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Wagyu Brisket

friscoagfriscoag Posts: 97
edited June 2012 in EggHead Forum
Anyone ordered some online?  Anyone know of a good site thats reasonable and good quality?
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Comments

  • tmackietmackie Posts: 67
    Snake River Farms is probably the best and most reliable I know of. Their Wagyu brisket is a flat $75 regardless of weight. (They guarantee it will be 11-14 lbs)



    I don't see a huge difference between wagyu brisket and a good choice one from Sam's. The one big advantage is that the wagyu cooks much faster because of the much higher marbling (fat content) in the flat of the brisket. But brisket is the only "affordable" wagyu cut, and the flavor of the one I bought was excellent. I just didn't see a DRAMATIC difference in it. 
  • Wagyu is a scam. Naked Whiz posted a NYT expose of this a month or so ago. Wagyu is not a breed of cow nor is there any such thing as "American Kobe".The word Wagyu simply means Japanese Cattle. It can be anything.If it has 1/100(or probably even less) of Japanese lineage....it can be called Wagyu. I have never noticed a difference between choice and prime in my cooks so unless you are doing so high end competiton or something, I would be wary of Wagyu. Now, some of these producers have excellent quality meats and I'm all for trying that. Just don't get hung up on Wagyu. That word (along with "Kobe" is simply a profit generator for meat producers.

  • hornhonkhornhonk Posts: 3,834
    Wagyu beef is NOT a scam. One guy posts the same "Scam" article from a newspaper writer and everone buys in. Do your own research. Is Wagyu Kobe beef? No. Is it cattle bread with Japanese strains? Yes. Is it superior to Prime beef? Yes!
  • Wagyu beef is NOT a scam. One guy posts the same "Scam" article from a newspaper writer and everone buys in. Do your own research. Is Wagyu Kobe beef? No. Is it cattle bread with Japanese strains? Yes. Is it superior to Prime beef? Yes!



    Well, if The Naked Whiz is the "some guy" and the New York Times is "a newspaper writer" you are referring to, I'll stand by them. As far as my own research goes, I owned a premium meat counter for several years and know the meat industry and how they market pretty well. There is no gurantee that wagyu is any different than any other type of beef. I've seen some awesome beef called wagyu, but the fact that they call it wagyu means nothing. Now, if you want to take awesome beef with some % of japanese strain and market it that way, fine. But Waygyu can be less than 1% japanese strain and 99% anything else and fed and slaughtered along side every other cow on the line and Vioila! There's your wagyu. Having small amounts of Japanese strain does not make beef superior to any other. Hand selecting the beef with the best marbling and then marketing it to get the most money for it is what it's all about (which I am totally OK with).



  • hornhonkhornhonk Posts: 3,834
    I didn't want to use names, I'm nice that way. I get my Wagyu from a reputable source, Strube Ranch in Pittsburgh, Texas, to be exact. Check them out. Now, as to you being a meat purveyor, I can understand your point of view. However a difference of opinion on a cut or style doen't constitute a "scam".
  • boatbumboatbum Posts: 1,273

    OK, just to clarify - my understanding was the special nature of Kobe beef was the process and manner in which calves were fed, contained within the stalls, etc -- its not the breed that makes it so wonderful.

    Am I missing something?

    Kinda like the Angus marketing thing -- there are people who really think Angus is a better "level" of beef - just because of the breed.   Not wanting to take anything away from the Black Angus association - has been an excellent branding and marketing campaign. 

