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OT: Do you still read a newspaper?

24

Comments

  • The paper here in Atlanta SUCKS!  I refer to it as The Al-Jazeera Journal of Constipation instead of the Atlanta Journal and Constitution.  Its not even worth lining the bird cage with it.

    LBGE #19 from North GA Eggfest, 2014

    Stockbridge, GA - just south of Atlanta where we are covered up in Zombies!  #TheWalkingDead films practically next door!

  • Theophan
    Theophan Posts: 2,654
    If you think today's press is doing a good job or even trying to do so, I wholeheartedly disagree. They are mostly left wing activists. By definition they should not be journalists. 
    I don't think it's all black-or-white -- there are sources with a clear right-leaning bias as well, of course, but I agree that overall there is a liberal bias in the news in our country, and I say that as a pretty liberal guy (I've always been registered Independent, because I don't agree with everything the Democrats or the Republicans say).

    But I also agree with this:
    There has never (read: NEVER) been a neutral source. ... If you have never thought someone on your 'opposition' made a good point, it's probably the voices in your echo chamber, not your human intelligence, that is running things for you.  

    The press in general has the right intention. Keep tabs on things, check power, spread ideas (editorial side).  It is a bad thing to assume they are always correct, or that they are always evil.
    I read the local paper every morning, but I also check news on online sites.  Google News, Apple News, even <gasp> the NY Times, though it's very liberal-leaning.  I used to mostly use CNN's website, but it went from a fairly unbiased news site many years ago to something too much like People magazine -- too much lurid click bait about which Hollywood people were cheating with whom, or which Kardashians were wearing practically nothing on which red carpet, etc..  That's actually when I started reading the NY Times -- at least they don't spew that kind of nonsense at me.
  • pgprescott
    pgprescott Posts: 14,544
    Theophan said:
    If you think today's press is doing a good job or even trying to do so, I wholeheartedly disagree. They are mostly left wing activists. By definition they should not be journalists. 
    I don't think it's all black-or-white -- there are sources with a clear right-leaning bias as well, of course, but I agree that overall there is a liberal bias in the news in our country, and I say that as a pretty liberal guy (I've always been registered Independent, because I don't agree with everything the Democrats or the Republicans say).

    But I also agree with this:
    There has never (read: NEVER) been a neutral source. ... If you have never thought someone on your 'opposition' made a good point, it's probably the voices in your echo chamber, not your human intelligence, that is running things for you.  

    The press in general has the right intention. Keep tabs on things, check power, spread ideas (editorial side).  It is a bad thing to assume they are always correct, or that they are always evil.
    I read the local paper every morning, but I also check news on online sites.  Google News, Apple News, even <gasp> the NY Times, though it's very liberal-leaning.  I used to mostly use CNN's website, but it went from a fairly unbiased news site many years ago to something too much like People magazine -- too much lurid click bait about which Hollywood people were cheating with whom, or which Kardashians were wearing practically nothing on which red carpet, etc..  That's actually when I started reading the NY Times -- at least they don't spew that kind of nonsense at me.
    I find your analysis very fair. 
  • Yes.  On the iPad Mon-Thursday, printed copy Fri-Sun.

    "Semper ubi sub ubi"

    San Diego, CA

  • nolaegghead
    nolaegghead Posts: 42,102
    We have a landline, and we subscribe to the paper.  (SWMBO reads the paper, I get my news from various amalgamated sources, however, the paper serves as an excellent base for crawfish consumption)

    Sounds good to have both sides of an issue represented in media discussion, right?  This technique gives traction and credence to many crack-pot conspiracy theories and fake news by legitimizing outrageous claims.  News agencies should do a better job.  Sadly we have a largely misinformed electorate.

    "It ain't what you don't know that gets you into trouble.  It's what you know for sure that just ain't so."  --Mark Twain
    ______________________________________________
    I love lamp..
  • SkinnyV
    SkinnyV Posts: 3,404
    No landline since 2003, never subscribed to a newspaper and read some articles online only.
    Seattle, WA
  • fishlessman
    fishlessman Posts: 32,657
    landline at the house as well, the bastards took out my copper lines under protest, its so much better now though, the fiber optic line cuts out during power failures. cells are useless in my yard and im not going to work on fixing that. im not sure what we have to do at work, my old copper lines work there, had new fancy phones installed and the high frequency from some of the welders interferes with them big time. after a few weeks we had to tear them out and put the old phones back in. now they want to tear out the copper here as well
    fukahwee maine

    you can lead a fish to water but you can not make him drink it
  • HeavyG
    HeavyG Posts: 10,323
    @JustineCaseyFeldown fair points about Oreilly.

