Burn Ban Ugh

double · December 2012

A rare Saturday at home and there's a burn ban in place in our area, no egg for me today :-(

onedbguru · December 2012

I am guessing you are in the Puget Sound area??? Their laws seem awfully Draconian.

double · December 2012

Yep Snohomish County, $1000 fine if you get caught and with the amount of tree huggers around someone would be sure to report me...

Doc_Eggerton · December 2012

Wow, I pretty much cook all our meals on the Egg. This would be like telling me I can't drive my car to work, or turn on the lights in the house.

nolaegghead · December 2012

Ban is because of smog, or it's too dry and a fire hazard?

double · December 2012

LOL definitely not to dry its done nothing but rain for the last few weeks. Basically due to air quality. Weather conditions are forecast to become cold and dry this weekend. Air pollution is expected to build up to levels unhealthy for sensitive groups, especially in communities where wood-burning is common. These cold and stagnant conditions could persist into next week, when a weak system is forecast to arrive and disperse pollution.

The purpose of a burn ban is to reduce the amount of pollution that is creating unhealthy air usually due to excessive wood smoke. The Clean Air Agency will continue to closely monitor the situation.

double · December 2012

Ye Im not sure how strictly its enforced but Im not going to find out :-)

nolaegghead · December 2012

BBQ smoke smells good. There should be an exception for that. Most of that air pollution is coming from cars and trucks. Idiots burning branches and leaves need to be fined.

double · December 2012

Yep some vegetarian bunny loving tree hugger will get egg envy though ;-) And a $1000 fine would affect my spending money for Mardi Gras in a big way!

Skiddymarker · December 2012

The way I understand it there are two stages of burn bans, first is no fires other than approved wood stoves, EPA certified. Level two is nothing that burns including approved EPA wood stoves and pellet stoves unless they are the only heat source.

Wood is so plentiful that morons have their open fireplace dumping out smoke when it is rainy and foggy. Makes the air impossible to breathe.

I could not find charcoal grills anywhere in the legislation, maybe @double can find out. Greater Vancouver BC is considering the same move because some people are just stupid.

double · December 2012

During a Stage 1 burn ban:
No burning is allowed in fireplaces or uncertified wood stoves. Residents should rely instead on their home's other, cleaner source of heat (such as their furnace or electric baseboard heaters) for a few days until air quality improves, the public health risk diminishes and the ban is cancelled. The only exception is if a wood stove is a home's only adequate source of heat.
No outdoor fires are allowed. This includes recreational fires such as bonfires, campfires and the use of fire pits and chimineas.
Burn ban violations are subject to a $1,000 penalty.
It is OK to use natural gas, propane, pellet and EPA-certified wood stoves or inserts during a Stage 1 burn ban

Skiddymarker · December 2012

@double - so I assume the statement "This includes recreational fires such as bonfires, campfires and the use of fire pits and chimineas" includes a charcoal Egg? It might be worth a call to find out, unless you already know, if a propane BBQ with a smoker box or a charcoal BBQ is included.

michigan_jason · December 2012

Go to court and eat them alive (pun intended) Ps, bring some BBQ for the judge lol. No one will tell me I cannot cook on my egg, no one.

double · December 2012

Enquiry submitted.

td66snrf · December 2012

Here in the greater Los Angeles basin, open burns are always illegal, but... if it has a grill it's a BBQ. Do they make the BBQ restaraunts in your area shut down? Good luck with the fight. Like skiddymarker said: Does it mean you can't cook on a gasser?

double · December 2012

Nope gassers are allowed

jfarley · December 2012

I'm also in the South Coast Air Quality Management District as Is td66snrf. They have come up with no wood burning in fireplace rules but as of yet have left charcoal burning barbecues alone. I find double's report disturbing. It's probably only a matter of time until barbeque regulations hit So Cal.

I truly empathize double. Had no clue this was going on up there. I've been to the area a few times and can't imagine how charcoal barbeques are an issue relating to air quality. Keep up the good fight!

nolaegghead · December 2012

jfarley said:

I'm also in the South Coast Air Quality Management District as Is td66snrf. They have come up with no wood burning in fireplace rules but as of yet have left charcoal burning barbecues alone. I find double's report disturbing. It's probably only a matter of time until barbeque regulations hit So Cal.

I truly empathize double. Had no clue this was going on up there. I've been to the area a few times and can't imagine how charcoal barbeques are an issue relating to air quality. Keep up the good fight!

You have fireplaces there? I'd think they'd be more ornamental than anything.

Some a-hole across the street from me was burning a huge pile of leaves earlier this week. I thought our house was on fire for a brief moment. I almost walked over there with a bucket of water.

BBQ ban. That's so effed up. A man has to eat.

double · December 2012

Some more info found whilst drinking Chivas and sulking...

