take mine off the Egg at 190 and after a two hour rest wrapped in towels and stowed in a cooler.  When I pull the meat it falls off the bone and comes apart but is not mushy.  If you wait until 200 it gets too mushy in my opinion.

Any feedback is appreicated...I want to get as much "ammo" as i can to be able to convince him to let that Pork cook longer.

Thanks in advance....

If he has a brain between his two ears he is probably reading this thread and saying hey I had that discussion 2 days ago, must be me,

I'd approach the argument this way. Different cuts of meat have different properties.

For instance, steaks are naturally tender. The muscle didn't work hard enough to have lots of connective tissue in it. Usually they are cooked just enough to brown the outside, leaving the juicy inside red or pink. On the other hand, there are parts like shanks that have so much tendon and hard worked muscle that they usually need a long slow braise to be edible.

Pork butts have many different muscles. They are bound together by connective tissue, most of which is collagen. There's also a lot of fat.

With heat and time, collagen turns to gelatin (a perfectly fine kind of protein, as good as muscle proteins) and the fat tissue breaks down into oil. At the same time, the muscle is loosing water. At some point, most of it will cook out.

Collagen break down starts quite low, about 133F if I recall correctly. Fat renders at a slightly higher temperature. But both processes are verrrrry slowwww at that temperature. With added temperature, the speed picks up, and around 180, the conversion to gel and rendering are going quite quickly. There could be the same break down if the meat was held at 165 long enough. Might be possible to do on an Egg, although I don't recall anyone doing that.

Assuming the butt is cooked to just 165, it will certainly be less tender. It will be less succulent because there is not as much gel, and it will not feel as smooth in the mouth because it has not been basted in its own broken down fat. Also, the fat helps convey flavor, and by itself, pig fat can have a very good flavor. Without the broken down fat, there will be less flavor.

There may also be another improvement. The improved flavors from maillard reactions and caramelizing require some higher temperature air. As long as the meat doesn't become dessicated, and burnt, the longer and hotter the air its in, the better for browning.

From the perspective of wanting a finished product that is tender, succulent, and flavorful, cooking a butt till it is pullable is the best method. Its is certainly edible at 165, and is well used sliced. Its just not at its peak.

For a big hunk of pork like a loin or ham, one can go as low as 145. There's not enough connective tissue to compensate for moisture loss. 165 used to be recommended for safety purposes, but all the pork raised and sold in the U.S. has been produced is clean enough, unless it has been ground, that there is no safety reason for the higher temperature.

Yea if he is convinced, I'd say the only real way to convince him otherwise is a cook-off.....And at that point there will be no comparison between the two.

Cook off, but to be fair you should agree to use the same rub, temp cooked at, mustard slather or not. Try and keep all the variables the same, except the temp cooked to. You might even go so far as to cook them on the same egg so that they are over the same charcoal and wood for smoke. The only variable you want to change is temp cooked to. I think that was the scientist in me speaking out for a bit.

@Griffin, good point on minimizing the variables.

So if he is pulling the butt at 165, Im wondering if he is just doing that because of the stall?  But he will not have pulled pork, but chopped pork because it will not have broken all the way down. But like fishlessman stated chopped pork is just as good. But we all know 195 is key to great pork!

He'd almost have to pull a Fargo and run the pork through the wood chipper to pull it at 165...

I think there are many unkowns in this equation.  1.  Is the dome thermometer calibrated correctly.  2.  What is the cook time of the meat.  3. Is it over a liquid filled drip pan or not. I believe as a few have stated that if he is keeping his pit temp legitimately low for an extended period of time that the tenderness could be fine at a lower internal temperature.  The only real way to find out is to do a cookoff and have a judge at both places documenting the methods, times and temps after calibrating both dome thermometers at the same time.  If you force them to start and finish at the same time like a contest, I believe the higher internal temp will be better but with unlimited time I am not sure.

COOK OFF!  Hey sounds fun, if you like the guy.

I say let him do whatever the @#!*% he wants and continue driving you crazy by undercooking his meat, rather than driving you crazy by leaving his @&$@ing barking dogs out all @#!*% night like mine does.

Or telling your 11 year old kid they are going to hell because they read Harry Potter books and trick or treat on Halloween like mine. Gimme a dude with an egg and some under cooked pork, PLEASE!

Cen-tex Your neighbor sounds like a good candidate for a flaming bag on the front porch.

She is certifiably nuts so I give her a wide berth. I did tell her to keep her thoughts about my kid's afterlife to herself.

@nolaegghead isn't the BGE magical? Mine is!

Hilarious.  I've had crazy neighbors, but none that nuts.  You should buy a bunch of roman candles and set them off at midnight on whatever her apocalypse date is...probably (performing quick rapture search...) Dec 21st.

Fortunately, I don't believe in magic myself, but respect everyone's freedom to be as crazy as they want to be, as long as that crazy stays away from my personal space.

I'm not even scratching the surface but I'm trying to remain somewhat respectful to many and not hijack this thread. One day I'll fill you all in but it's nuts.....