    If you think today's press is doing a good job or even trying to do so, I wholeheartedly disagree. They are mostly left wing activists. By definition they should not be journalists. 
    So just when were those halcyon days of unbiased, "fair and balanced" media reporting and folks were widely content with the "lamestream media"?


    “Reality is that which, when you stop believing in it, doesn't go away.” ― Philip K. Diçk




  • RRP
    RRP Posts: 25,880
    landline at the house as well, the bastards took out my copper lines under protest, its so much better now though, the fiber optic line cuts out during power failures. cells are useless in my yard and im not going to work on fixing that. im not sure what we have to do at work, my old copper lines work there, had new fancy phones installed and the high frequency from some of the welders interferes with them big time. after a few weeks we had to tear them out and put the old phones back in. now they want to tear out the copper here as well
    Love our dependable underground cable here for land line, TV and internet. Capable of adding security but no need as we have a 20 pound Westie who excels in home security issues!
    Re-gasketing America one yard at a time.
  • pgprescott
    pgprescott Posts: 14,544
    HeavyG said:
    @JustineCaseyFeldown fair points about Oreilly.

    If you think today's press is doing a good job or even trying to do so, I wholeheartedly disagree. They are mostly left wing activists. By definition they should not be journalists. 
    So just when were those halcyon days of unbiased, "fair and balanced" media reporting and folks were widely content with the "lamestream media"?


    I'm not sure that ever existed. I am sure that the bias has increased and they are less concerned about the appearance of fairness in the MSM. The academic environment has moved much further left and journalists come out feeling they are supposed to "make a difference" in society. Wrong-O! 
  • @JustineCaseyFeldown fair points about Oreilly.

    If you think today's press is doing a good job or even trying to do so, I wholeheartedly disagree. They are mostly left wing activists. By definition they should not be journalists. 
    By "press" do you mean "media" or print journalism in particular? What, if any, reliable media does exist and where is it found or does it just require weighing the inherent biases of each and falling someplace in the middle?
    Stillwater, MN
  • pgprescott
    pgprescott Posts: 14,544
    @JustineCaseyFeldown fair points about Oreilly.

    If you think today's press is doing a good job or even trying to do so, I wholeheartedly disagree. They are mostly left wing activists. By definition they should not be journalists. 
    By "press" do you mean "media" or print journalism in particular? What, if any, reliable media does exist and where is it found or does it just require weighing the inherent biases of each and falling someplace in the middle?
    The bias is at least 1000 - 1 in favor of the liberals. You are on the right track about being aware, but at least 1/2 the country aren't. I would argue that Fox, for instance, leans right, but less right than the MSM leans left. People are so conditioned from digesting the left bias, they often don't even realize it's biased opinion and not news or fact. When you say it's in the middle, I'm not sure that is true. When the bias is so dramatically greater in one direction, it would be a big win for the left for people to accept your premise. Hey, perspective is everything and my perspective is mine. Your perspective is yours. That's fine I guess. I just feel the media is totally corrupt as is a large swath of academia. Maybe corrupt is the wrong term, maybe. 
  • JMCXL
    JMCXL Posts: 1,524
    I read the headlines as I bring the paper up to my elderly neighbors door ever morning
    Northern New Jersey
     XL - Woo2, AR      L (2) - Woo, PS Woo     MM (2) - Woo       MINI

    Check out https://www.grillingwithpapaj.com for some fun and more Grilling with Papa (incase you haven't gotten enough of me)

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  • Focker
    Focker Posts: 8,364
    edited December 2016
    @JustineCaseyFeldown fair points about Oreilly.