Can I use my barbecue grill during a burn ban? What about my chiminea?
Charcoal barbecues and other outdoor wood-burning devices such as chimineas, outdoor fireplaces, and fire bowls are considered ‘recreational fire’ devices. Recreational fires using solid fuel – such as charcoal or wood – are always prohibited during air-quality burn bans. Wood and charcoal fires lit in chimineas, fire pits, fire bowls and similar devices fall under this definition.
Propane and natural gas grills, patio heaters and fire pits can be used during a burn ban.
For more information, see the Washington Administrative Code Section 173-425-050(3a).

nolaegghead · December 2012

That sucks. I'd move.

double · December 2012

Lol it probably totals 3 or 4 days a year. A small price to pay when next summer I will be pulling in salmon every day I can get my boat out.

td66snrf · December 2012

I'd glue a valve to the outside of the BGE and run a hose to an empty 5 gal propane tank!

SmokinDAWG82 · December 2012

That really sucks, our burn bans here do not affect BBQ's or recreational fires, of course if you get caught burning a pile of leaves you cannot call it recreational.

Skiddymarker · December 2012

nolaegghead said:

That sucks. I'd move.

Per the following you would have to move anyway, my friend. Note the requirements of being alert, sober and awake.

From the following i think BBQ charcoal is OK, not part of the burn ban. From this link:

http://www.scfd9.org/RecFires.pdf

Requirements for recreational fires are defined both in International Fire Code section 307 (adopted by Washington State and Spokane County) and in WAC 173-425-050 (Washington Administrative Code). The elements of these two laws essentially boil down to the following:

DEFINITION

Recreational fires are outdoor burning of charcoal or firewood (not debris or rubbish) where the fuel is not contained in an incinerator, outdoor fireplace, barbecue grill or barbecue pit1. Recreational fires are for pleasure, religious, ceremonial, cooking, warmth or similar purposes. Fires used for debris or rubbish disposal are not considered recreational fires and are illegal.

REQUIREMENTS Attendance – Both WAC 173-425-050 and the International Fire Code mandate that rec- reational fires be constantly attended by a person capable of extinguishing the fire (alert, sober, awake) until the fire is extinguished. Extinguished is defined as all parts of the fire being out and cold. If unattended burning is reported to Fire District 9, we will extinguish it and file a fire report. Other regulatory agencies may follow up unattended burning reports with hefty fines.

double · December 2012

Crazy they seem to contradict themselves.

Skiddymarker · December 2012

double said:

Crazy they seem to contradict themselves.

Government, consistently screwed up. Might be worth while to find out who actually handles the complaint when one exists and ask them.

I think what they mean is any fire in a BBQ is OK, an egg, a Weber kettle, even an open hibachi. The issue is an open campfire as you would use for a wieny roast.

double · December 2012

Ye that's who I have sent the enquiry to. I figured that way they would respond and I would have the response in writing. If they say I can use it I may just print it out, frame it and hang it next to my egg lol.

nolaegghead · December 2012

Skiddymarker said:

nolaegghead said:

That sucks. I'd move.

Per the following you would have to move anyway, my friend. Note the requirements of being alert, sober and awake.
From the following i think BBQ charcoal is OK, not part of the burn ban. From this link:
http://www.scfd9.org/RecFires.pdf

Requirements for recreational fires are defined both in International Fire Code section 307 (adopted by Washington State and Spokane County) and in WAC 173-425-050 (Washington Administrative Code). The elements of these two laws essentially boil down to the following:

DEFINITION

Recreational fires are outdoor burning of charcoal or firewood (not debris or rubbish) where the fuel is not contained in an incinerator, outdoor fireplace, barbecue grill or barbecue pit1. Recreational fires are for pleasure, religious, ceremonial, cooking, warmth or similar purposes. Fires used for debris or rubbish disposal are not considered recreational fires and are illegal.

REQUIREMENTS Attendance – Both WAC 173-425-050 and the International Fire Code mandate that rec- reational fires be constantly attended by a person capable of extinguishing the fire (alert, sober, awake) until the fire is extinguished. Extinguished is defined as all parts of the fire being out and cold. If unattended burning is reported to Fire District 9, we will extinguish it and file a fire report. Other regulatory agencies may follow up unattended burning reports with hefty fines.

I got the awake part down! ;)

McStew · December 2012

For those in Southern CA. I didnt find this out until the BBQ place near me was shut down durning this time becasue of the ban

http://www.dailynews.com/news/ci_22069693/aqmd-issues-one-day-bans-fireplace-use-los

double · December 2012

I got this response today.

In short, the answer to your question is no. Charcoal barbecues cannot be used during a burn ban, as they are a source of fine particle pollution.

nolaegghead · December 2012

Too bad you don't have the $50 1st offense fine that SoCal has. You might of been able to get away with a few cooks before getting caught. ;)

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