     

    Cookin in Texas
  • I'm w/ Boatbum - I thought the beef was hand-selected, culled from a specific lineage, bred & raised from birth till slaughter by the same farmer, tended to like he was the cow's personal assistant (massaged, fed, etc), and ensured the highest quality.  And that "Kobe" is just a city in Japan where this occurs (sort of like "Champagne" being a city in France, and the ONLY place where the "bubbly" can legally be called "champagne"

    Anything other than that & it cannot be called "kobe" from "Kobe"


    :P
    Don't get set into one form, adapt it and build your own, and let it grow, be like water. Empty your mind, be formless, shapeless — like water. Now you put water in a cup, it becomes the cup... Now water can flow or it can crash. Be water, my friend. - Bruce Lee
  • Yes but Wagyu just means Japanese beef. Remember the Alamo
  • I didn't want to use names, I'm nice that way. I get my Wagyu from a reputable source, Strube Ranch in Pittsburgh, Texas, to be exact. Check them out. Now, as to you being a meat purveyor, I can understand your point of view. However a difference of opinion on a cut or style doen't constitute a "scam".



    Im all for boutique preveyors of meat (or anything else for that matter) and I know there are reputable people out there doing this. I was speaking of the meat indusry as a whole and the way they use words like Kobe and Wagyu to dupe people into thinking they are getting something they are not. I don't think most peole would be thriilled to know their $80 Wagyu steak came from a cow in Iowa that was some angus crossbreed with a tiny bit of "Wagyu" (which can be any of dozens of "japanese" strains of cattle) . It's way more common than your guy in Pittsburg who is doing it right and providing superior quality beef. I will say this though, I'll bet you anything even his cows have very little japanese lineage and are mostly Angus or another breed that suits american palettes. I'm sure it's high quality and well marbled etc but calling it "wagyu" is simply marketing. You are not getting some rare japanese breed of super beef in Texas (or anywhere else in the US for that matter).

    I just looked up their website and they ship their cows off to Iowa feedlots to finish in an "all natural, low stress environment" Have you ever been to an Iowa feed lot? I have. There is nothing natural or "low stress" about them. I don't think a 3 day truck ride from TX to Iowa in sweltering heat or freezing cold , a** to mouth with 50 other cows is what I would call "low stress" :)) This is exactly what I'm talking about. It's all marketing (and I would do the same thing if I were them). These are very well marbled cows but the furthest thing from "japanese" beef you will ever find. The word Wagyu is totally unregulated and can be anything. I'm sure their beef is great, but it's just really good beef.

  • The Naked WhizThe Naked Whiz Posts: 7,779
    edited June 2012
    I think the bottom line to take away from that series of articles (it was Forbes magazine, as I recall) was if somebody calls their beef "Kobe", they are lying.  If they call it "American style kobe" then they are not lying, but you have to do your homework and determine whether or not they are producing superior beef. As for Wagyu, the term is meaningless, so don't buy something simply because it says Wagyu.  Again, do your homework and if the producer is truly producing superior beef, then go for it.  But the name Wagyu is not a guarantee.  I think I also recall that the article stated that there are no USDA rules/standards/regulations for who can call their beef Wagyu or American style Kobe. 
    The Naked Whiz
  • boatbumboatbum Posts: 1,273

    I went to Wiki -

    Kobe beef (神戸ビーフ Kōbe bīfu?) refers to cuts of beef from the black Tajima-ushi breed of Wagyū cattle, raised according to strict tradition in Hyōgo Prefecture, Japan

    My belief is the result is more a factor of the "raised according to strict tradition" than it is the breed.   It's the manner in which the beef is raised, fed, standing in a stall.  

    "distinctive feeding techniques"  (source: wiki )

     

     

    Cookin in Texas
  • I don't know why I'm feeling so fiesty today. I love great beef as much as anyone else and the guys at Strube anre known for it. I did all the same stuff when I had my meat market so I don't have a leg to stand on :)


  • Howdy_DoodyHowdy_Doody Posts: 146
    edited June 2012
    Whatever happened to Select, Choice, and Prime?  Works for me. 


    8-}

    It's been said that if Ansel Adams was given an Instamatic Camera, he would take museum quality pictures and outdo 99.99999% of those with expensive cameras.  In other words, it's not the equipment as much as it's the artistry.  I think someone with a good cut of meat, properly prepared and cooked and pleasantly presented will fare far better than someone with a pedigree cut of meat, per se.