    If you think today's press is doing a good job or even trying to do so, I wholeheartedly disagree. They are mostly left wing activists. By definition they should not be journalists. 
    By "press" do you mean "media" or print journalism in particular? What, if any, reliable media does exist and where is it found or does it just require weighing the inherent biases of each and falling someplace in the middle?
    The bias is at least 1000 - 1 in favor of the liberals. You are on the right track about being aware, but at least 1/2 the country aren't. I would argue that Fox, for instance, leans right, but less right than the MSM leans left. People are so conditioned from digesting the left bias, they often don't even realize it's biased opinion and not news or fact. When you say it's in the middle, I'm not sure that is true. When the bias is so dramatically greater in one direction, it would be a big win for the left for people to accept your premise. Hey, perspective is everything and my perspective is mine. Your perspective is yours. That's fine I guess. I just feel the media is totally corrupt as is a large swath of academia. Maybe corrupt is the wrong term, maybe. 
    No pap, no landline, but you're right.  I really enjoy listening to Chuck, and D I C K, on NBC for great laughs.  NBC, Engel specifically, on election night was truly epic.
    Brandon
    Quad Cities
    "If yer gonna denigrate, familiarity with the subject is helpful."

  • JohnInCarolina
    JohnInCarolina Posts: 30,864
    edited December 2016
    @JustineCaseyFeldown fair points about Oreilly.

    If you think today's press is doing a good job or even trying to do so, I wholeheartedly disagree. They are mostly left wing activists. By definition they should not be journalists. 
    By "press" do you mean "media" or print journalism in particular? What, if any, reliable media does exist and where is it found or does it just require weighing the inherent biases of each and falling someplace in the middle?
    The bias is at least 1000 - 1 in favor of the liberals. You are on the right track about being aware, but at least 1/2 the country aren't. I would argue that Fox, for instance, leans right, but less right than the MSM leans left. People are so conditioned from digesting the left bias, they often don't even realize it's biased opinion and not news or fact. When you say it's in the middle, I'm not sure that is true. When the bias is so dramatically greater in one direction, it would be a big win for the left for people to accept your premise. Hey, perspective is everything and my perspective is mine. Your perspective is yours. That's fine I guess. I just feel the media is totally corrupt as is a large swath of academia. Maybe corrupt is the wrong term, maybe. 
    This is hilarious because Fox News is almost non-stop opinion/entertainment (some would say GOP propaganda).   Very few of their shows are focused on delivering news as opposed to opinion.  Maybe what, Shep Smith's show?

    ETA:

    As for academia, what is the basis for your assertion that a large swath of it is corrupt?
    "I've made a note never to piss you two off." - Stike
  • Giving equal time to opposing views isn't always the right thing to do.  This is an extreme example obviously, but I hope we'd all agree that it doesn't make sense to give equal time to a flat-earther and a geophysicist.
    "I've made a note never to piss you two off." - Stike
  • @JustineCaseyFeldown fair points about Oreilly.

    If you think today's press is doing a good job or even trying to do so, I wholeheartedly disagree. They are mostly left wing activists. By definition they should not be journalists. 
    By "press" do you mean "media" or print journalism in particular? What, if any, reliable media does exist and where is it found or does it just require weighing the inherent biases of each and falling someplace in the middle?
    The bias is at least 1000 - 1 in favor of the liberals. You are on the right track about being aware, but at least 1/2 the country aren't. I would argue that Fox, for instance, leans right, but less right than the MSM leans left. People are so conditioned from digesting the left bias, they often don't even realize it's biased opinion and not news or fact. When you say it's in the middle, I'm not sure that is true. When the bias is so dramatically greater in one direction, it would be a big win for the left for people to accept your premise. Hey, perspective is everything and my perspective is mine. Your perspective is yours. That's fine I guess. I just feel the media is totally corrupt as is a large swath of academia. Maybe corrupt is the wrong term, maybe. 
    Appreciate the response. I didn't mean to suggest "media" by and large falls somewhere in the middle, because I agree in many areas it leans left (not 1000 to 1 liberal, however you would quantify that, but definitely left). I meant the consumer of media takes a look at both sides, considers the inherent biases of where it's coming from and then decides which is more or less accurate based on either the media origin or directly sourced information.
    Stillwater, MN
  • RajunCajun
    RajunCajun Posts: 1,035
    Yep, not sure why, but we still subscribe to the local newspaper, still have a landline and a fax machine and I still like to calculate my truck mileage with a calculator and I still refer to entering a phone number as "dialing a number" and I still remember Howard Cosell, hey, I'm ole school....I've also  been known to open the car door for my wife......but one thing or sure is that I have a Big Green Egg and love it!!!!
    The problem with a problem is that you don't know it's a problem until it's a problem, and that is a big problem.
    Holding the company together with three spreadsheets and two cans connected by a long piece of string.
  • I am enjoying the thoughts of folks on here. I don't disagree that media tends to lean liberal based on my own experiences, but it's also a statement that is easy to throw out there. As I mentioned, I tend to view newspaper coverage (not editorial page content which does not come from actual reporters) is mostly straight forward and offering both sides if being done professionally. Anyone got good examples of specific news stories in mainstream publications that have been written with unfair bias towards one side or another. I sometimes ask people when they make those kind of statements about the liberal media and I typically only hear broad claims with few specific examples.
    Stillwater, MN
  • pgprescott
    pgprescott Posts: 14,544
    I am enjoying the thoughts of folks on here. I don't disagree that media tends to lean liberal based on my own experiences, but it's also a statement that is easy to throw out there. As I mentioned, I tend to view newspaper coverage (not editorial page content which does not come from actual reporters) is mostly straight forward and offering both sides if being done professionally. Anyone got good examples of specific news stories in mainstream publications that have been written with unfair bias towards one side or another. I sometimes ask people when they make those kind of statements about the liberal media and I typically only hear broad claims with few specific examples.
    Humor me and pay particular attention to the headlines in the print media. Often time sensational and misleading. Then make a mental note as to which side benefits from the misleading headlines. Many people never bother to get the nuts and bolts and the headlines are a classic area of bias and distortion. 
  • pgprescott
    pgprescott Posts: 14,544

