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Pork belly smoked into bacon - how to??

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Comments

  • Darby_Crenshaw
    Darby_Crenshaw Posts: 2,657
    edited December 2015
    ....maybe you're confusing "number 2" with Tenderquick

    #1 is nitrite plus salt. No sugar

    #2 is nitrate and nitrite plus salt. No sugar

    Tenderquick is is both plus salt and sugar. Ready to cure. 
    [social media disclaimer: irony and sarcasm may be used in some or all of user's posts; emoticon usage is intended to indicate moderately jocular social interaction; the comments toward users, their usernames, and the real people (living or dead) that they refer to are not intended to be adversarial in nature; those replying to this user are entering into a tacit agreement that they are real-life or social-media acquaintances and/or have agreed to or tacitly agreed to perpetrate occasional good-natured ribbing between and among themselves and others]

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  • Mclayborn79
    Mclayborn79 Posts: 58
    I just watched an episode of Steven raichlen-project smoke. He did cured bacon and Canadian bacon. It was on Pbs. 
    http://projectsmoke.mpt.org/episodes/
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  • reh111
    reh111 Posts: 196
    this discussion has evolved/devolved into a discussion I don't understand - I've got a 4 lb belly in a zip lock bag rubbed with Morton's Tender Quick mixed with a bunch of other stuff, including Kosher Salt, Brown Sugar, garlic, peppers, et al, etc - it's been in the fridge for three days and I'm going to let it cure for the rest of the week - this weekend, probably Friday, I'll take it out, wash it, pat it dry, refrigerate it, on Saturday, smoke it to 150 and then cut it in slices and see if my wife likes it when I fry it - if i'm (or she's) not dead at the end of that process, I'll let you know how it turned out - thanks for all your comments
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  • DaveM
    DaveM Posts: 100
    Nitrates are cancer causing...  I'll stick with a warm smoke and leave the pink salt out.  
    --Dave from Leesburg, VA BGE XL, Viking 42", Firepit with $16 grill
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  • theyolksonyou
    theyolksonyou Posts: 18,458
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  • DMW
    DMW Posts: 13,832
    DaveM said:
    Nitrates are cancer causing...  I'll stick with a warm smoke and leave the pink salt out.  
    Do you avoid celery in your diet?
    They/Them
    Morgantown, PA

    XL BGE - S BGE - KJ Jr - HB Legacy - BS Pizza Oven - 30" Firepit - King Kooker Fryer -  PR72T - WSJ - BS 17" Griddle - XXL BGE  - BS SS36" Griddle - 2 Burner Gasser - Pellet Smoker
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  • reh111
    reh111 Posts: 196
    DMW said:
    DaveM said:
    Nitrates are cancer causing...  I'll stick with a warm smoke and leave the pink salt out.  
    Do you avoid celery in your diet?
    this is the "devolvement" I was referring to 
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  • bgebrent
    bgebrent Posts: 19,636
    Use the pink salt, follow base recipe then modify flavor additives.  I don't recommend celery as a flavor additive ;)
    Sandy Springs & Dawsonville Ga
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  • DMW
    DMW Posts: 13,832
    edited December 2015
    reh111 said:
    DMW said:
    DaveM said:
    Nitrates are cancer causing...  I'll stick with a warm smoke and leave the pink salt out.  
    Do you avoid celery in your diet?
    this is the "devolvement" I was referring to 
    Sorry, I am genuinely curious. I like to learn about stuff, which lead to me learning that celery contains more nitrates than any bacon. And so, I wonder if those that avoid curing salt also avoid celery.

    The advice that was offered earlier, follow a known good recipe, is solid advice. As far as what you currently have curing with TQ, I don't know much about it, so I haven't commented in that regard. I hope it turns out great, I'm sure you have nothing to worry about with regards to food safety, it's in a fridge.
    They/Them
    Morgantown, PA

    XL BGE - S BGE - KJ Jr - HB Legacy - BS Pizza Oven - 30" Firepit - King Kooker Fryer -  PR72T - WSJ - BS 17" Griddle - XXL BGE  - BS SS36" Griddle - 2 Burner Gasser - Pellet Smoker
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  • SGH
    SGH Posts: 28,791
    bgebrent said:
    Use the pink salt, follow base recipe then modify flavor additives.  I don't recommend celery as a flavor additive ;)
    I feed celery to the rabbits that I raise. The rabbits eat the celery and I eat the rabbits. This is about as close as I come to eating celery =)

    Location- Just "this side" of Biloxi, Ms.

    Status- Standing by.

    The greatest barrier against all wisdom, the stronghold against knowledge itself, is the single thought, in ones mind, that they already have it all figured out. 

