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Here's a quick FTC tip for ya...

Greetings friends. Happy Mother's Day. When I FTC, I preheat my cooler and use warm towels to extend the rest as far as possible, if I need it. But how far CAN I go?? Now I know. I LEAVE THE MAVERICK MEAT PROBE IN. Simple check of the wireless reciever tells me I am well outside te danger zone, and no one I'm feeding gets poisoned. The grate probe goes in outside tenit Give it a try. Side benefit - people who see it think it's cool. :) Happy and healthy Mother's Day to you all, my friends 8-Damien image
Large BGE and Medium BGE
36" Blackstone - Greensboro!


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Comments

  • The Naked WhizThe Naked Whiz Posts: 7,780
    The Naked Whiz
  • sylsyl Posts: 16
    Good idea. But you preheat the cooler how?
  • Hi54puttyHi54putty Posts: 1,872
    syl said:

    Good idea. But you preheat the cooler how?

    Probably hot water
    XL,L,S 
    Winston-Salem, NC 
  • ZmokinZmokin Posts: 1,937
    Hi54putty said:
    Good idea. But you preheat the cooler how?
    Probably hot water
    Exactly
    Large BGE in a Sole' Gourmet Table
    Using the Black Cast Iron grill, Plate Setter,
     and a BBQ Guru temp controller.

    Medium BGE in custom modified off-road nest.
    Black Cast Iron grill, Plate Setter, and a Party-Q temp controller.

    Location: somewhere West of the Mason-Dixon Line
  • SkiddymarkerSkiddymarker Posts: 8,307
    Another post here this morning talked about free heat - using the residual heat in the ceramic to bake with after you snuff the egg. 
    A Weber friend tosses a couple of fire bricks in his kettle for the last hour or two while the butt or brisket is cooking. These hot bricks can be towel wrapped and dropped into the bottom of a cooler to help keep it warm. 
    Delta B.C. - Move over coffee, this is job for alcohol!
  • lousubcaplousubcap Posts: 16,494
    And another option to eggstend the FTC duration-leave the cooler in the sun.  And since it's Mother's Day-last week I had the cooler in the sun for a couple of hours before FTC, then left it in the sun (outside ambient temp was a good 10-15*F warmer than the house) SWMBo sees it out there "Why are you leaving the cooler in the sun?"  Sometimes you just have to "declare victory and move on".  
    Louisville;  L & S BGEs, PBC, Lang 36; Burnin' wood in the neighbourhood. # 38 for the win.  Life is too short for light/lite beer.  
  • MaskedMarvelMaskedMarvel Posts: 1,957
    First off sorry for stupid vanilla resetting my formatting. I know that post ended up hard to read.

    I like the hot water idea. I use hot towels and then cycle new hot towels straight from the dryer.

    In two hours, and a windy drive to Raleigh, my temps is at 185 internal, 122 grate. Can't beat this!!
    Large BGE and Medium BGE
    36" Blackstone - Greensboro!


  • nolaeggheadnolaegghead Posts: 26,382
    I have that same Engel dry box and it has a huge advantage over your run-of-the-mill coolers - it's air tight.  Most of the heat leaks out of a cooler through the air.  The gasket on the Engel and high end coolers plays a big part in keeping the contents hot or cold.  Also, don't open it if you don't have to.
    ______________________________________________
    This is my signature line just so you're not confused.  Love me or hate me, I am forum Marmite.
    Large and Medium BGE, Kamado Joe Jr, Akorn Jr, smoker with a 5k btu AC, gas grill, fire pit, pack of angry cats, two turntables and a microphone, my friend.  Registered republican.
    New Orleans, LA - we know how to eat 

  • Carolina QCarolina Q Posts: 12,872
    edited May 2014
    ...my temps is at 185 internal, 122 grate. 
    It seems to me that the INSIDE of a hunk of meat (your 185°) is not the issue. It has never seen the light of day and in less likely to be affected by "danger zone" bacterial growth issues anyway. The OUTSIDE is another matter and would be what I would keep an eye on. Your outside meat temp was at 122° which is in the danger zone. When it reaches 140°, you have two hours to eat or refrigerate. If the ambient temp is above 90°, you have only ONE hour. What's the ambient inside that cooler?