    @JustineCaseyFeldown fair points about Oreilly.

    If you think today's press is doing a good job or even trying to do so, I wholeheartedly disagree. They are mostly left wing activists. By definition they should not be journalists. 
    By "press" do you mean "media" or print journalism in particular? What, if any, reliable media does exist and where is it found or does it just require weighing the inherent biases of each and falling someplace in the middle?
    The bias is at least 1000 - 1 in favor of the liberals. You are on the right track about being aware, but at least 1/2 the country aren't. I would argue that Fox, for instance, leans right, but less right than the MSM leans left. People are so conditioned from digesting the left bias, they often don't even realize it's biased opinion and not news or fact. When you say it's in the middle, I'm not sure that is true. When the bias is so dramatically greater in one direction, it would be a big win for the left for people to accept your premise. Hey, perspective is everything and my perspective is mine. Your perspective is yours. That's fine I guess. I just feel the media is totally corrupt as is a large swath of academia. Maybe corrupt is the wrong term, maybe. 
    This is hilarious because Fox News is almost non-stop opinion/entertainment (some would say GOP propaganda).   Very few of their shows are focused on delivering news as opposed to opinion.  Maybe what, Shep Smith's show?

    ETA:

    As for academia, what is the basis for your assertion that a large swath of it is corrupt?
    Exactly. A guy like yourself doesn't even see the gross bias in the other direction by all other outlets. All you ever see is the Fox slant (which is definitely slanted) I'm telling you ALL the other outlets are as bad or worse in the opposite direction. Worse for one because the try to mask and deceive ignorant people with their opinions pawned off as fact or news. I have absolutely no doubt you cannot see it. 

    Almost all all of them think similarly to you. Even you must admit at least half the people don't think as you do. Why do all the professors have to lean one way? Free speech! Oh, except for Condoleezza Rice and others. Right? The marketplace of ideas is closed in many universities and students are called vile names if they speak out. You know it's true. It's pathetic and a driver of mediocrity. 

  • @JustineCaseyFeldown fair points about Oreilly.

    If you think today's press is doing a good job or even trying to do so, I wholeheartedly disagree. They are mostly left wing activists. By definition they should not be journalists. 
    By "press" do you mean "media" or print journalism in particular? What, if any, reliable media does exist and where is it found or does it just require weighing the inherent biases of each and falling someplace in the middle?
    The bias is at least 1000 - 1 in favor of the liberals. You are on the right track about being aware, but at least 1/2 the country aren't. I would argue that Fox, for instance, leans right, but less right than the MSM leans left. People are so conditioned from digesting the left bias, they often don't even realize it's biased opinion and not news or fact. When you say it's in the middle, I'm not sure that is true. When the bias is so dramatically greater in one direction, it would be a big win for the left for people to accept your premise. Hey, perspective is everything and my perspective is mine. Your perspective is yours. That's fine I guess. I just feel the media is totally corrupt as is a large swath of academia. Maybe corrupt is the wrong term, maybe. 
    This is hilarious because Fox News is almost non-stop opinion/entertainment (some would say GOP propaganda).   Very few of their shows are focused on delivering news as opposed to opinion.  Maybe what, Shep Smith's show?