    In 1997, Chris Freymuller won the International Beef Cooking Contest with Pacific Rim Flank Steak, beating out those with ribeyes, porterhouse, Kobe, etc.   (Look it up)
  • lousubcaplousubcap Posts: 5,353
    @ Cen-Tex-try the new Woodford-"Double Oaked".  Will get you to the finish-line twice as fast and perhaps mellow this thread-but once you get outside the choices described by Howdy Doody you are in a whole 'nother game!
    Louisville
  • DuganboyDuganboy Posts: 1,118
    @ Cen-Tex-try the new Woodford-"Double Oaked".  Will get you to the finish-line twice as fast and perhaps mellow this thread-but once you get outside the choices described by Howdy Doody you are in a whole 'nother game!
    @lousubcap great move.  Get CT talking about bourbon and he will forget all about some old cow.  Man likes his beef, but he has his priorities.  Kentucky Bourbon.
  • Thanks Cap. Appolgies to all offended for for my meat rant. Double Oaked it is.

    CenTex Out


  • noid1037noid1037 Posts: 33

    IM kinda new to the Egghead Forum here and dont want to be an outcast... I know you guys know your stuff.  This topic got me up though, I have had Waygu/Kobe in many various locations and bought it to cook myself in various places....San Diego, Tampa, OKC, Chicago, you get the picture  If it really is Kobe beef, then yes it really is that much better.  But unfortunately some places  either meat counters/butchers or restaurants label it as Kobe and it isnt.  When I lived in Tampa, FL many times a restaurant would serve something that was not as it supposed to be. They would sell a whitefish and it would be cod or sell scallops and they werent scallops- I wont get into what they were selling... hence lots of genetic testing is done now on seafood. Its a great way to make profit.  I dont know if buying a brisket Waygu is going to really be that much better.  Kobe/Waygu is really a premium steak beef, ie Filet, Sirloin, etc type of meat..  The fat content wont be remarkably different in Wagyu to Prime.. how do I know I..I can get a good look at a T-bone by sticking my head up a bull's ass, but I'd rather take a butcher's word for it.

    My family has several meat packing houses in the Midwest... they know about meat....Just be very careful with buying meat from someone... they could be selling a prime cut as Waygu etc.. Know your butcher or meat source!  But real Waygu-Kobe is much better than Prime cut.  I have had it many times and it really does melt, you dont have to chew it.  Its really that good.

    BGE Large... Go get 'em! "Cant means you haven't tried."

    Tulsa, OK

  • thetrimthetrim Posts: 824
    edited June 2012
    This whole thread started by someone who's been watching too many episodes of "BBQ Pitmasters" and listened to that windbag, Myron Mixon too damn many times!!!
    =======================================
    XL 6/06, Mini 6/12, L 10/12
    Tampa Bay, FL
  • boatbumboatbum Posts: 1,273

    ok, so what I wonder about is Kobe Hot Dogs.   Was at resturant in Florida a while back, they had Kobe Beef Hot dog on the menu - yep the meat tube on a bun thing.   $27.   

    OK, I totally agree Kobe is a superior tender beef ( for whatever reason) - but I don't think through out my life I have ever had a hot dog that I thought just was not tender enough.   Have had some chewy steaks, ribs that were glued to the bone, brisket that was tough...    but even the oscar meyer ball park franks have always been pretty tender.

    What makes someone dream up Kobe Hot Dogs --- and no - I didn't order one.

     

    Cookin in Texas
  • thetrimthetrim Posts: 824
    edited June 2012
    Capitalism.  Hooah!!!
    =======================================
    XL 6/06, Mini 6/12, L 10/12
    Tampa Bay, FL
  • LitLit Posts: 2,965

    Snake river farms has good meat as mentioned above. A store by my house carries their meat and I buy a steak or some cut lets every once in a while to throw on teh salt block. At $34.99 a pound its pretty expensive but man is it good. I have never seen marbling like this in any butcher.

    image

  • Lit - I think that's part of the point of the discussion, is that, in the US, there really is no law dictating what is "Kobe" or not. 