    I could be wrong as that has happened before. Rebuttals welcome. 
    :D

    I hate it when I go to the kitchen for food and all I find are ingredients!

                                                                …Unknown

    Michael 
    Central Connecticut 

  • nolaeggheadnolaegghead Posts: 26,382
    edited May 2014
    That under 140F "danger zone!" guideline is one of those "error on the side of caution/one size fits all" rules that, in this case, is often over thought out, and IMHO, makes people paranoid and throw good food out. 

    In this case, you have a giant chunk of meat that has been completely pasteurized through heat, and you have a surface with salt, sugar, smoke and probably several thousand by-products of the cooking/smoking process that have been used as preservatives long before we had refrigeration or the FDA.

    This hunk of pasteurized meat is wrapped up, I assume, in new foil and is in a cooler which gives it some protection from the environment.  What is going to get inside the meat and cause it to poison you after 4 hours?  And what is going to flourish on the outside with all the salt and sugar, in an environment inhospitable to bacteria?  Nothing in 4 hours.  Probably nothing in 12 hours, and probably, whatever eventually does settle and start a family, it isn't going to be one of the bad organisms that came from the animal in raw meat.
    ______________________________________________
    This is my signature line just so you're not confused.  Love me or hate me, I am forum Marmite.
    Large and Medium BGE, Kamado Joe Jr, Akorn Jr, smoker with a 5k btu AC, gas grill, fire pit, pack of angry cats, two turntables and a microphone, my friend.  Registered republican.
    New Orleans, LA - we know how to eat 

  • MaskedMarvelMaskedMarvel Posts: 1,957
    edited May 2014



    ...my temps is at 185 internal, 122 grate. 

    It seems to me that the INSIDE of a hunk of meat (your 185°) is not the issue. It has never seen the light of day and in less likely to be affected by "danger zone" bacterial growth issues anyway. The OUTSIDE is another matter and would be what I would keep an eye on. Your outside meat temp was at 122° which is in the danger zone. When it reaches 140°, you have two hours to eat or refrigerate. If the ambient temp is above 90°, you have only ONE hour. What's the ambient inside that cooler?

    I could be wrong as that has happened before. Rebuttals welcome. 
    :D


    BEGIN REPLY--->


    Interesting. From now on, I'll try and wrap the meat with the probe inside and with the formerly grate probe laying against the outside to try and gauge the surface temp.

    I do guess the outside temp and inside temps will be fairly close, as the piece of meat has heat transferring FROM the insde out. That energy has to keep the outside warm enough, right?

    EDIT ---> vanilla really needs to fix this ongoing formatting issue
    Large BGE and Medium BGE
    36" Blackstone - Greensboro!


  • nolaeggheadnolaegghead Posts: 26,382
    FTC is not for safety as much we think - we like to eat our food warm.  If you put that butt in the fridge with the probe in it, it'll spend hours between 140 and 40F.  Warming it up, the same story.
    ______________________________________________
    This is my signature line just so you're not confused.  Love me or hate me, I am forum Marmite.
    Large and Medium BGE, Kamado Joe Jr, Akorn Jr, smoker with a 5k btu AC, gas grill, fire pit, pack of angry cats, two turntables and a microphone, my friend.  Registered republican.
    New Orleans, LA - we know how to eat 

  • MaskedMarvelMaskedMarvel Posts: 1,957
    I agree Nola. And the rest period some
    Meats benefit from.
    Large BGE and Medium BGE
    36" Blackstone - Greensboro!


