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Let's have some fun. 40-140 deg. 4 hour

Mike in AbitaMike in Abita Posts: 3,302
edited 6:10PM in EggHead Forum
Would it be safe to say that the 40-140 degree rule applies to surface temp of the roast your cooking. Or is this internal temp as well.

Comments

  • Celtic WolfCeltic Wolf Posts: 9,773
    Mike this subject has been beaten to death, but what the hey.

    It refers to the surface temp as long as the meat is not ground. If ground, it refers to all of the meat.

    Also keep in mind this refers to the Cooking Process. Cooling is different.
  • fishlessmanfishlessman Posts: 20,276
    it really is the pit temp or environment that its in, not the meat temp, ie, you cant cook a porkbutt on the countertop in your kitchen with a big hot solderiing iron stuck in it and feel safe after it gets up to temp
  • Actually, anything that would introduce bacteria to the interior of the meat is of concern. A boneless butt, the temp probe being inserted, etc.
    The Naked Whiz
  • stikestike Posts: 15,597
    the worst place to go for this info is an internet forum. check the FDA and rather than read the rules, read the logic BEHIND the rules.

    this is a very complicated thing.
    ed egli avea del cul fatto trombetta -Dante
  • stikestike Posts: 15,597
    i remember when you didn't always agree with that position....

    :whistle:

    hahaha
    ed egli avea del cul fatto trombetta -Dante
  • stikestike Posts: 15,597
    yep. but it's all relative. the danger from de-boning is far greater than from introducing a temp probe.

    for other foods, like fish (and chicken i believe), VIRUSES can be found IN the meat, and they have their own temps ranges.

    mike's asking a really general question, looking for a specific answer.
    ed egli avea del cul fatto trombetta -Dante
  • fishlessmanfishlessman Posts: 20,276
    something that you dont see much but is part of my routine for boneless butts is to start with a higher dome temp. at 250 the average butt wont reach 140 in 4 hours and with the boneless butt you have exposed meat not sitting in a 140 degree environment because its folded under. if you jack the initial temps up higher than 275 the internals hit 140 close to the 4 hours which is how i start those cooks. dont know how much safer it is but it makes me feel better to see the internal temps up in a boneless butt. starting with higher temps, then dropping them down as the cook progresses and then finishing them at a higher temp again doesnt seem to affect the cook much anyways
  • fishlessmanfishlessman Posts: 20,276
    check my post below, i still play it safeer in certian situations. and no stike, my soldering iron wont cook a pork butt and neither will your curling iron
  • stikestike Posts: 15,597
    it's my wife's curling iron... i only borrow it.

    you said you liked the nice tight curls...

    hahahaha

    you knob.

    whatchoo talkinabout "soldering irons and curling irons"
    ed egli avea del cul fatto trombetta -Dante
  • While we're on the subjects of heat and bacteria I'd like to pose a question.

    If I understand the process of microwaving food (or even water for that matter), the microwaves actually penetrate the individual molecules and give off heat in the process. The heat is evenly distributed within the molecule and then is accumulative when more than one molecule is involved.

    If you place one molecule of substance inside a microwave oven and microwave it, the time to eradicate the bacteria in that one molecule should be near instantaneous. So why does it take longer to do two molecules or a million for that matter?

    What I'm asking is it possible to microwave a piece of meat for a second or two to pop the bacteria molecules without the accumulative effect of heat and then place the meat on the Egg for a bacteria-free cook?

    By the way, I think I already know the answer but I have been wrong twice in my life and don't want to go through that humbling experience ever again.

    Spring "Inquiring Gray Matter Wants To Know" Chicken
    Spring Texas USA
  • Celtic WolfCeltic Wolf Posts: 9,773
    Actually the Feds are testing the possibility of radiating meats to make them safer.

    The major problem with microwaves is they cook from the INSIDE out. So those few seconds would not generate enough heat to kill off the surface bugs anyway.

    Ever try to cook a pork roast in a Microwave. Not pretty to eat...
  • stikestike Posts: 15,597
    microwaves excite the water only.

    they don't do it all at once, otherwise the food would be cooked all at once, since it takes 140 to "kill off" the bacteria.

    otherwise, after a second on high, the food would be at 140. since it can't do that, it doesn't kill the bacteria instantaneously either.
    ed egli avea del cul fatto trombetta -Dante
  • stikestike Posts: 15,597
    oh boy.
    don't tell me you fall for the microwave "cooks from the inside" myth now, do you?
    ed egli avea del cul fatto trombetta -Dante
  • FidelFidel Posts: 10,172
    Microwaves work by exciting the atoms in water, fats, and sugar, causing atomic agitation - i.e. vibration - and this atomic vibration causes heat, which therefore cooks the food.

    The heat would still need to be generated to a point that would kill any bacteria present. The radiation itself does not kill the bacteria. I don't think that the bacteria would "pop". If so it would be quite easy for all food processors to quickly zap every product with the microwaves, effectively sterilizing the product prior to shipment.
  • FidelFidel Posts: 10,172
    Microwaves heat substances at a rate that is proportional to the moisture content. The wetter area gets hotter, faster.
  • Take a pound of hamburger and form it into a sphere. Freeze said sphere. Take said frozen sphere and microwave it. The meat on the outside will warm first and you will be left with a hard frozen core in the center. I have defrosted enough hamburger during my bachelor days to know this is true. Of course, now that I am married to the wife (yes, the wife who...), we only eat steak. :-)
    The Naked Whiz
  • stikestike Posts: 15,597
    yep.

    but the common idea that food will be cooked from the inside out is incorrect. if the moisture content is even throughout, the cooking will be too. if the popular myth were true, you could create a pocket of water inside an ice cube. like most myths, there's n element of truth. that's why they stick around.

    (what's with you today, playing the part of "gruff-but-loveable Gus" on the ABC afterschool special "Why is Mr.Nussbaum Always Angry?") :whistle:
    ed egli avea del cul fatto trombetta -Dante
  • FidelFidel Posts: 10,172
    Not necessarily true. If the food being heated is of uniform consistency it will heat from the outside in. The energy will be absorbed more quickly by the outer portions of the food, and less radiation will reach the interior portions.

    It's Thursday, I get grumpier as the week rolls on.
  • fishlessmanfishlessman Posts: 20,276
    i can see your reasoning for the steak, dont want anyone reaching in to get a cellphone then forming patties
  • stikestike Posts: 15,597
    that's my point, man. food doesn't cook from the inside out.....
    ed egli avea del cul fatto trombetta -Dante
  • Thanks for the replies. Once I'm back in civilization, I'll post a few more questions about this. Broadband is really slow for some reason.
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