    ETA:

    As for academia, what is the basis for your assertion that a large swath of it is corrupt?
    Exactly. A guy like yourself doesn't even see the gross bias in the other direction by all other outlets. All you ever see is the Fox slant (which is definitely slanted) I'm telling you ALL the other outlets are as bad or worse in the opposite direction. Worse for one because the try to mask and deceive ignorant people with their opinions pawned off as fact or news. I have absolutely no doubt you cannot see it. 

    Almost all all of them think similarly to you. Even you must admit at least half the people don't think as you do. Why do all the professors have to lean one way? Free speech! Oh, except for Condoleezza Rice and others. Right? The marketplace of ideas is closed in many universities and students are called vile names if they speak out. You know it's true. It's pathetic and a driver of mediocrity. 
    I never said anything about the other outlets.  I just found the notion that Fox was somehow much less biased to be funny.  I think it's pretty subjective which side is "more" or "less" biased in cable news.  I'm not even sure how one would go about quantifying it in any manner that you'd find acceptable.  

    As to your second paragraph, it doesn't really answer my question.  What do you mean by "corrupt" ?  What evidence is there to support your claim?  All I see in your response is opinion.  

    All professors don't have to lean one way.  We don't ask what political party people belong to when they apply to positions.  In fact, during any interview I've ever been involved with, I can't recall a single instance in which politics even came up.  We mostly talk about science and engineering, because that's what my colleagues actually care the most about believe it or not.  

    One of the main people involved with Trump's campaign was a Duke student who routinely wrote opinion pieces in the student newspaper.  I don't recall him ever being shouted down or ostracized, even though I suspect many people on campus disagreed with his views.  

    When I've raised this issue with faculty in liberal arts their response is that they tend to take the opposite position to the students during lecture, regardless of what it is.  The reason is simple.  They are trying to develop the students' critical thinking skills, and providing some kind of echo chamber doesn't do that.  In fact, it does just the opposite.  

    Where did you go to school by the way?  I'm just asking because your perception is quite a bit different from any other place I'm familiar with, but I admit that different campuses have different cultures.  


    "I've made a note never to piss you two off." - Stike
  • I know someone that watches ABC Evening news regularly. I mentioned to him sometime back how in the tank Martha Raddatz was. He disagreed. He saw her crying on election night. He now sees her for what she is. I loved how both ABC and Raddatz claim she was not crying, but what can we expect them to say?
  • pgprescott
    pgprescott Posts: 14,544

    @JustineCaseyFeldown fair points about Oreilly.

    If you think today's press is doing a good job or even trying to do so, I wholeheartedly disagree. They are mostly left wing activists. By definition they should not be journalists. 
    By "press" do you mean "media" or print journalism in particular? What, if any, reliable media does exist and where is it found or does it just require weighing the inherent biases of each and falling someplace in the middle?
    The bias is at least 1000 - 1 in favor of the liberals. You are on the right track about being aware, but at least 1/2 the country aren't. I would argue that Fox, for instance, leans right, but less right than the MSM leans left. People are so conditioned from digesting the left bias, they often don't even realize it's biased opinion and not news or fact. When you say it's in the middle, I'm not sure that is true. When the bias is so dramatically greater in one direction, it would be a big win for the left for people to accept your premise. Hey, perspective is everything and my perspective is mine. Your perspective is yours. That's fine I guess. I just feel the media is totally corrupt as is a large swath of academia. Maybe corrupt is the wrong term, maybe. 
    This is hilarious because Fox News is almost non-stop opinion/entertainment (some would say GOP propaganda).   Very few of their shows are focused on delivering news as opposed to opinion.  Maybe what, Shep Smith's show?

    ETA:

    As for academia, what is the basis for your assertion that a large swath of it is corrupt?
    Exactly. A guy like yourself doesn't even see the gross bias in the other direction by all other outlets. All you ever see is the Fox slant (which is definitely slanted) I'm telling you ALL the other outlets are as bad or worse in the opposite direction. Worse for one because the try to mask and deceive ignorant people with their opinions pawned off as fact or news. I have absolutely no doubt you cannot see it. 