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  • Darby_Crenshaw
    Darby_Crenshaw Posts: 2,657
    If nitrates are cancer causing, you'll want to stop eating celery, spinach, beets, and your own saliva. 

    Anyone who has studied this will quickly learn: a couple sticks of celery contain more nitrite then an entire ten pack of hot dogs. 

    But by all means, continue to think you're eating 'healthy'
    [social media disclaimer: irony and sarcasm may be used in some or all of user's posts; emoticon usage is intended to indicate moderately jocular social interaction; the comments toward users, their usernames, and the real people (living or dead) that they refer to are not intended to be adversarial in nature; those replying to this user are entering into a tacit agreement that they are real-life or social-media acquaintances and/or have agreed to or tacitly agreed to perpetrate occasional good-natured ribbing between and among themselves and others]

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  • bgebrent
    bgebrent Posts: 19,636
    Darby_Crenshaw said:
    If nitrates are cancer causing, you'll want to stop eating celery, spinach, beets, and your own saliva. 

    Anyone who has studied this will quickly learn: a couple sticks of celery contain more nitrite then an entire ten pack of hot dogs. 

    But by all means, continue to think you're eating 'healthy'
    This is why I always spit out my saliva after eating my home cured, with pink salt bacon.  Fear the nitrates!  And the hotdogs!  
    Sandy Springs & Dawsonville Ga
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  • theyolksonyou
    theyolksonyou Posts: 18,458
    I only eat veggie dogs made from celery, spinach, and beets for my health. 
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  • Darby_Crenshaw
    Darby_Crenshaw Posts: 2,657
    Exactly. Saw some more 'uncured' bacon at whole foods today. Package said "ingredients: salt and no nitrites added except for that natually occurring in celery powder"

    interesting

    anyone care to explain why they use celery powder? Ain't for flavor. It's because celery powder is naturally high in nitrite. Which is a curing agent. 

    And that, folks, means the bacon is (in fact) "cured"

    it's easy to charge more to people when those people don't know what they are buying. 
    [social media disclaimer: irony and sarcasm may be used in some or all of user's posts; emoticon usage is intended to indicate moderately jocular social interaction; the comments toward users, their usernames, and the real people (living or dead) that they refer to are not intended to be adversarial in nature; those replying to this user are entering into a tacit agreement that they are real-life or social-media acquaintances and/or have agreed to or tacitly agreed to perpetrate occasional good-natured ribbing between and among themselves and others]

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  • DMW
    DMW Posts: 13,832
    Darby_Crenshaw said:
    Exactly. Saw some more 'uncured' bacon at whole foods today. Package said "ingredients: salt and no nitrites added except for that natually occurring in celery powder"

    interesting

    anyone care to explain why they use celery powder? Ain't for flavor. It's because celery powder is naturally high in nitrite. Which is a curing agent. 

    And that, folks, means the bacon is (in fact) "cured"

    it's easy to charge more to people when those people don't know what they are buying. 
    I know I am straying way off topic from this thread, but whatevers. At our family reunion today, some of my dad's cousins and I were chatting and the topic of how disconnected consumers had become from what they consumed came up. They are farmers, raise the cattle and swine we consume. Interesting to hear them talk about "townies" that pay way more for stuff with fancy labels without understanding what it is because they saw it on Dr. Ozz or whatever special was on the tee-vee the week before.
    They/Them
    Morgantown, PA

    XL BGE - S BGE - KJ Jr - HB Legacy - BS Pizza Oven - 30" Firepit - King Kooker Fryer -  PR72T - WSJ - BS 17" Griddle - XXL BGE  - BS SS36" Griddle - 2 Burner Gasser - Pellet Smoker
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  • bgebrent
    bgebrent Posts: 19,636
    Darby_Crenshaw said:
    Exactly. Saw some more 'uncured' bacon at whole foods today. Package said "ingredients: salt and no nitrites added except for that natually occurring in celery powder"

    interesting

    anyone care to explain why they use celery powder? Ain't for flavor. It's because celery powder is naturally high in nitrite. Which is a curing agent. 

