pizza stones - Cast iron vs traditional ceramic

mlamb01 · September 2014

I have a lodge cast iron 14" pizza pan with side handles, and I find that it cooks the crust(NY style) very quickly, even at 500 degrees. I use it with the platesetter in the legs up orientation. I see recipes that say to cook it for 12 to 15 minutes, but it only takes about 6 minutes for me. This would be great for rapidly producing pies, but the problem is that my toppings don't get done, the cheese does not have time to brown before the crust burns. I put the platesetter and the cast iron pan in the egg shortly after lighting it, and let them all come up to temp together. Once the egg hits 500, I hold it there for half an hour before I put the pizza on.

Is there an adjustment or modification that needs to be made for recipes when you cook them on cast iron vs ceramic?

Photo Egg · September 2014

Correct me if I'm wrong.

You are doing platesetter legs up with BGE cooking grid on the legs and your Lodge CI on the cooking grid at about even with the top of your base, felt level...

The hot air is coming around your platesetter and hitting the bottom of your Lodge CI pan and over heating the CI. The solution is to put another diffuser between the CI pan and the BGE cooking grid such as a slightly larger cheap metal pizza pan and use small spacers on this pan to raise and separate it from your Lodge CI. This will buffer the bottom of your CI Lodge pan.

Even better to add 3 normal size house bricks on top your BGE grid first to "raise" the cooking height of your pizza higher in the dome. This will let the radiant heat from the dome cook your pizza from the top better. Play around until you find the height that works best for you.

mlamb01 · September 2014

@Photo Egg - you might be onto something... The outer edge of the cast iron pan does overhang the platesetter footprint by an inch or so. I have a cheap thin 15" ceramic pizza stone that I could try putting underneath the cast iron pan and see if that makes a difference. Maybe create an air gap with balls of foil?

Photo Egg · September 2014

" I have a cheap thin 15" ceramic pizza stone that I could try putting underneath the cast iron pan and see if that makes a difference. Maybe create an air gap with balls of foil?"

Yes...perfect.

It's not the overhang as much as the large gap between your platesetter and Lodge CI. The hot air will roll around the platesetter and and scorch the entire bottom of the pan because of the larger gap. Getting higher in the dome will also help.

Don't give up. It's all about finding the right temp in the EGG at the correct distance from the dome, to cook your toppings, while keeping your pizza pan at a good temp to give you a good crust.

mlamb01 · September 2014

@Photo Egg - Does this same thing happen with the ceramic pizza stones?

DieselkW · September 2014

Be careful using ceramic pizza stones - the ones commonly available from pampered chef and La Sur Table have reportedly been cracking in BGE's.

What if you put the grill on the plate setter legs, warm it up to 500, then put the pizza and CI pan on at the same time, both at room temp?

That would give your toppings more time to cook while the CI pizza pan was heating up, that extra time might be all you need to give the underside time to finish when the top was done. If that results in an uncooked bottom, you might have to try putting the CI pan in the egg 5 minutes before the pizza to get it warm, but not hot... Hope you don't ruin too many pizzas to find the right timing.

Photo Egg · September 2014

Yes, To much heat to the bottom of any type pizza pan will cause the pan temp to be higher than the temp of the Egg and burn crust. A well preheated CI might hold and transfer the heat better than most ceramic stones so it might cook your crust a little faster.

Botch · September 2014

I have a different theory.

Metal has a much higher thermal conductivity than ceramic; if you heated both a pizza stone and a cast-iron pan in a hot oven to thermal saturation, then placed each hand on one, the hand that touched the metal pan would burn much worse, only because the heat energy could leave the metal pan quicker (trying to reach equilibrium. Air, which has extremely poor thermal conductivity, won't burn your hand at all at 500 degrees unless you could somehow leave your hand in the oven over a period of time).

Actually you could test this: heat the two different stones to 500 degrees, then place small identical metal pans with a bit of water in them on each stone, turn off the oven, and I guarantee you the water on the iron pan will start boiling first.

Note, also, that pizza is just like a hunk of meat: the thinner it is, the hotter you have to cook it to finish both the crust and the toppings evenly. That's why a margherita is cooked at 900, a New York style at 600-700, a Papa Murphy's at 425, and a Chicago style even lower than that (iirc).

Science!

:-B

tazcrash · September 2014

Agree with PhotoEgg, raise that pan up with bricks or something. the top will cook faster and hopefully match the cook time of the bottom.

cook861 · September 2014

Try cutting your veg and meat thiner or smaller might help

lowlightbw · September 2014

I use the exact same set up as you and love it. We usually have 10-12 people over when we make pizzas so fast cooking times are a must! My solution is I tend to only cook extremely thin crusts. I take a whole foods pizza dough and split it in 2 to make 2, 14" thin crust pizzas. I lower the temp to 450 if I do something thicker. Also the idea about slicing toppings very thin is a good one. Everything that goes on is paper thin and even spread. Good luck!

dougengel · September 2014

Another option - and this worked for me at least, plate-setter legs down, then elevate the pizza stone on some half bricks on the plate-setter. Also - try pre-cooking the toppings just a bit prior to making your pizza if you like thicker slices of veggies...

