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Kamados at my local grill dealer

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  • Jeremiah
    Jeremiah Posts: 6,412
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    Slumming it in Aiken, SC. 
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  • lousubcap
    lousubcap Posts: 32,378
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    The public's perception defines the relative value of innovation.  But the fact that you can offer differences and leverage them in advertising provides value to the buyer.  A first-time buyer will value different things at different price points but if you are "convinced" that you need a certain feature and one brand has it and another doesn't (forget the after-market) guess who wins.

    Louisville; Rolling smoke in the neighbourhood. # 38 for the win.  Life is too short for light/lite beer!  Seems I'm livin in a transitional period.
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  • bigalsworth
    bigalsworth Posts: 685
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    pgprescott said:
    bgebrent said:
    stlcharcoal said:
    Jeremiah said:
    @stlcharcoal I agree completely but the fact that it's BGE getting kicked to the curb vs the other guys says something too. 

    Yeah, I get that.  For me, it was still an easy decision which one to choose for our little store......BGE.  Among brand loyalty and other reasons, I'm surely not going to sell a brand that the manufacturer is going to undercut me big time on at the local Costco's several times a year.  Dealer support is just as important as customer support, and I have no worries or qualms about that (despite what some ex-BGE dealers are claiming). 
    I think your right and appreciate your insights.  Still, BGE has shown no sign to their loyal consumers that their interested in innovation and progress.  Not smart.  I've been loyal for a while.  I'd look both ways in the future due to the lack of innovation/accessories.  Product quality, accessories available and economics rule the day.
    The innovations are grossly overstated. I love the simplicity of the egg as it's sold. You can do almost anything with a PS, ash tool, and grid lifter. Everything else is gingerbread. I appreciate much of the extras, but virtually all of this is born out of the egg and the egghead community.
      The KJ rotis is an eggheads item they purchased. Great, but ho hum. The divide and conquer is a riff on the AR and the primo setup. The top is a nice and cleaver riff on the SW cap. And the hinge / latch / gasket , are toatally non issues as far as I am concerned. I like all these things to some degree, but none of them really makes a big difference. If you like the divide and conquer you should have purchased a primo oval. If you like the hinge and gasket combo, the Weber has that. It's what Ed Fisher created in a community and the "Egghead" itself that makes the egg great. The Egg is The Egg and all others simply are not. That said, enjoy whatever you like. 
    All of that is true but the average consumer will see more value with the KJ I believe.  I have spent extra money on all the little things that aren't necessary but nice to  have, it would have been nice to have it all from the get go. Also being Canadian I have to account for $ difference as well as expensive shipping. Having said that if the new KJ costs the same as the egg with all the add-ins I'd go green again, I prefer the ceramic grill stores products, I have several.  I also like the smokeware cap.  I would also like to support the people who have actually done the innovating.  I don't think KJ can use the word actually since they really haven't innovated anything.
      
    In reality though, based on where I live the KJ will likely be better cost wise.  It is expensive for me to get those things, I bought all my accessories when the $ was at parity, the adjustable rig is $250 Canadian and when I priced it out a long time ago it was like $100 US just for shipping, shipping could be cheaper now.  The smokeware cap cost me like $70 with shipping.  My egg with side tables and nest was around $1400, so that comes out to about $1900.  The KJ is $1299 right now, if it goes up $200-300 I'd still be ahead.

    I realize a lot of it has to do with my market, but it goes for much of Canada I'd say, except maybe southern Ontario or Vancouver area.
    Large BGE
    BBQ Guru DigiQ II

    Martensville, Saskatchewan Canada
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  • DaveRichardson
    DaveRichardson Posts: 2,324
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    Bobby (AKA KJ Head Honcho) enjoys the banter.  He's proud that his company is making headway.  I can't blame him for that.  The newer models wit the funky hinge and new and improved lifetime gasket will run a could hundo more to each unit out the door.

    BGE's policy is their policy.  If the dealer doesn't like it, that's for them to figure it out.  Jonathan @ said it best; why would he be the one to stock and maintain items that the "Mothership" would come in an undercut him 1-2 times a year at a retailer that provides NO service or support or knowledge of the product other than the sales rep that is there hocking the goods.