  • SenecaTheYoungerSenecaTheYounger Posts: 368
    edited May 2014
    If you are concerned with food safety, internal temperature isn't what's important here, because the external temperature will be below 140 before the internal is. And where would the bacteria be which we are worried about?

    I don't worry anyway. I'm not sure what zombie bacteria would be left to come alive when the temperature dropped back into the danger zone. It's not the same as food served in a buffet that has been handled and coughed over and risking contamination.

    Taken to 200, wrapped in foil, and tossed into a cooler. Where's the risk? Unless typhoid Mary is the one wrapping it in foil taken from a dumpster, I'm thinking we're fine.
    -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Copia ciborum subtilitas impeditur

    Seneca Falls, NY

  • DMWDMW Posts: 12,314
    +1 on @SenecaTheYounger‌ The danger zone applies to exterior temp the same as interior temp. But the meat you prepare and handle is probably better handled by several orders of magnitude vs what you eat is restaurant.
    My Facebook Page where I document my cooking
    Morgantown, PA

    XL BGE - S BGE - KJ Jr - HB Legacy - BS Pizza Oven - 30" Firepit - King Kooker Fryer -  PR72T - 18.5" WSM - WSJ - BS 17" Griddle - XXL BGE - Akron Jr - BS SS36" Griddle
  • gdenbygdenby Posts: 5,873
    The safety guidelines are very cautious. They assume the worst. Human beings are staph carriers, and contamination must be assumed. Not all thermometer readings are accurate. Etc.

    The big problem with the guidelines is that the older ones that everyone has heard are to simplified. Not to oversimplify myself...  Yes, pathogens are growing above 40F, and will be sitting as "zombies" above around 125. But the growth rate is very very low around 40, and minimal around 125. 90 - 110F is really hazardous. Growth rates are 6 - 8 times faster than at the low and high end of the zone.

    But here's a good one. If you've taken antibiotics recently, so many of the "good" bugs in the intestines have died, that a very small amount of ingested "bad" bugs will flourish, and just a trace of pathogens will cause food poisoning. So, take care.
  • nolaeggheadnolaegghead Posts: 26,382

    gdenby said:

    But here's a good one. If you've taken antibiotics recently, so many of the "good" bugs in the intestines have died, that a very small amount of ingested "bad" bugs will flourish, and just a trace of pathogens will cause food poisoning. So, take care.
    That does happen.  Most bugs, like salmonella, die in the stomach from the acid.  So that's the first line of defense.  All that beneficial flora live in the intestines, like you said.  What I find interesting, is, this is a game of statistics.  Salmonella doesn't get you sick unless you ingest x-number of organisms.  Also, in the case of already cooked mood, you'll never get salmonella that was previously there, it's dead and salmonella come from live animals.  I suppose if you drained the juice from a bag of cut chicken on the cooked roast, you may have a problem.
    ______________________________________________
    This is my signature line just so you're not confused.  Love me or hate me, I am forum Marmite.
    Large and Medium BGE, Kamado Joe Jr, Akorn Jr, smoker with a 5k btu AC, gas grill, fire pit, pack of angry cats, two turntables and a microphone, my friend.  Registered republican.
    New Orleans, LA - we know how to eat 

  • The pathogens are on the meat though, not in the meat. And the surface is virtually pasteurized, sitting in a 250 environment for so many hours.

    The guidelines are conservative almost to the point of absurdity. Almost.