    Almost all all of them think similarly to you. Even you must admit at least half the people don't think as you do. Why do all the professors have to lean one way? Free speech! Oh, except for Condoleezza Rice and others. Right? The marketplace of ideas is closed in many universities and students are called vile names if they speak out. You know it's true. It's pathetic and a driver of mediocrity. 
    I never said anything about the other outlets.  I just found the notion that Fox was somehow much less biased to be funny.  I think it's pretty subjective which side is "more" or "less" biased in cable news.  I'm not even sure how one would go about quantifying it in any manner that you'd find acceptable.  

    As to your second paragraph, it doesn't really answer my question.  What do you mean by "corrupt" ?  What evidence is there to support your claim?  All I see in your response is opinion.  

    All professors don't have to lean one way.  We don't ask what political party people belong to when they apply to positions.  In fact, during any interview I've ever been involved with, I can't recall a single instance in which politics even came up.  We mostly talk about science and engineering, because that's what my colleagues actually care the most about believe it or not.  

    One of the main people involved with Trump's campaign was a Duke student who routinely wrote opinion pieces in the student newspaper.  I don't recall him ever being shouted down or ostracized, even though I suspect many people on campus disagreed with his views.  

    When I've raised this issue with faculty in liberal arts their response is that they tend to take the opposite position to the students during lecture, regardless of what it is.  The reason is simple.  They are trying to develop the students' critical thinking skills, and providing some kind of echo chamber doesn't do that.  In fact, it does just the opposite.  

    Where did you go to school by the way?  I'm just asking because your perception is quite a bit different from any other place I'm familiar with, but I admit that different campuses have different cultures.  


    You are a lost cause. You can't admit anything. Btw, many conservatives have been disallowed to speak on campuses. Fact not opinion. I have heard tons of stories of downright bullying by staff over the years. Every time it is a liberal bullying. Not sure I've ever been told of one in the other direction. To deny these things is willful ignorance. I'm glad that this one student you mention was treated fairly. I wonder what his sid of the story would be? You should seek him out and have a coffee. I'm curious. 
  • Hans61
    Hans61 Posts: 3,901
    I'm for critical thinking! Anyone else who is is not a lost cause, regardless of the opinion they come to, at least its a considered one.

    All of our scales have different weights :-) 
    “There are three rules that I live by: never get less than twelve hours sleep; never play cards with a guy who has the same first name as a city; and never get involved with a woman with a tattoo of a dagger on her body.”
    Coach Finstock Teen Wolf
  • You are a lost cause. You can't admit anything. Btw, many conservatives have been disallowed to speak on campuses. Fact not opinion. I have heard tons of stories of downright bullying by staff over the years. Every time it is a liberal bullying. Not sure I've ever been told of one in the other direction. To deny these things is willful ignorance. I'm glad that this one student you mention was treated fairly. I wonder what his sid of the story would be? You should seek him out and have a coffee. I'm curious. 
    Again, none of this actually answers the question.  You haven't explained what you meant by them being "corrupt" or provided anything beyond anecdotes/"stories" to support your claims.  

    To be clear, I'm not contending that liberals and conservatives are equally represented in academia.  There's numerous studies indicating that they're not.  But that's a very different question from corruption.  To me, corruption would imply that people are holding ideas they don't believe to be correct, because they're being paid to do so, or something like that.  

    The student in question has long since graduated from Duke.  I just recognized him recently because I used to read his pieces in the student newspaper, which is strangely on topic for this thread.  
    "I've made a note never to piss you two off." - Stike
  • pgprescott
    pgprescott Posts: 14,544
    Hans61 said:
    I'm for critical thinking! Anyone else who is is not a lost cause, regardless of the opinion they come to, at least its a considered one.

    All of our scales have different weights :-) 
    They are just words. I know John is really a lost cause in the broad sense. He just sees things much different than I do. I would bet we would get along just fine. 
  • YEMTrey
    YEMTrey Posts: 6,829
    We subscribe to our local communities Hilltop Press, oh and I also read TheOnion.
    Steve 
    XL, Mini Max, and a 22" Blackstone in Cincinnati, Ohio

  • DuckDogDr
    DuckDogDr Posts: 1,549
    I read the Sunday funnies once a week
    love me some Garfield
  • pgprescott
    pgprescott Posts: 14,544
    @JohnInCarolina as I said, maybe corrupt is the wrong word.