    LBGE #19 from North GA Eggfest, 2014

    Stockbridge, GA - just south of Atlanta where we are covered up in Zombies!  #TheWalkingDead films practically next door!

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  • GrateEggspectations
    GrateEggspectations Posts: 9,294
    edited March 2017
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    pgprescott said:
    bgebrent said:
    stlcharcoal said:
    Jeremiah said:
    @stlcharcoal I agree completely but the fact that it's BGE getting kicked to the curb vs the other guys says something too. 

    Yeah, I get that.  For me, it was still an easy decision which one to choose for our little store......BGE.  Among brand loyalty and other reasons, I'm surely not going to sell a brand that the manufacturer is going to undercut me big time on at the local Costco's several times a year.  Dealer support is just as important as customer support, and I have no worries or qualms about that (despite what some ex-BGE dealers are claiming). 
    I think your right and appreciate your insights.  Still, BGE has shown no sign to their loyal consumers that their interested in innovation and progress.  Not smart.  I've been loyal for a while.  I'd look both ways in the future due to the lack of innovation/accessories.  Product quality, accessories available and economics rule the day.
    The innovations are grossly overstated. I love the simplicity of the egg as it's sold. You can do almost anything with a PS, ash tool, and grid lifter. Everything else is gingerbread. I appreciate much of the extras, but virtually all of this is born out of the egg and the egghead community.
      The KJ rotis is an eggheads item they purchased. Great, but ho hum. The divide and conquer is a riff on the AR and the primo setup. The top is a nice and cleaver riff on the SW cap. And the hinge / latch / gasket , are toatally non issues as far as I am concerned. I like all these things to some degree, but none of them really makes a big difference. If you like the divide and conquer you should have purchased a primo oval. If you like the hinge and gasket combo, the Weber has that. It's what Ed Fisher created in a community and the "Egghead" itself that makes the egg great. The Egg is The Egg and all others simply are not. That said, enjoy whatever you like. 
    Though there is not much to disagree with in this statement, I will say that, as a consumer, it is simply quite hard to swallow that for the price I pay for a Large Egg alone, the competitor includes all of the "gingerbread" at no cost (including much of the innovation since the Egg's original design). Once you factor in the accessories, you are paying an additional 50% minimum for the BGE (at least in my area). Mighty hard to justify, from my perspective.
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  • Focker
    Focker Posts: 8,364
    edited March 2017
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    The majority of peeps don't impulse buy a thousand dollar plus grill.

    They will surf the net, and see them side-by-side.  There really is no comparison.  
    If someone in my circle wanted a ceramic, I would honestly advise them to give KJ a serious look.
     
    As stated, at the end of the day, it's all about bang for your buck.  KJ is crushing it.  Unless you want plastic BGE corn holders that are $10 more than regular ones.  The average Joe will see through that BS.

    In due time, this not only impacts BGE, but good dealers, and guys like Tom, Matt, who have done the innovating.  Even Ron is gonna take a hit.   =)

    A gasket change used to be a rite of passage...not anymore.

    Brandon
    Quad Cities
    "If yer gonna denigrate, familiarity with the subject is helpful."

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  • Whirly
    Whirly Posts: 30
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    Does everyone actually believe all kamados are made from identical materials? Look past the superficial and open your eyes to the quality of materials used and how they are manufactured . The crows will come home to roost. 
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  • bgebrent
    bgebrent Posts: 19,636
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    Whirly said:
    Does everyone actually believe all kamados are made from identical materials? Look past the superficial and open your eyes to the quality of materials used and how they are manufactured . The crows will come home to roost. 
    We're not dumb or blind brother.  Specify your point.  Materials, thermodynamics, etc...  Educate us all.
    Sandy Springs & Dawsonville Ga
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  • stlcharcoal
    stlcharcoal Posts: 4,684
    edited March 2017
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    As a consumer, I think it comes down to color.......you like green, red, or black??  Buy the brand accordingly. 