    And that, folks, means the bacon is (in fact) "cured"

    it's easy to charge more to people when those people don't know what they are buying. 
    And I always thought it was the celery powder that made the bacon taste great!  The chemistry is not challenging.  
    Sandy Springs & Dawsonville Ga
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  • nolaegghead
    nolaegghead Posts: 42,102
    If the nitrites come from a "natural" source such as celery, the FDA does not require the product to be labeled as "cured" or "containing nitrites".  It's that simple. 
    ______________________________________________
    I love lamp..
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  • Darby_Crenshaw
    Darby_Crenshaw Posts: 2,657
    And yet, it is cured, and contains nitrites, and is no healthier than the bacon it pretends to be healthier than

    the suppliers and retailers trade off consumer ignorance

    same for 'organic' etc.  Absolutely meaningless, but people feel better

    it's 'cured'. A rose by any other name....
    [social media disclaimer: irony and sarcasm may be used in some or all of user's posts; emoticon usage is intended to indicate moderately jocular social interaction; the comments toward users, their usernames, and the real people (living or dead) that they refer to are not intended to be adversarial in nature; those replying to this user are entering into a tacit agreement that they are real-life or social-media acquaintances and/or have agreed to or tacitly agreed to perpetrate occasional good-natured ribbing between and among themselves and others]

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  • milesvdustin
    milesvdustin Posts: 2,882
    Darby_Crenshaw said:
    you'll want to follow one for bacon.

    it has been comical here that people will say "i tried making bacon and it was no good" and then they document how they changed and freewheeled half the ingredients or steps

    "i didn't want to use nitrite so i skipped that"

    "i don't like a lot of salt, so i reduced it"

    "i was afraid it wasn't safe so i cured it for two weeks"

    "i used belly that was already sliced into inch wide strips"
    etc etc

    followed by "what did i do wrong?"


    I followed the ruhlman recipe to a T and it wasnt what i was expecting. 

    2 LBGE, Blackstone 36, Jumbo Joe

    Egging in Southern Illinois (Marion)

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  • Darby_Crenshaw
    Darby_Crenshaw Posts: 2,657
    what were you expecting? if you were expecting commercial bacon, that's not what this is.

    commercial bacon is wet-cured and made by injecting pickle/brine directly into the sliced bacon.  it's immediately packaged, and cures on the way to the store.

    this adds water (weight) and is the reason the bacon shrinks and pops and hisses, as the cure is boiled off as it fries

    dry cure bacon removes water.

    it's two different things, neither one inherently 'better', unless you are expecting one and make the other
    [social media disclaimer: irony and sarcasm may be used in some or all of user's posts; emoticon usage is intended to indicate moderately jocular social interaction; the comments toward users, their usernames, and the real people (living or dead) that they refer to are not intended to be adversarial in nature; those replying to this user are entering into a tacit agreement that they are real-life or social-media acquaintances and/or have agreed to or tacitly agreed to perpetrate occasional good-natured ribbing between and among themselves and others]

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  • blind99
    blind99 Posts: 4,971

    @milesvdustin yes, it's definitely different than most commercial bacon. to my mind, it's parcooked, and i'll eat bits right off the smoker.  when I cook it (again) for eating, after it's sliced, I cook it a little slower and more gently than storebought bacon - I want the fat to render and then brown the meat, without overcooking the meat.

    my children, who don't know nitrates from ninja turtles, think the homemade bacon is the best -- just a matter of taste/preference.

    Here's a pretty good explanation of nitrates, nitrites, celery, etc. 

    http://fyi.uwex.edu/meats/files/2012/02/Nitrate-and-nitrite-in-cured-meat_10-18-2012.pdf

    They say that since the USDA doesn't have rules about plant-based nitrates and nitrites, you can't call a product cured if you use them.

    Chicago, IL - Large and Small BGE - Weber Gasser and Kettle
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  • Darby_Crenshaw
    Darby_Crenshaw Posts: 2,657
    edited December 2015
    except the chemicals don't know the rules, and end up curing it anyway. :)

    by that logic, a country ham or prosciutto isn't cured, because it has no nitrites.
    [social media disclaimer: irony and sarcasm may be used in some or all of user's posts; emoticon usage is intended to indicate moderately jocular social interaction; the comments toward users, their usernames, and the real people (living or dead) that they refer to are not intended to be adversarial in nature; those replying to this user are entering into a tacit agreement that they are real-life or social-media acquaintances and/or have agreed to or tacitly agreed to perpetrate occasional good-natured ribbing between and among themselves and others]

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  • blind99
    blind99 Posts: 4,971

    @darby_Crenshaw yep, you're right!  there is definitely some vagueness in the term 'curing.' some people will say that curing involves nitrites, and if there are no nitrites involved, it's corning or "salt curing."  Or brining.

    one last reference I found helpful, no more I promise.  there's a ton of useful information available out there on the interwebz.

    http://nchfp.uga.edu/publications/nchfp/lit_rev/cure_smoke_toc.html

    Chicago, IL - Large and Small BGE - Weber Gasser and Kettle
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