Zmokin · September 2014

Botch said:

I have a different theory.
Metal has a much higher thermal conductivity than ceramic; if you heated both a pizza stone and a cast-iron pan in a hot oven to thermal saturation, then placed each hand on one, the hand that touched the metal pan would burn much worse, only because the heat energy could leave the metal pan quicker (trying to reach equilibrium. Air, which has extremely poor thermal conductivity, won't burn your hand at all at 500 degrees unless you could somehow leave your hand in the oven over a period of time).
Actually you could test this: heat the two different stones to 500 degrees, then place small identical metal pans with a bit of water in them on each stone, turn off the oven, and I guarantee you the water on the iron pan will start boiling first.

Note, also, that pizza is just like a hunk of meat: the thinner it is, the hotter you have to cook it to finish both the crust and the toppings evenly. That's why a margherita is cooked at 900, a New York style at 600-700, a Papa Murphy's at 425, and a Chicago style even lower than that (iirc).

Science!
:-B

I think you hit the nail on the head with the heat conductivity. not knowing the specific materials involved, I can't get hard numbers, but it is likely on the order of 10's to 100's in rate of heat conductivity (i.e the Cast Iron can conduct it's heat > 10 times faster than the ceramic)

Focker · September 2014

A quick assembly of your pie on a 14" pizza screen would buy you some more time to even things out. Place in egg on top of CI. Remove the screen after the crust sets, 5 min or so, or even at the halfway spin point.

Recall a while back Kenji preferring the Lodge pizza pan over stone. The last few pies on the egg have been done with good results using Reinhart's dough and a Griswold 16" round griddle. Dome temps have been much lower than the standard 500-550 dome, more in the 450-500 range.

Photo Egg · September 2014

Zmokin said:

Botch said:

I have a different theory.
Metal has a much higher thermal conductivity than ceramic; if you heated both a pizza stone and a cast-iron pan in a hot oven to thermal saturation, then placed each hand on one, the hand that touched the metal pan would burn much worse, only because the heat energy could leave the metal pan quicker (trying to reach equilibrium. Air, which has extremely poor thermal conductivity, won't burn your hand at all at 500 degrees unless you could somehow leave your hand in the oven over a period of time).
Actually you could test this: heat the two different stones to 500 degrees, then place small identical metal pans with a bit of water in them on each stone, turn off the oven, and I guarantee you the water on the iron pan will start boiling first.

Note, also, that pizza is just like a hunk of meat: the thinner it is, the hotter you have to cook it to finish both the crust and the toppings evenly. That's why a margherita is cooked at 900, a New York style at 600-700, a Papa Murphy's at 425, and a Chicago style even lower than that (iirc).

Science!
:-B

I think you hit the nail on the head with the heat conductivity. not knowing the specific materials involved, I can't get hard numbers, but it is likely on the order of 10's to 100's in rate of heat conductivity (i.e the Cast Iron can conduct it's heat > 10 times faster than the ceramic)

I agree. But if you have a 5"-6" gap between the platesetter and the bottom of the cast iron pizza pan the pan will be MUCH hotter than the air above the cast iron pan. Adding a second diffuser closer to the cast iron pizza pan will keep the temp of the cast iron closer the true temp in the Egg. Yes, a 500 degree Egg with a 500 degree cast iron pan will transfer heat faster than a ceramic stone. The rate would depend in part on the thickness of each. But a 500 degree Egg with a 700 degree cast iron pan, sitting at felt level, because its being blasted with heat swirling around the platesetter will burn the crap out of the crust before the toppings are cooked well. Cast iron is a great cooking surface but you have to protect it from direct heat. Just because a plate setter is used does not mean you are protecting the cooking surface above if the gap is to large especially with higher heat.

lowlightbw · September 2014

I completely forgot to add that I assemble the pies on parchment paper. I then cut the paper to fit the pie and place that on pizza peel. The pizza with paper go on the stone for 4-5 mins before I remove the paper. This gives me a couple of minutes extra cook time to let the toppings cook a bit more. Sorry for leaving that part out. I guess thats the secret for me. Lol.

mlamb01 · September 2014

I think this is going to do the trick. I did two pizzas for brunch today, a breakfast one with hash browns, sausage links, and eggs; and a pepperoni and basil one. I did platesetter legs up, grid, 15" roshco pizza stone(its cheap and thin), 3/4" copper elbows, and the 14" lodge pizza pan. No burnt crust. Toppings got done. Egg dome temp was about 500 to start. Breakfast pizza cooked for about 12 minutes, and 10 for the pepperoni.

Photo Egg · September 2014

mlamb01 said:

I think this is going to do the trick. I did two pizzas for brunch today, a breakfast one with hash browns, sausage links, and eggs; and a pepperoni and basil one. I did platesetter legs up, grid, 15" roshco pizza stone(its cheap and thin), 3/4" copper elbows, and the 14" lodge pizza pan. No burnt crust. Toppings got done. Egg dome temp was about 500 to start. Breakfast pizza cooked for about 12 minutes, and 10 for the pepperoni.

Very nice @mlamb01‌

pizza stones - Cast iron vs traditional ceramic

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