    When is BGE ever going to dump the green color?!?!?!  It's so yesterday for kamado's.  :lol:

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  • Ozzie_Isaac
    Ozzie_Isaac Posts: 19,087
    edited March 2017
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    HeavyG said:
    Over on The Facebook there is a KJ users group and I noticed that the prez of KJ made a post a short time ago referencing this thread. Oddly I didn't see any specific mention of ACE stores going "Green" in this thread but perhaps that was mentioned in a different thread in this forum. He did call BGE the "Blackberry of the category" as @bigalsworth mentioned.

    I would have just posted a link but the Facebook group is one you have to ask to join and ain't nobody got time for that so here's a screensnap:




    Wow.  Ok, when a Prez steps in like that and tweets a quick insult, my immediate thought is "nope".  He is like the Trump of Kamadoes.
    A bison’s level of aggressiveness, both physical and passive, is legendary. - NPS
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  • bgebrent
    bgebrent Posts: 19,636
    edited March 2017
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    stlcharcoal said:
    As a consumer, I think it comes down to color.......you like green, red, or black??  Buy the brand accordingly. 

    When is BGE ever going to dump the green color?!?!?!  It's so yesterday for kamado's.  :lol:

    Now I'm really confused.  I'm red-green color deficient, in all seriousness.  Maybe I just have to get a Primo =)
    Sandy Springs & Dawsonville Ga
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  • Ozzie_Isaac
    Ozzie_Isaac Posts: 19,087
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    bgebrent said:9
    stlcharcoal said:
    As a consumer, I think it comes down to color.......you like green, red, or black??  Buy the brand accordingly. 

    When is BGE ever going to dump the green color?!?!?!  It's so yesterday for kamado's.  :lol:

    Now I'm really confused.  I'm red-green color deficient, in all seriousness.  Maybe I just have to get a Primo =)
    Do you need a safe place? ;)
    A bison’s level of aggressiveness, both physical and passive, is legendary. - NPS
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  • Hans61
    Hans61 Posts: 3,901
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    Had this happen early February - had a new base early march 
    “There are three rules that I live by: never get less than twelve hours sleep; never play cards with a guy who has the same first name as a city; and never get involved with a woman with a tattoo of a dagger on her body.”
    Coach Finstock Teen Wolf
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  • bgebrent
    bgebrent Posts: 19,636
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    Ozzie_Isaac said:
    bgebrent said:9
    stlcharcoal said:
    As a consumer, I think it comes down to color.......you like green, red, or black??  Buy the brand accordingly. 

    When is BGE ever going to dump the green color?!?!?!  It's so yesterday for kamado's.  :lol:

    Now I'm really confused.  I'm red-green color deficient, in all seriousness.  Maybe I just have to get a Primo =)
    Do you need a safe place? ;)
    LOL.  Can Nola provide that?
    Sandy Springs & Dawsonville Ga
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  • bigalsworth
    bigalsworth Posts: 685
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    @Whirly comes outta the woodwork again lol.  I agree @Ozzie_Isaac, the prez has got me rethinking a Joe jr, he seems like a super huge piece of dog $hit. 

    Large BGE
    BBQ Guru DigiQ II

    Martensville, Saskatchewan Canada
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  • stlcharcoal
    stlcharcoal Posts: 4,684
    edited March 2017
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    Focker said:

     Unless you want plastic BGE corn holders that are $10 more than regular ones.  

    Man, don't be ripping on the BGE corn holders.  Those are nice!  They're the only ones I've ever seen that plug into each other for easy storage.  Rubber soft grips, so if you hands get greasy you still have a good grip.  Seriously, they're only like $8 for a set of 8 of them.