    There's a risk in everything, but your chances of dying on the ride home from the grocery store after buying a pork butt are far greater than your getting sick from six hour FTC butt that dipped into the 120s
    -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Copia ciborum subtilitas impeditur

    Seneca Falls, NY

  • nolaeggheadnolaegghead Posts: 26,382
    Indeed.
    ______________________________________________
    This is my signature line just so you're not confused.  Love me or hate me, I am forum Marmite.
    Large and Medium BGE, Kamado Joe Jr, Akorn Jr, smoker with a 5k btu AC, gas grill, fire pit, pack of angry cats, two turntables and a microphone, my friend.  Registered republican.
    New Orleans, LA - we know how to eat 

  • lousubcaplousubcap Posts: 16,494
    I would assess from the above that copious quantities of C2H5OH would take care of any food-handling and temperature wandering screw-ups, especially if consumed!  Have a great evening!
    Louisville;  L & S BGEs, PBC, Lang 36; Burnin' wood in the neighbourhood. # 38 for the win.  Life is too short for light/lite beer.  
  • nolaeggheadnolaegghead Posts: 26,382
    That's a mixed bag insofar as the antiseptic properties of the hooch.  And copious quantities of C2H5OH can have many of the same symptoms of food poisoning...but plenty of fun getting there ;)
    ______________________________________________
    This is my signature line just so you're not confused.  Love me or hate me, I am forum Marmite.
    Large and Medium BGE, Kamado Joe Jr, Akorn Jr, smoker with a 5k btu AC, gas grill, fire pit, pack of angry cats, two turntables and a microphone, my friend.  Registered republican.
    New Orleans, LA - we know how to eat 

  • Keep in mind one potential drawback of FTC...Carryover Cooking.
    Gittin' there...
  • ElCapitanElCapitan Posts: 154
    Good insight in this thread.  Thanks.
    XL Owner
  • Austin  EggheadAustin Egghead Posts: 3,904
    Large, small and mini now Egging in Rowlett Tx
  • The Naked WhizThe Naked Whiz Posts: 7,780
    Keep in mind one potential drawback of FTC...Carryover Cooking.
    I don't think that's an issue.  As you can see from the graph, the temperature constantly declines.  It was probably in the cooler within 10 minutes of taking it off the cooker, so no real difference in the amount of any potential carryover between that and taking it inside to pull it.

    image
    The Naked Whiz
  • FearlessTheEggNoobFearlessTheEggNoob Posts: 755
    edited May 2014
    Dang. Everything I wrote got deleted by a forum glitch.

    I'm too tired to type tat out again.
    Gittin' there...
  • nolaeggheadnolaegghead Posts: 26,382
    Keep in mind one potential drawback of FTC...Carryover Cooking.
    I don't think that's an issue.  As you can see from the graph, the temperature constantly declines.  It was probably in the cooler within 10 minutes of taking it off the cooker, so no real difference in the amount of any potential carryover between that and taking it inside to pull it.

    image
    Whiz, the cooking on the way up in temperature breaks down collagen and it continues on the way down.  I've cooked brisket at 145F in SV until it most of the connective tissue broke down.  I can't help but think because the temperature is decreasing, the same reactions from cooking aren't arrested. 
    ______________________________________________
    This is my signature line just so you're not confused.  Love me or hate me, I am forum Marmite.
    Large and Medium BGE, Kamado Joe Jr, Akorn Jr, smoker with a 5k btu AC, gas grill, fire pit, pack of angry cats, two turntables and a microphone, my friend.  Registered republican.
    New Orleans, LA - we know how to eat 

  • Little StevenLittle Steven Posts: 28,817
    I don't understand why people use towels?

    Steve 

    Caledon, ON

     

  • nolaeggheadnolaegghead Posts: 26,382
    I don't understand why people use towels?
    I don't anymore.  The towel is a horror show to wash.   Thanks for understanding me.  Foil, cooler. FC.
    ______________________________________________
    This is my signature line just so you're not confused.  Love me or hate me, I am forum Marmite.
    Large and Medium BGE, Kamado Joe Jr, Akorn Jr, smoker with a 5k btu AC, gas grill, fire pit, pack of angry cats, two turntables and a microphone, my friend.  Registered republican.
    New Orleans, LA - we know how to eat 

  • Little StevenLittle Steven Posts: 28,817
    You probably know the heat absorption rate of cotton, I don't. Seems it would be lower than air no?

    Steve 

    Caledon, ON

     

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