    So for them to put on their packaging "American Style Kobe Beef" - that really doesn't mean ANYTHING. 

    It's similar to how herbal-supplement manufacturers can play fast & loose w/ some of their "claims" of health benefits. 
    Don't get set into one form, adapt it and build your own, and let it grow, be like water. Empty your mind, be formless, shapeless — like water. Now you put water in a cup, it becomes the cup... Now water can flow or it can crash. Be water, my friend. - Bruce Lee
  • And be careful when buying bath salts, too.

    A muslim, a socialist and an illegal immigrant walk into a bar 

    Blogging: Never before have so many with so little to say said so much to so few.

  • IM kinda new to the Egghead Forum here and dont want to be an outcast... I know you guys know your stuff.  This topic got me up though, I have had Waygu/Kobe in many various locations and bought it to cook myself in various places....San Diego, Tampa, OKC, Chicago, you get the picture  If it really is Kobe beef, then yes it really is that much better.  But unfortunately some places  either meat counters/butchers or restaurants label it as Kobe and it isnt.  When I lived in Tampa, FL many times a restaurant would serve something that was not as it supposed to be. They would sell a whitefish and it would be cod or sell scallops and they werent scallops- I wont get into what they were selling... hence lots of genetic testing is done now on seafood. Its a great way to make profit.  I dont know if buying a brisket Waygu is going to really be that much better.  Kobe/Waygu is really a premium steak beef, ie Filet, Sirloin, etc type of meat..  The fat content wont be remarkably different in Wagyu to Prime.. how do I know I..I can get a good look at a T-bone by sticking my head up a bull's @#!*% , but I'd rather take a butcher's word for it.

    My family has several meat packing houses in the Midwest... they know about meat....Just be very careful with buying meat from someone... they could be selling a prime cut as Waygu etc.. Know your butcher or meat source!  But real Waygu-Kobe is much better than Prime cut.  I have had it many times and it really does melt, you dont have to chew it.  Its really that good.

    You'll never be an outcast here so no worries. 

    Not to crank things up again, but nobody has ever had Kobe Beef in the US.  It is not even legal to export Kobe beef to the US and it never has been. Wagyu just means Japanese cattle so we've all probably had some Wagyu at some time or another.The word Kobe in the US is a marketing name only and is completely inaccurate when it comes to the actual product.



  • Lit - I think that's part of the point of the discussion, is that, in the US, there really is no law dictating what is "Kobe" or not. 

    So for them to put on their packaging "American Style Kobe Beef" - that really doesn't mean ANYTHING. 

    It's similar to how herbal-supplement manufacturers can play fast & loose w/ some of their "claims" of health benefits. 
    Correct. It looks awesome and i'm sure it is, but they aren't getting $35 per lb for it without calling it something fancy (in this case "Kobe") there is no such thing as American Style Kobe. It's a label. Great looking steak though.



  • boatbumboatbum Posts: 1,273
    My new Profile Pic --- Yes -- its a Kobe Dog Boat.....
    Cookin in Texas
  • My new Profile Pic --- Yes -- its a Kobe Dog Boat.....
    Freaking awesome. All it needs is a little mustard :))



  • doubledouble Posts: 1,214
    I think I need to add a drunken discussion with Cen-tex on my bucket list
    Lynnwood WA
  • I think I need to add a drunken discussion with Cen-tex on my bucket list
    God help you. I get pretty smart when I'm drunk :))



  • rsmith193rsmith193 Posts: 219
    We use Wagyu during our competitions, and the reason for that is simple. There is better marbling in the Wagyu, than in Angus. There is a reason why so many competition BBQ teams are using this meat. If it wasn't a better quality it wouldn't be used. I will tell you if the quality isn't there no one would pay the difference for the amout the average event pays out. Now if you are just cooking for family and friends, then I will agree, Sam's Club is the best place to get a brisket, not just for the price but taste for the average person.
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