    Yeah some of the stuff is just green for more money..........but for a busy guy that has the money to spend on the Egg (and maybe new to BBQ or fine cooking) what's an extra couple bucks to one-stop shop on quality items??  I thought I was going to have trouble finding 75 accessories for my silver level status, but it was pretty easy when I started going through them. 
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  • bgebrent
    bgebrent Posts: 19,636
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    Corn holders for the win!!  Just kidding @stlcharcoal.  Use your stuff exclusively because it's the best in my mind.  BGE, now just another premier Kamado.  Perhaps you could stand down a bit and recognize the obvious and then help BGE.  The Buffalo isn't reading this thread.  He should be.  I'm a huge fan.  BGE retail and support needs to up their game.  Disagree?
    Sandy Springs & Dawsonville Ga
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  • pgprescott
    pgprescott Posts: 14,544
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    I will also point out something less than obvious to most of you, you all are not the typical customer. You are the 1% ers. You likely don't view yourself this way, but trust me, you are. People assume their thought process and research and knowledge is shared by all. It isn't. Most of what we discuss here is nonsense to the prospective buyer. Not every buyer, but 90+%. 
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  • bgebrent
    bgebrent Posts: 19,636
    edited March 2017
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    pgprescott said:
    I will also point out something less than obvious to most of you, you all are not the typical customer. You are the 1% ers. You likely don't view yourself this way, but trust me, you are. People assume their thought process and research and knowledge is shared by all. It isn't. Most of what we discuss here is nonsense to the prospective buyer. Not every buyer, but 90+%. 
    Pete, what does that mean?  I knew I was in the 1% (jk).  How does your insight apply to bge v. kj?  Seems to me KJ is marketing and the green box is asleep.
    Sandy Springs & Dawsonville Ga
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  • Ozzie_Isaac
    Ozzie_Isaac Posts: 19,087
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    pgprescott said:
    I will also point out something less than obvious to most of you, you all are not the typical customer. You are the 1% ers. You likely don't view yourself this way, but trust me, you are. People assume their thought process and research and knowledge is shared by all. It isn't. Most of what we discuss here is nonsense to the prospective buyer. Not every buyer, but 90+%. 
    My thoughts exactly.  BGE has the brand recognition.  KJ still seems like the RTIC to me.

    Honestly guys, who believes Joe Public even knows how to use all the KJ gadgets?  I have a bunch of friends with BGEs and they are content to just grill on the fire ring.  Many are amazed by my FB posts and had no clue the BGE was so versatile.
    A bison’s level of aggressiveness, both physical and passive, is legendary. - NPS
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  • bgebrent
    bgebrent Posts: 19,636
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    Ozzie_Isaac said:
    pgprescott said:
    I will also point out something less than obvious to most of you, you all are not the typical customer. You are the 1% ers. You likely don't view yourself this way, but trust me, you are. People assume their thought process and research and knowledge is shared by all. It isn't. Most of what we discuss here is nonsense to the prospective buyer. Not every buyer, but 90+%. 
    My thoughts exactly.  BGE has the brand recognition.  KJ still seems like the RTIC to me.

    Honestly guys, who believes Joe Public even knows how to use all the KJ gadgets?  I have a bunch of friends with BGEs and they are content to just grill on the fire ring.  Many are amazed by my FB posts and had no clue the BGE was so versatile.
    And my roto molded cooler has RTIC on the top.
    Sandy Springs & Dawsonville Ga
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  • Ozzie_Isaac
    Ozzie_Isaac Posts: 19,087
    edited March 2017
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    bgebrent said:
    Ozzie_Isaac said:
    pgprescott said:
    I will also point out something less than obvious to most of you, you all are not the typical customer. You are the 1% ers. You likely don't view yourself this way, but trust me, you are. People assume their thought process and research and knowledge is shared by all. It isn't. Most of what we discuss here is nonsense to the prospective buyer. Not every buyer, but 90+%. 
    My thoughts exactly.  BGE has the brand recognition.  KJ still seems like the RTIC to me.

    Honestly guys, who believes Joe Public even knows how to use all the KJ gadgets?  I have a bunch of friends with BGEs and they are content to just grill on the fire ring.  Many are amazed by my FB posts and had no clue the BGE was so versatile.
    And my roto molded cooler has RTIC on the top.
    I guess thats a poor comparision.  I see a ton of RTIC cups at work too.  And they don't even bother to pretend to innovate.
    A bison’s level of aggressiveness, both physical and passive, is legendary. - NPS
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  • HeavyG
    HeavyG Posts: 10,349
    edited March 2017
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    bigalsworth said:
    @Whirly comes outta the woodwork again lol.  I agree @Ozzie_Isaac, the prez has got me rethinking a Joe jr, he seems like a super huge piece of dog $hit. 

    Geez...one funny/snarky little comment made amongst his audience and you jump to calling him a "super huge piece of dog $hit". That's pretty telling...about you.

    Say what you want about Brennan (and by all accounts I have read he is a great guy) but he certainly enjoys and is active in engaging with customers and soliciting their input and wanting to hear the good and bad. He is also willing to share info about what they are working on. Something which a lot of companies won't, or are very reluctant to, to talk about future products. 

    Perhaps some of the old timers here can correct me but I have never seen anyone from BGE officially talking about BGE products/plans/prototypes/etc. or answering questions or engaging with their customers in any way here or any other forum. 

    Maybe that's just a result of the different company cultures - one old company formed before the internet and one new 21st century company that embraces the internet and social media.

    That thread on Facebook spawned a lot of posts one of which I got a kick out of and I just know you'll really appreciate:



    In case you're not aware, Dennis is the owner of Komodo Kamados so now I guess you can not only not buy a KJ Jr. but also cancel your order for a 32" Big Bad. :)


    “Reality is that which, when you stop believing in it, doesn't go away.” ― Philip K. Diçk




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  • bgebrent
    bgebrent Posts: 19,636
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    Ozzie_Isaac said:
    bgebrent said:
    Ozzie_Isaac said:
    pgprescott said:
    I will also point out something less than obvious to most of you, you all are not the typical customer. You are the 1% ers. You likely don't view yourself this way, but trust me, you are. People assume their thought process and research and knowledge is shared by all. It isn't. Most of what we discuss here is nonsense to the prospective buyer. Not every buyer, but 90+%. 
    My thoughts exactly.  BGE has the brand recognition.  KJ still seems like the RTIC to me.

    Honestly guys, who believes Joe Public even knows how to use all the KJ gadgets?  I have a bunch of friends with BGEs and they are content to just grill on the fire ring.  Many are amazed by my FB posts and had no clue the BGE was so versatile.
    And my roto molded cooler has RTIC on the top.
    I guess thats a poor comparision.  I see a ton of RTIC cups at work too.  And they don't even bother to pretend to innovate.
    Same product for half the price, never been a smarter innovation.
    Sandy Springs & Dawsonville Ga
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  • chuckytheegghead
    chuckytheegghead Posts: 1,201
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    Pretty funny that Bobby has to troll here though because his forums are so inactive. But seriously which one of you guys is actually BB?
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  • Photo Egg
    Photo Egg Posts: 12,110
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    chuckytheegghead said:
    Pretty funny that Bobby has to troll here though because his forums are so inactive. But seriously which one of you guys is actually BB?
    That's real funny. Even BGE trolls this site and never uses their real name or position in their signature line. 
    Thank you,
    Darian

    Galveston Texas
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  • Focker
    Focker Posts: 8,364
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    The "Innovation and Customer Service Matters" movement.

    I think we need to take 3 days off work in protest, all wear green, take our eggs to DC, and have a fest at the Lincoln Monument.

    Brandon
    Quad Cities
    "If yer gonna denigrate, familiarity with the subject is helpful."

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  • da87
    da87 Posts: 640
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    Are the customer service issues limited to Canada or dealer by dealer?  LBGE fire ring broke into 2 pieces (noticed after a za cook), called dealer, they contacted BGE, and I picked up my replacement 1 week later - no follow up by me, no charge, no questions, and no hassle...  I can't comment on the innovation piece - during my pre-purchase research I found this forum and "lurked for a while, you guys sold my egg.
    Doug
    Wayne, PA
    LBGE, Weber Kettle (gifted to my sister), Weber Gasser

    "Two things are infinite:  the universe and human stupidity; and I'm not sure about the universe"   Albert Einstein
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  • GrateEggspectations
    GrateEggspectations Posts: 9,294
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    da87 said:
    Are the customer service issues limited to Canada or dealer by dealer?  LBGE fire ring broke into 2 pieces (noticed after a za cook), called dealer, they contacted BGE, and I picked up my replacement 1 week later - no follow up by me, no charge, no questions, and no hassle...  I can't comment on the innovation piece - during my pre-purchase research I found this forum and "lurked for a while, you guys sold my egg.
    I'm not sure, as I haven't had to make any claims. Perhaps another member can speak to this.
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